Hey guys, after doing a little bit of everything in each department, I've decided to pursue sound as my focus. Do you guys recommend that I just try to learn a SD 744T. I'm going to be renting it until I can get enough pay to buy one. I know that it all depends on my needs but what I have been told is that the 744t is the industry standard in sound gear, but seems like a steep learning curve for a newbie. I figured It would be most beneficial to rent the best gear and learn seeing that lot of advice here is " if you can afford it, get the more expensive one" especially with sound. Cant wait to grab my first gig and post it here !
+1 to the sound commnunity
- Thread starter felixlee
- Start date
The 744i may be an industry standard as a mixer, but a mixer is not the most critical tool to learn how to use when working with location sound. First and foremost is the shotgun microphone. Gain experience using shotgun with various patterns of pickup so you'll know which to grab for a given situation. Learn the nuances of micing with a shotfgun. Do you point it at the actor's mouth, chin, or chest. Then migrate to lav mic selection and placement. Which lav mic delivers what you need in a particular environment?
A mixer will only mix what it's being fed. Shotguns held 4 ft from the source or not pointed accurately to find the sweet spot (as discovered by monitoring) will produce poor results, and it doesn't matter how well you can operate a mixer, it won't fix that.
Start with the source, the microphone, and the environments it's used in. Learn to control elements you can, and compensate for elements you can't control.
I've done quite a bit of film work without needing a mixer at all. Haven't done one yet that didn't need a microphone and a person who knew how to properly deploy it.
A mixer will only mix what it's being fed. Shotguns held 4 ft from the source or not pointed accurately to find the sweet spot (as discovered by monitoring) will produce poor results, and it doesn't matter how well you can operate a mixer, it won't fix that.
Start with the source, the microphone, and the environments it's used in. Learn to control elements you can, and compensate for elements you can't control.
I've done quite a bit of film work without needing a mixer at all. Haven't done one yet that didn't need a microphone and a person who knew how to properly deploy it.
JordanBlock
Well-known member
The 744 is a recorder, not a mixer, but as gpforet says, start with the fundamentals. Check out the stickies if you haven't already, and look at picking up the sound dvd on sale in the marketplace. All the gear in the world wont help if you don't know the fundamentals.
Yes I meant the recorder, and definitely stickies are my bible atm and reading material. I agreee knowing how to use gear is the most important than having the gear itself!
Yes, I do own a me66 as well as a G2, so Im glad you've reinforced the direction im going thanks!
felix,
how are you monitoring your boom and lav?
I, too am running a boom shotgun (ME-80), and recently a senn G2 lav. My bag contains a Tascam DR-100. I feed the shotgun to one channel, and the lav to the other channel, plug in my in-ears, and can clearly hear what the shotgun is doing in my left ear, and what the lav is doing in my right ear. If needed, I send a stereo line out to the camera but typically use the camera mic as scratch audio for sync later.
how are you monitoring your boom and lav?
I, too am running a boom shotgun (ME-80), and recently a senn G2 lav. My bag contains a Tascam DR-100. I feed the shotgun to one channel, and the lav to the other channel, plug in my in-ears, and can clearly hear what the shotgun is doing in my left ear, and what the lav is doing in my right ear. If needed, I send a stereo line out to the camera but typically use the camera mic as scratch audio for sync later.
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
Felix,
I think that it would be great to learn how to use a 744T, but you could probably get more use out of investing in different gear. If you could get a 4 or 5 channel mixer (like the Sound Devices 442 or 552), a good breakaway cable for the mixer, more good wireless systems and better lav mics (like Sanken COS-11's) then you would get more mileage out of your money.
The Sound Devices 700 series recorders do sound noticably better than the $150 portable recorders you can get today, but personally, I wouldn't buy a 4 channel audio recorder with timecode until I needed it.
I think that it would be great to learn how to use a 744T, but you could probably get more use out of investing in different gear. If you could get a 4 or 5 channel mixer (like the Sound Devices 442 or 552), a good breakaway cable for the mixer, more good wireless systems and better lav mics (like Sanken COS-11's) then you would get more mileage out of your money.
The Sound Devices 700 series recorders do sound noticably better than the $150 portable recorders you can get today, but personally, I wouldn't buy a 4 channel audio recorder with timecode until I needed it.
I'm not buying any more gear. 1st sticky pledge. unless its an awesome indoor mic. I was planning on renting the 744t probably 50 times for gigs before i actually bought one. As for the wireless systems, are the G2's not that great?? I keep hearing countrymen b6's are gods gift from heaven.
The first feature i ever worked on as a PA, our sound guy had a smart slate, sooo cool~~ thats why I wanna learn it asap. (BTW it sucks that the electronic slate is part of audio, when IMO camera should be buying em, or even editors cause its their butts we're helping).
Rippie
Veteran
First off you plan on renting 50 times before you would buy?
Ridiculous. After a handful or 2 tops you should know if you are getting the type of jobs that warrant purchasing one or not.
Why would you waste the amount of money to rent 40+ times when you would pretty much PAY for the unit yourself.
2nd, why would a timecode slate that is running AUDIO timecode on it
be a camera dept item?
When there is no timecode (or no audio for that matter)
the camera dept DOES supply a clapboard.
you're right it is ridiculous, and my plans can change,
2nd, The point was that sound has to pay for it, when its in the hands of the AC most of the time. And camera also benefits from it because it also acts as a slate.
Sam Mallery
Well-known member
You posted about how you wanted to save up and buy the 744T, so you gave us the impression that you were motivated to invest in sound gear.
The G2 is decent. It's the best way to go in the $500 price range. The next best options are four times more expensive, but worth every penny.
Back to your original post... yes, it's worth it to learn the 744T. But, it's not worth renting if you only have 2 microphones, or two channels of audio, and you're not using the timecode.
I could see you renting it 50 times if someone else is paying for the rental (i.e. the production company you're working for). Coming out of your own pocket, not as good of an idea.
The G2 is decent. It's the best way to go in the $500 price range. The next best options are four times more expensive, but worth every penny.
Back to your original post... yes, it's worth it to learn the 744T. But, it's not worth renting if you only have 2 microphones, or two channels of audio, and you're not using the timecode.
I could see you renting it 50 times if someone else is paying for the rental (i.e. the production company you're working for). Coming out of your own pocket, not as good of an idea.
Rippie
Veteran
So explain to me what camera rental house would carry just a time code slate to rent?
A time code slate goes hand in hand with an audio recorder. Period.
You use the 2 together, without the audio recorder the time code slate is meaningless (99% of the time)
I suppose wardrobe should buy wireless microphone systems too right?
I mean the mic is usually on their wardrobe.
I suppose Comteks should be bought by clients and producers right?
I mean comteks are always in their hands.
I suppose the boom op should buy the microphones right?
I mean boom mic's are always in their hands not the sound mixers.
I suppose wireless audio camera hops should be bought by the cameraguys right?
I mean they have the receivers on their camera the whole time.
I suppose...
i see thanks foe the advice on both
And with renting definitely what you said is what I had in mind. Production pays for it so I can play with it. Will rent it for myself soon and just get to know it front and back
Noiz2
Sound Ninja
I still havent heard enough Supposed reasons.
I pay taxes to buy f14's and they won't even give me a ride in one!
Suppose "sound folks" actually had to know something about sound before mini-indi directors let them be "production mixers".
Sorry got delusional there.... Not about the F-14 though!!
Think of it this way. Sound needs to bring the smart slate because it helped them get the job, picture didn't. If life were fair, well it would be too long a post.
You can explain it to the picture department and they can explain that you need to pay for the extra cables to get the generator far enough away from the set so you can record sound. They don't need it over there after all.
And you logic would lead to the picture editorial, or sound editorial department anyway not the picture department. POST is what will use the slate. Bottom line the producer needs it to save some money and guess what, he paid for it. You just rented it to him.