24PA pulldown in premiere? WHAT AM I DOING WRONG!?!
- Thread starter FatBird19
- Start date
khmuse
Tech Guru
There are a number of things that can cause this to occur, including:
Material is not 24PA in nature.
Cadence detection has failed due to a break in the time code.
Time line is not correctly set to 23.976.
By the way, interlaced and "jittery motion" may not be describing the same thing. You can have perfectly handled 24p footage that will be very jittery based upon how it was shot. Too fast of camera moves will yield a stutter to the image which might be misinterpreted as an interlaced artifact.
Post a frame grab and it will be easy to identify if it is interlaced or poorly shot.
Material is not 24PA in nature.
Cadence detection has failed due to a break in the time code.
Time line is not correctly set to 23.976.
By the way, interlaced and "jittery motion" may not be describing the same thing. You can have perfectly handled 24p footage that will be very jittery based upon how it was shot. Too fast of camera moves will yield a stutter to the image which might be misinterpreted as an interlaced artifact.
Post a frame grab and it will be easy to identify if it is interlaced or poorly shot.
khmuse said:
I shot it in 24PA. and the camera was on a tripod. believe me it was quite jittery.
I think the Cadence detection has failed. It looks like premiere is deleting the wrong frame. The cadance goes; normal frame, interlaced, normal frame, skip frame, then it restarts that sequence.
How am I supposed to shoot in 24 if the cadance detection is not reliable?
khmuse
Tech Guru
Based upon your comments, I am assuming that it is likely that time code breaks are the problem.
A number of questions come to mind.
1) Is this the first footage captured from this camera / NLE combination?
2) Do you prestripe your tapes?
3) Do you review footage while shooting?
4) Do you use scene detect when capturing?
It is my guess that not every take on the tape is interlaced. If this is the case, and more specifically if it is takes past a certain point on the tape that exhibit the problem, then this reinforces the assumption of time code breaks.
Post your replies to the above questions and I'll respond with more comments.
A number of questions come to mind.
1) Is this the first footage captured from this camera / NLE combination?
2) Do you prestripe your tapes?
3) Do you review footage while shooting?
4) Do you use scene detect when capturing?
It is my guess that not every take on the tape is interlaced. If this is the case, and more specifically if it is takes past a certain point on the tape that exhibit the problem, then this reinforces the assumption of time code breaks.
Post your replies to the above questions and I'll respond with more comments.
FilmMagic
Active member
FatBird,
I've been in so many forums talking about this and what it appears like, is that Premiere 1.5 really doesn't do that great of a job in handling 24p. I had to stop using it because everything I tried turned out bad. I wish you luck and please let me know if there is success.
I've been in so many forums talking about this and what it appears like, is that Premiere 1.5 really doesn't do that great of a job in handling 24p. I had to stop using it because everything I tried turned out bad. I wish you luck and please let me know if there is success.
khmuse
Tech Guru
OK, now we are getting somewhere. You are certain that this was shoot 24pa and this is your first time. Did you notice if any of the footage was being properly handled or is the entire tape a problem? I am assuming that this tape is comprised of a number of takes and not just a single continuous scene.
As for pre-striping your tapes. It really rather easy. Just start with an unused tape, put it in the camera with the audio level controls set to minimum and the lens cap on and/or the shutter closed. Just start to record at the head of the tape and let it roll out to the end. Now rewind the tape and its ready to use. The reason for doing this is to ensure that the tape has continuous timecode.
Now, the comment about reviewing footage in camera when shooting is that if you are not careful (or you don't have a pre-striped tape) you can end up shooting on top of another take and this can be a problem (even if it is just one frame). If you feel the need to review footage in camera, then the safeset thing to do is make sure you are always at a new section (all black frames from your prestripe) before starting to record a new take. If you have someone doing the task of a script supervisor then just have them give you the last out timecode point and make certain you are past it (a second will do) before you go back to camera mode and start shooting again.
I am assuming that the tape that you tried, since it was a first tape, isn't critical footage. So, just stripe a tape, use the techniques I have outlined and try a bit of footage into Premiere Pro. I and many other users use this program all the time without any problems. You can get the occasional scene that isn't being handled properly, but all that is necessary is to recapture that section.
Post your results and lets see if we can get you going.
As for pre-striping your tapes. It really rather easy. Just start with an unused tape, put it in the camera with the audio level controls set to minimum and the lens cap on and/or the shutter closed. Just start to record at the head of the tape and let it roll out to the end. Now rewind the tape and its ready to use. The reason for doing this is to ensure that the tape has continuous timecode.
Now, the comment about reviewing footage in camera when shooting is that if you are not careful (or you don't have a pre-striped tape) you can end up shooting on top of another take and this can be a problem (even if it is just one frame). If you feel the need to review footage in camera, then the safeset thing to do is make sure you are always at a new section (all black frames from your prestripe) before starting to record a new take. If you have someone doing the task of a script supervisor then just have them give you the last out timecode point and make certain you are past it (a second will do) before you go back to camera mode and start shooting again.
I am assuming that the tape that you tried, since it was a first tape, isn't critical footage. So, just stripe a tape, use the techniques I have outlined and try a bit of footage into Premiere Pro. I and many other users use this program all the time without any problems. You can get the occasional scene that isn't being handled properly, but all that is necessary is to recapture that section.
Post your results and lets see if we can get you going.
Log and batch capture each of the TAKES you want to use in the project - that will eliminate any cadence detection problems. Additional benefits of this include becoming familiar with your footage prior to editing and not capturing and wasting disc space on crap you won't use anyway.
.. you HAVE to use scene detection when capturing your tape.. this will automatically break up the tape into each shot.. when shooting with the DVX100 each shot starts a new 24p cadance.. which does not usually line up in continuince with the previous shots 24p cadance.. PPRO looks at only the first few frames of EACH CLIP and determines the cadance to perform proper pulldown with if you dont have each shot on the tape be its own clip.. then PPRO just applies the right pulldown cadance for the first shot in the clip and applies it through the entire clip.. and again the cadance will vary for each shot on the tape becaus ethe camera starts it over instead of continuing where it left off from the last shot.. so to reitterate.. YOU HAVE TO USE SCENE DETECTION.. unless you manually capture each shot seperately.. which is a waste of time IMHO cause you can set it and forget it and simply delete bad takes later.. juse use scene detection and it will all be fine.
Some of the scenes in my project were stubbornly refusing to remain in 24pa. I would capture them and they would be fine, but my workflow was to put that capture in a new sequence, add some audio tracks, then re-render to a new file... and that new file sometimes would be interlaced even though all the settings appeared to be correct for 24pa.
My way around the problem has been to render to a filmstrip file, then bring THAT in to a new sequence and render again to an AVI. The result finally is 24pa.
My way around the problem has been to render to a filmstrip file, then bring THAT in to a new sequence and render again to an AVI. The result finally is 24pa.