mrjazz
Active member
No.
organic- vs. video-look. What?
- Thread starter mrjazz
- Start date
mrjazz
Active member
What makes you think that?
lawriejaffa
Veteran
Well lol this is all opinion, so take it as just that.
And this isnt necessarily unique to 'spaghetti' westerns lol, but the EX shines when capturing shots that show of its res (mid shots and closeups er just dont in my book... wow i can see that actors plook - yuck!) But if im shooting an epic vista, and also maybe its just me but there is a deeper depth of focus in a lot of westerns (and sergio leonne ones) so again would be easy to manage with 1/2 1/3 cams.
Sure it would be graded and pimped to hell, and softened a little in the mids and closeups, but not so much on the wides. It could create some great ooh and ahh moments on the sticks (Which again a good few spag westerns im thinking of anyway are.)
I liked the wide landscape shots in Forgotten for example, nicely showed of the cams creative capability for 'epic impressions' as i put it.
Epic detailed landscapes, rich wide vistas, and its enhanced ability to retain detail. Obviously an hpx/hvx can do this too (to a lesser extent) just as there are qualities the EX could not quite manage that an hvx/hpx can do, but it is one quality that if i were an EX doP/director, id be routinely showing of. As mid shots and closeups only excite nerds staring at posted pics going wow... look how clear Jason's acne is... but wides on the other hand can make some oohs.
So just my opinion, for the record i use to use an hvx200, i use an hpx500 now, and got a Canon J6x8 Wide Angle for it. I'll probably get a 2nd hand hvx, and an hpx170. I would also use the EX for corporate gigs utilising high res graphic animation displays interspliced with videos, for things like plasma screen/ hd projector displays / exhibitions and so on.
And this isnt necessarily unique to 'spaghetti' westerns lol, but the EX shines when capturing shots that show of its res (mid shots and closeups er just dont in my book... wow i can see that actors plook - yuck!) But if im shooting an epic vista, and also maybe its just me but there is a deeper depth of focus in a lot of westerns (and sergio leonne ones) so again would be easy to manage with 1/2 1/3 cams.
Sure it would be graded and pimped to hell, and softened a little in the mids and closeups, but not so much on the wides. It could create some great ooh and ahh moments on the sticks (Which again a good few spag westerns im thinking of anyway are.)
I liked the wide landscape shots in Forgotten for example, nicely showed of the cams creative capability for 'epic impressions' as i put it.
Epic detailed landscapes, rich wide vistas, and its enhanced ability to retain detail. Obviously an hpx/hvx can do this too (to a lesser extent) just as there are qualities the EX could not quite manage that an hvx/hpx can do, but it is one quality that if i were an EX doP/director, id be routinely showing of. As mid shots and closeups only excite nerds staring at posted pics going wow... look how clear Jason's acne is... but wides on the other hand can make some oohs.
So just my opinion, for the record i use to use an hvx200, i use an hpx500 now, and got a Canon J6x8 Wide Angle for it. I'll probably get a 2nd hand hvx, and an hpx170. I would also use the EX for corporate gigs utilising high res graphic animation displays interspliced with videos, for things like plasma screen/ hd projector displays / exhibitions and so on.
Last edited:
mrjazz
Active member
I have to ask a question again: Are these pics graded in post or not?
If no, then I must admit that it's not possible with the ex1 to do such heavy grading and to achieve such looks in-camera.
If yes, then these pics don't say anything about the hvxs (native) look, because I guess we agreed about that it's possible to convert ex1-footage to hvx and vice-versa in post. (of course it's not possible to increase resolution or SNR (signal-to-noise-ratio) in post.)
lawriejaffa
Veteran
Pics are most definately graded in post - well at least the standard def pic is (the bottom one was) the other 2 were desaturated slightly.
lol its rather silly to compare native looks as if that is all Panny users care about. Its also not just that panny mojo that they care about either, saying that would be like saying EX users only care about extra res. For me the Panny mojo enhances grading, (its look) but obviously other elements too, so its entirely relevant to a discussion about organic/cinematic qualities. The Ex of course has its own unique mojo's that i'll be attempting to explore.
I certainly don't think any panny buyers are convinced as you may be that the looks are inter-changeable, and there are other differences beside res worth caring about. (There is more to an image than res mr. jazz haha)
Your logic appears like someone attempting to justify the superiority of one camera over another. Good luck!
So, native is not totally irrelevant, but its idiotic to compare the cams native looks as if that is what film directors/dop/cam ops are basing their entire comparisons on.
lol its rather silly to compare native looks as if that is all Panny users care about. Its also not just that panny mojo that they care about either, saying that would be like saying EX users only care about extra res. For me the Panny mojo enhances grading, (its look) but obviously other elements too, so its entirely relevant to a discussion about organic/cinematic qualities. The Ex of course has its own unique mojo's that i'll be attempting to explore.
I certainly don't think any panny buyers are convinced as you may be that the looks are inter-changeable, and there are other differences beside res worth caring about. (There is more to an image than res mr. jazz haha)
Your logic appears like someone attempting to justify the superiority of one camera over another. Good luck!
So, native is not totally irrelevant, but its idiotic to compare the cams native looks as if that is what film directors/dop/cam ops are basing their entire comparisons on.
Last edited:
mrjazz
Active member
What is "mojo"? Do you with "mojo" mean the native (ungraded) look'n'feel of the camera? And why is hvxs mojo enhancing your grading? Because it's nearer from start to your goal-look?
And what are the other elements?
As long as you care just for color/gamma/etc... they are absolutely interchangeable. That's not my belief, but my insight.
What do you think about? Good user-interface and stuff like that?
Yes: Good MTF and high signal-to-noise-ratio.
Last edited:
Fohdeesha
Well-known member
Call it whatever you want, but it doesn't change the fact that the screengrabs you posted look almost exactly like the footage out my EX1 before I adjusted its backfocus. If my comment actually angered you enough for you to result to personal insults, that right there tells me you're in the panny fanboy camp. Nothing wrong with that, but it doesn't entitle you to come to our subforum and call us out. we don't do that to you guys.
(By the way, calling someone out on their age and maturity, then using multiple personal insults and profanity to defend an inanimate piece of equipment is well, ironic at the least. Your posts are trollish at best)
Last edited:
I just spent a couple minutes reading this thread and I get the feeling that some people feel the need to justify their choice of camera over another to feel some sort of self gratification. Neither camera is better or worse, they're both great cameras any way you look at it. It's that simple.
In the end, the EX1 vs. HVX argument goes no where and always ends up at a moot point.
Shoot with what you have, make good movies and let your work speak for itself.
In the end, the EX1 vs. HVX argument goes no where and always ends up at a moot point.
Shoot with what you have, make good movies and let your work speak for itself.
I posted this in another thread..... Same Topic:
---------------------------------------------------------
Ahhh..... I think I just figured out this Panasonic/Sony thing....... Kinda like the Canon/Nikon thing in stills, except maybe worse.
Most of you in this forum are "Junior" film makers and/or "Junior" business people. Now.... Don't get your panties all in a bunch. You saved your hard earned money for your "one" camera. Or you maybe currently gainfully employed..... In another industry and want to be a film maker. Or what ever.... Plunking 4-5-6-7-8-9-10 grand down on Video gear is a hard hit and you have to work your azz off for it!
Big..... Huge props to you.... You should be commended on making the commitment to better yourself!
So.... Now here lies the problem ..... What side of the fence do you invest in. We all want to feel good about what we invested our money in. We go to these forums to learn and share with like minded people and the last thing were looking for is to be divided by mojo and rolling shutters.
Your gonna use your "One" camera for all your projects so you better have made the right choice.
I just bought two Sony EX3 after many people telling me I needed the Panasonic 170/200a. Boy, Did I feel like I was going against the grain. The Sony cameras are going to be perfect for my specific purpose and more. But the EX3 is not my "One" camera. I'm not married to it.... As soon as I get a job where another camera is needed.... Boom, I'll just rent something else and charge it back to the client.
How far off am I?
frisco
---------------------------------------------------------
Ahhh..... I think I just figured out this Panasonic/Sony thing....... Kinda like the Canon/Nikon thing in stills, except maybe worse.
Most of you in this forum are "Junior" film makers and/or "Junior" business people. Now.... Don't get your panties all in a bunch. You saved your hard earned money for your "one" camera. Or you maybe currently gainfully employed..... In another industry and want to be a film maker. Or what ever.... Plunking 4-5-6-7-8-9-10 grand down on Video gear is a hard hit and you have to work your azz off for it!
Big..... Huge props to you.... You should be commended on making the commitment to better yourself!
So.... Now here lies the problem ..... What side of the fence do you invest in. We all want to feel good about what we invested our money in. We go to these forums to learn and share with like minded people and the last thing were looking for is to be divided by mojo and rolling shutters.
Your gonna use your "One" camera for all your projects so you better have made the right choice.
I just bought two Sony EX3 after many people telling me I needed the Panasonic 170/200a. Boy, Did I feel like I was going against the grain. The Sony cameras are going to be perfect for my specific purpose and more. But the EX3 is not my "One" camera. I'm not married to it.... As soon as I get a job where another camera is needed.... Boom, I'll just rent something else and charge it back to the client.
How far off am I?
frisco
mrjazz
Active member
lawriejaffa
Veteran
Yah Frisco thats kinda the right attitude your putting to business, are you from the States? In the UK its mostly Sony and so getting Pannies is more 'wow - what are they!?' in fact in Scotland there almost novelties!!! It is like the Nikon / Canon thing, my first post on this whole thread was related to just how useless and silly these threads are. Mr. Jazz, bless ya, are obviously an EX fan, and your question was never a question, but a challenge to what you probably see as something unsubstantiated, ie. pannys are more organic/movie looking.
Obviously many if not most EX users would agree, and most Panny users wouldn't (are they being objective or not - who knows.) But it is why this thread was negative and unnecessary from the first place, and it would be the same if it was a panny fanboy who started it.
As for you Fohdeesha, im gonna make this simple for you. Your post, designed to offend and designed to defend those metaphorical genitals of yours that you call a camera, would never have been made, if those stills were posted in a clips thread, or a film thread for the festivals. They were made here because you wanted to provocate - that is trolling, calling you a jerk for it, is simply calling a spade a spade.
But heres a little game for you Fohd, try posting such a comment in clip or user movie threads, and lets see if people just happen to, as you call it 'troll' lol in their response? I don't think so huh? Or is it just ok to say crap like that in a pathetic my cam is better than your cam thread like this? Just think about it huh for goodness sake...
Obviously many if not most EX users would agree, and most Panny users wouldn't (are they being objective or not - who knows.) But it is why this thread was negative and unnecessary from the first place, and it would be the same if it was a panny fanboy who started it.
As for you Fohdeesha, im gonna make this simple for you. Your post, designed to offend and designed to defend those metaphorical genitals of yours that you call a camera, would never have been made, if those stills were posted in a clips thread, or a film thread for the festivals. They were made here because you wanted to provocate - that is trolling, calling you a jerk for it, is simply calling a spade a spade.
But heres a little game for you Fohd, try posting such a comment in clip or user movie threads, and lets see if people just happen to, as you call it 'troll' lol in their response? I don't think so huh? Or is it just ok to say crap like that in a pathetic my cam is better than your cam thread like this? Just think about it huh for goodness sake...
Last edited:
Fohdeesha
Well-known member
I posted it in this thread because the sole purpose of it is the image quality and characteristics of each camera, my post was completely relevant.
There would be no point in posting it in a film thread, because that thread is about that film. Not the camera.
Please, just take your terrible trolling back to the HVX forum. Do you even own one? It's starting to look like you're an angry child or something.
There would be no point in posting it in a film thread, because that thread is about that film. Not the camera.
Please, just take your terrible trolling back to the HVX forum. Do you even own one? It's starting to look like you're an angry child or something.
lawriejaffa
Veteran
Well that wasn't even remotely convincing Fuhd, the thread is about organic/video image characteristics and i posted pics that i said reflected what i liked about the hvx - and were just my opinion. They were not proof of anything, and i said myself they were subjective to me personally.
From your post you say 'quality' and that explains your misunderstanding. You obviously thought my pics were posted as an attempt to prove the superiority of one cam over another and so with typical fanboy zeal you rushed to shoot them down. Except you did by actually insulting somebodies work.
That is what acting like a kid is Fuhd... that is trolling.
If you are 17, i'll let it go, but just to say and i mean this earnestly. You never let the passion of any cam or anything as stupid as technology go far as to make a blatant insult on anyones posted work. Its an expectation and a right for anyone posting work, be them a beginner or some kind of genius that anyone posting such put downs gets a smacked bum. Don't try to defend it, and im not saying this to 'win' some stupid abstract squabble with you. Just that its 'not done' or right to do so to fellow folks here.
From your post you say 'quality' and that explains your misunderstanding. You obviously thought my pics were posted as an attempt to prove the superiority of one cam over another and so with typical fanboy zeal you rushed to shoot them down. Except you did by actually insulting somebodies work.
That is what acting like a kid is Fuhd... that is trolling.
If you are 17, i'll let it go, but just to say and i mean this earnestly. You never let the passion of any cam or anything as stupid as technology go far as to make a blatant insult on anyones posted work. Its an expectation and a right for anyone posting work, be them a beginner or some kind of genius that anyone posting such put downs gets a smacked bum. Don't try to defend it, and im not saying this to 'win' some stupid abstract squabble with you. Just that its 'not done' or right to do so to fellow folks here.
Last edited:
Buck Forester
Well-known member
Lawrie does this all the time to get free beers, make him buy
And make him buy some expensive organic beer.
lawriejaffa
Veteran
lol MrChipG, Buck and SteveT hehe - yooouuuu guuuys!
That is rather funny actually especially the organic beer - you gimp Buck damn you lol
Actually as a sidenote I tend to have become somewhat obsessed recently with cocktails, its a dangerous path, taste like candy hit like whiskey type comical looking beveridges! It's not good - I do drink Cobra though, those Indian lagers (there not gassy! don't make you bloated!) so in fact i''d probably infuriate some real ale drinkers with my tastes.
However I like Porte too, liquers and other camp drinks! Hope you guys are gonna give my er script a wee peak at ScriptFest btw!!! Red Rope :beer:
That is rather funny actually especially the organic beer - you gimp Buck damn you lol
Actually as a sidenote I tend to have become somewhat obsessed recently with cocktails, its a dangerous path, taste like candy hit like whiskey type comical looking beveridges! It's not good - I do drink Cobra though, those Indian lagers (there not gassy! don't make you bloated!) so in fact i''d probably infuriate some real ale drinkers with my tastes.
However I like Porte too, liquers and other camp drinks! Hope you guys are gonna give my er script a wee peak at ScriptFest btw!!! Red Rope :beer:
Buck Forester
Well-known member
I stopped drinking since I got my EX1. Nowadays if I want to feel drunk and wobbly, I simply look through my viewfinder while panning and everything looks skewed. After a few minutes I turn off the camera and hey, no hangover.
Fohdeesha
Well-known member
Might want to get your camera serviced, there's no skew unless you pan on picket fences back and forth violently