Why not shoot non-flipped?

L

Lkorver

Well-known member
Looking to buy the blade or Letus Elite. Was wondering if anyone on here prefers to shoot non flipped. I do a lot of handheld adapter work for a reality show and it would seem to have several advantages (weight, length, less alignment issues, set up, light loss?).

Is there anything, besides flipping in post, that I'm not thinking of that would force me to buy/use the flip module for these adapters, or any adapter in general? thanks!
 
Shooting handheld is REALLY effing hard without the flip. I'd recommend at least trying a mirror setup if nothing else.
 
If you attach a small external monitor so you can flip the image, that should work. The price of a Mahattan LCD HD monitor is about the same cost as a flip module.

When I was using my DIY mid-format adapter, I didn't use a monitor and it was a pain to frame shots.

For that reason, I ordered the blade with the flip module. It should make life a lot easier.
 
If you're shooting with the HPX170, which I believe you are, you can use the camera's built-in LCD flip function to for more convenient framing. It won't provide the same resolution for checking focus as an external monitor would, but you could either flip the monitor or find one wit a flip function anyway. I'd prefer this over the added bulk that comes with a flip module.
 
I've gotten used to shooting non-flipped. Sometimes when I use my correctly oriented monitor I get confused because my mind now works in mirror mode :huh:
 
I shoot non flipped with the 170 and I love it. I have an external monitor I use when I can afford the extra bulk, but otherwise the screen flip function works perfectly.
 
Lkorver said:
Looking to buy the blade or Letus Elite. Was wondering if anyone on here prefers to shoot non flipped. I do a lot of handheld adapter work for a reality show and it would seem to have several advantages (weight, length, less alignment issues, set up, light loss?).

Is there anything, besides flipping in post, that I'm not thinking of that would force me to buy/use the flip module for these adapters, or any adapter in general? thanks!
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I have never used a flip unit. All I do is mount an upside down onboard monitor to my rig. It's easy. I have a rev3 SGpro and I'm not in a hurry to buy the Blade.

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I would hate having a flipped image, even if I didn't have to see it that way on set. You capture or log it...it's upside down. You open it on your HD...it's upsidedown. You want to play through takes in your editor before it's in your sequence...it's upsidedown. What a sucky workflow LOL.

Even if you batch it in a program to flip it rightside up...wouldn't it just be worth it to buy a flip? Just my opinion. I wont shoot with an adapter if it isn't flipped, not a chance. Shooting on tape right now has the logging process long enough.
 
With adapters, at least with the brevis, you actually WANT to shoot flipped because the flipped module cuts down on chromatic aberration. I've seen the footage, it's true. But that may be Brevis only.
 
There's nothing wrong with shooting without a flip... the problem I never wanted to deal with again was flipping monitors on set for clients. In a professional environment the 35mm Adapter is really frowned upon to begin with. No sense in making it worse by having to turn everything upside down during production AND post.

For personal use, though, it works fine. I know people who still shoot SGPro without flip and do well.
 
You may want also to shoot non-flipped for compactness. For example, we're testing the little 1920x1080 24p Canon HG21. It works with our adapter non-flipped and requires no achromat at all! Being that our imaging unit is only 250 grams, you end up with a super compact/light rig at about .500 grams (just over 1 lb). If you've mod'd the LCD to allow a manual flip, then you're talking super cheap B cam, or A cam on a budget.

We'll have a kit for this little cam including a one-piece 37-72 step up ring which will come in at about $860. Pretty hard to beat considering you can add our flip, swap in our CFXL imaging element and be good to go on an EX1 using the same rails system :-)
 
I run and gun with a Brevis non-flipped on the HMC150 and it's so light. I don't even use the rails, but I don't recommend it. :)
 
I just shot a documentary with both dvx/sgpro and canon-a1/sgblade setup all handheld and non-flipped. For me this is ideal because since I was walking around with the rig on my shoulder for 12 hours a day and I needed it to be as lightwheight as possible. Also, an external LCD is a definitely a must for shoulder-handheld setup anyway.
As the others have mentioned, workflow varies from production to procduction and of course it's better to drop off the tape to the editor without having to tell him to flip the footage. Luckily this time my producer, who also owns a non-flipped unit, was doing the editing and was aware of the non-flip workflow from the start.
So yeah, for me it's easier with the non-flip unit, but then again I just decided that I wont be using the followfocus I just bought because it makes my rig more bulky :)
 
The other thing I can't stand about the flip units is they look a little "do it yourself".

If you're shooting a film, it probably doesn't matter, but when I'm doing commercial work, the last thing I need is to have a client looking at my camera rig and wondering if it's an engineering experiment.

Until someone can show me that the flip footage is as sharp and less or equally impaired as the non flip footage, I'd just as soon deal with the upside down footage. I shoot in Quicktime format anyway which means I can easily flip footage with the Quicktime player.

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pros and cons

pros and cons

thanks for all the responses..

so it seems the only cons to shooting non-flipped (in my case with the 170) are:

chromatic abrasion
annoyance of flipping in post

are these the only two negatives?
Does non-flipped effect your field of view?
does it affect your backfocus in a negative or positive way?
 
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I think it is more of a personal preference to have it flipped when doing post. But for many of us who does their own editing..i find it not that big of a deal. As for backfocus..that is not even a concern..that can be adjusted with the right lens mount that allows backfocus adjustment. And field of view...using a external monitor that is properly calibrated will reduce chromatic abberation problems. That is why I am staying with my SGpro r3 for a while.
 
Dumb question... If you shoot non flipped, how do you properly compose shots? Stand on your head? Flip a monitor upside down? What is your technique? Thanks.
 
I'm also in the boat of whether or not to buy flipped. I have an external monitor now with an option for flipping the image so I feel as if buying the flip would be an unnecessary expense at this point.
 
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