2:35:1 or 1:85:1

From what I can find, it seems the 2.39:1 is a SMPTE standard, which of course is for camera/projection aperture, not optical recording aspect. Perhaps that is the issue. None-the-less, we don't discuss Panavision spherical S35 with an anamorphic extraction as being 1.85:1... we still call it 2.39. So people shooting HD, such as those on this site, who are extracting 'anamorphic'** images from that 16:9 should refer to the presentation ratio correctly, which by US standards would be 2.39.

Everyone is free to use their own aspect ratio... for example I could make a movie and use 2.55 like one of the 1950's epic widescreen formats... I could make a movie that is 2.20:1 or 2.6:1 or even 3:1. But if you are trying to make your film like today's widescreen formats and are doing things by standardized aspects... (which helps professionals pass things along workflows and for theaters to playback)... 2.39 is the accurate ratio and term. It's not much different from 2.35:1... in fact, when extracting from an HD 16:9 image, it's a handfull of pixels! (not a technical term, mind you, :) )

So I guess I don't give a hoot if Arri used to shoot 2.30, 2.35, 2.39, or a billion to 1. Point is, SMPTE passed a motion to change 2.35:1 to 2.39:1.... 40 years ago... Richard Nixon was President. So to have young people today still saying 2.35:1 is something I just never understand, although I did it until I read my first AC manual and found out otherwise when I was in college. In fact, I originally responded to this thread four years ago, and used the terminology 2.35:1! So it's not like I am decending down with my sword of knowledge to collect heads, but infact, I used to do the same, and I am trying to irradicate the misconception.

2.39:1 seems to be the standard of what the final aspect ratio is for presentation... not what you captured it on. This makes sense considering many films are shot spherical (1.85:1) with Anamorphic extraction, or for indie world on a RedOne or HD camera using the crop method (2:1, 16:9) to get down to a 2.39:1. Even cameras like the Arri D-21 using Mscope (2.40 finish) shoots over the 2:40 aspect at 2.66 and then samples down/crops to 2.40. That's their way of getting a good 2.40 image. So it's not what you start with but what you end with. Standards say you end with 2.39:1 for 'scope or 'anamorphic' widescreen. We call it 2.39:1 or 2.40 for short.

** the term 'anamorphic' is also a borderline misused term. Anamorphic is a process of which an image is squeezed and unsqueezed for a greater presentation. According to Wikipedia, it's from the greek word for 'formed again'. So anything can technically be anamorphic... such as the DVX100 squeeze mode to fit 16:9 on 4:3 imager. The fact is anamorphic became a big term in the 1950's era because of all the different anamorphic processes making the really large and exciting aspect ratios... and it has since been used to describe what we consider the standard in wide screen presentation... which was at one point 2.35 but is now 2.39... otherwise referred to as 2.40.

 
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2.35:1, 2.40:1, 2.50:1 are all very beautiful. It really comes down to what are you trying to show visually... for instance:

Your movie is taking place in the mountains or constantly around buildings and the action is happening within these tall structures or masses... then you might want to shoot 1.85:1 for the "height". If you are shooting a more epic piece where their are wide vista shots, beautiful wide angle frames, and wide open spaces, you want 2.35:1 or wider.

Personally I push everything towards 2.35 because its what I'm comfortable with. My eye just composes that way. 1.85 is just too TV for me. I have to say though, the true masters like Roger Deakins are so good at what they do, the aspect doesn't seem to effect anything. Roger shoots in 1.85 and you would never second guess any of it. Then again, he is also one of the best cinematographers in the world so he can pretty much shoot 4/3 and light and take our minds to another world regardless.

for me 2.35:1 all the way. I have to say though there is another question I would love to throw in here for the real film and cinema buffs like me:

2.35:1 anamorphic or crop?

Personally I love them both, but anamorphic has a special feel to it that just brings a whole different world to you. I can always tell between the crop or the anamorphic, even if theres no flairs. It comes down to the fact that the unstretched visual is never PERFECTLY unstretched so theres a slight bit of something a little off which helps suspend reality a little bit more. The dof is different too.

Lately its all been crop for me though with the use of all digital systems with 16/9 chips. But I would love to hear what others like on that topic.
 
for me 2.35:1 all the way.



2.35:1 anamorphic or crop?

Personally I love them both, but anamorphic has a special feel to it that just brings a whole different world to you. I can always tell between the crop or the anamorphic, even if theres no flairs. It comes down to the fact that the unstretched visual is never PERFECTLY unstretched so theres a slight bit of something a little off which helps suspend reality a little bit more. The dof is different too.

Lately its all been crop for me though with the use of all digital systems with 16/9 chips. But I would love to hear what others like on that topic.

You are right. Despite flairs, anamorphic can have oval shaped bokeh/CoC. They typically display a curved DoF when shot open, and etc. You can tell, however, many very new anamorphics are so well made, even with flares it becomes hard to tell. The lens coatings and lens design are just that good.

Good news for you regarding the 1.85:1 and 16:9 imagers... Vantage makes some pricey Hawk anamorphics with 1.3x squeeze. This is for getting that 2.39/2.40 image on a 1.85:1 film camera or 16:9 HD imager... thus you don't need a 4:3 sensor with a 2:1 anamorphic lens.

Check them out here: www.vantagefilm.com/en/news/index_46.shtml
Additional materials: HERE and HERE

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This is mainly for academy film at 1.85:1... as (1.85 X 1.3= 2.4)
16x9 imagers would be around 2.30 with the Hawks... requiring a slight top-bottom crop of just a bit. A world of difference from a crop factor of [1.78 -> 2.39].

I'd rather crop [2.30 -> 2.39/2.40] versus [1.78 -> 2.39/2.40]

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