25p to 24p

S

sharry

Well-known member
Hey all. I have searched this topic (25p to 24p) everywhere and found a lot of things. However, they were at least 2 years old. Things have change considerably. I will tell you my dilemma. I am in Pakistan. This is PAL land. For TV we shoot 25p. But for cinema we shoot 24p. We do not shoot 23.978p as its NTSC standard. However, there are very few cameras that give you true 24p like the Red and Alexa. All the dslrs and sony F3s, Canon C300s they have 23.978 for 24p. So, if I am shooting a short film or an indie film say on my D7100. It does not have true 24p. Wouldnt it be better to shoot 25p and conform to 24p in post? What would you guys say?
 
Most digital cinema servers have no problem playing 25p and it is very hard to see any difference in cadence between 24p and 25p. You can probably just shoot in 25p and deliver a 25p dcp for cinema screenings. The same is true for 23.978 btw.
Also, c300 can do true 24p.
 
You don't have to go all the way up to an Alexa or even RED for 24P. All of my VariCam's(tape and P2), C300 and F55 are capable of true 24.00P. Of course, here in the US, unless you're doing a "film out", we're usually shooting 23.98P.
 
If I were in your shoes, I would shoot 23.976 (assuming true 24p isn't available), conform all your dailies to 24p, cut it, grade, and finish in 24p. then if the need arises, drop that final master into a 25p timeline and re-export if you ever have to deliver for broadcast. it's much easier to go to a higher framerate than it is to go to a lower one.
 
Zak Forsman said:
If I were in your shoes, I would shoot 23.976 (assuming true 24p isn't available), conform all your dailies to 24p, cut it, grade, and finish in 24p. then if the need arises, drop that final master into a 25p timeline and re-export if you ever have to deliver for broadcast. it's much easier to go to a higher framerate than it is to go to a lower one.
Click to expand...

What makes it easier to go to higher framerate?
 
it's more seamless to add frames per second than it is to take them away. the typical method of going from 25p to 24p would be like putting a 1-frame jumpcut every second throughout the piece. a better method would be to retime the file to play at the new framerate, but then you must also apply a 4% speed change to audio, as well as a pitch shift so it sounds normal.
 
I read somewhere that DCP servers dont take 23.976. They only take 24p. That is the primary reason why I had this question. I guess I should read the specs of DCP clearly. Didnt know that C300 had true 24p.
 
Here's the deal with DCP specs. If your DCP is 24fps, in either 1.85:1 Flat or 2.39:1 Scope, unencrypted with at least a LCR mix, it will be compatible on any cinema server. once you start to deviate into other frame rates, or with a 16x9 frame, or even a stereo mix, you raise the risk of coming across a server that won't be able to play it properly. That being said, most venues keep their server up to date and are capable of playing DCPs with non-standard (aka DCI compliant) specs.

I've made more than 80 DCPs over the years and anytime a client has, for example a 29.97 framerate, we always contact the venue to make sure they will be able to play it. most of the masters I receive are 23.976 and all of them go thru a seamless conversation to true 24fps.
 
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