New 5DII footage ....and some thoughts about Scarlet

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f64manray

Well-known member
New 5DII Footage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0-1LxXinjU&feature=related&fmt=18

Back Flip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzOo46YMMog&NR&fmt=18



I'm kind of disappointed with the Scarlet announcement. All Willy Wonka and his magical camera factory needed to do was give us a 5DII with 24p and full manual controls and he would have scored big time with thousands of users. Instead he offered a 6K 35mm full frame Scarlet body only for $12,000. Many, Many people don't need or want 6 friggin K. Really, I think 35FF 2K at $3,000 would be fine. That is the benchmark and he failed (we'll see what the market saysif these are ever released). The market was only looking for a mildly more capable 5DII and they respond with a 35FF for $12,000 body only. Okay, that's out of my system.


But on the upside if he's competing with the Sony Cine Alta, he may blow them away. He may gain all of Sony's 50 Cine Alta customers. I just thought he would go for amuch broader market that Scarlet was aimed at. I'll take a 35FF 5DII over a 2/3 Scarlet please.
 
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f64manray said:
I'm kind of disappointed with the Scarlet announcement. All Willy Wonka and his magical camera factory needed to do was give us a 5DII with 24p and full manual controls and he would have scored big time with thousands of users. Instead he offered a 6K 35mm full frame Scarlet body only for $12,000. Many, Many people don't need or want 6 friggin K. Really, I think 35FF 2K at $3,000 would be fine. That is the benchmark and he failed (we'll see what the market saysif these are ever released). The market was only looking for a mildly more capable 5DII and they respond with a 35FF for $12,000 body only. Okay, that's out of my system.

But on the upside if he's competing with the Sony Cine Alta, he may blow them away. He may gain all of Sony's 50 Cine Alta customers. I just thought he would go for amuch broader market that Scarlet was aimed at. I'll take a 35FF 5DII over a 2/3 Scarlet please.
Click to expand...

Agreed. Go with Canon, when the Scarlet is finalli available you already will be shooting for one or two years. Don't expect this to be Canon's last step. There will be more complete cameras but you will be able to keep the glass and other gear like the one from Redrock and you can still use the - then old - 5d mark II as your b cam. By the way, the videos you posted exist for quite a while already. You can go to the homepage of the guy who made them and watch them in much better resolution there:

http://www.stratenschulte.de/index.php?page=5dmkii
 
actually i don't think it would be easier or cheaper for red to build a 2k camera than a 6k one, quite the contrary. they rely heavily on post production and pretty much just dump raw data to a memory card when you press rec. a sensor that size with today's technology won't be any less than 6k and adding downscaling circuitry obviously costs more than not doing so. to sum it up red is taking the position of the cheap high end manufacturer, a market posistion much easier to compete in for a small company than the mass market (canon, nikon) or the "pro" stuff (arri, panavision).
 
Isn't Scarlet a 3k camera with fixed lens and that will be going for under US$3000? And Epic a 5k res one?
At least it's what I heard in the interviews with Red's Ted.
 
I would have been very happy with a S35 Scarlet taking Nikon lenses at 3k and recording to commonly available media. I think they got sort of pixel crazy, when really very few people have a workflow that will adapt well to 5k or 6k. I don't see how a $12,000 camera body (without even a viewfinder at that price) can be called a "D-SLR killer" either.

Still hoping the released 5DmII will do 24p ... I am supposed to be shooting a doc starting early next year and might get one and shoot it in 30p, but even for that I'd prefer 24p if I could.
 
the canon has a 5k sensor too. the difference is that it doesn't use all the pixels in video mode, which scarlett does and i can't really think of that as a bad thing. i think people are mistaken when they think that the 5k could be traded for a lower price or better frame rate options. that's not how it works. i'd love that too, but i'm fairly sure it's not a pixel race, just the realities of sensor design and manufacturing.

/matt
 
Very interesting hands on about the lowlight performance of the 5DII sensor here:

http://digitalprotalk.blogspot.com/2008/11/its-revelations-monday-8-hours-with.html

To sum it up:

"That means, dear readers, the the old 800 ISO is the new 6400 ISO!!!!"


This is really something. Red codec or not, I find it hard to believe Red has come anywhere near this unless Jannard would like to pop in here and state otherwise. Canon needs to get this FF35mm sensor into a video camera for under 5 grand, like now!!
 
I'm really wondering if Canon really realizes what they have on their hands with this FF35 sensor. It negates their whole video camera line up it seems. Did the still photo division even run this past the video division because it seems like decades of progress have been made in what typically would have been small incremental painful steps by Canon resulting in this 35FF sensor like in the year 2030.

Of course, maybe Nikon forced their hand with the D90. I almost hate to reward them with my business if that's the case. Oh well........sigh.

Ray Kurzweil is right. Technology is increasing at an exponential rate. Unfortunately, it's happening as our economy is skyrocketing back to 1930 and the barbarians from a bygone age are trying to blow us up. Crazy times.
 
2k is just a term meaning approx. 2000 pixels across the width.
I believe the reds 2k is 2048 or something like that.
The 2K digital cinema standard is for digital projectors and is 1080 by 2048
this allows scope 2.39:1 2048x858 or 1.85:1 1998x1080.
1080p 16:9 square pixels is 1920x1080.
So its close but essentially 2K?
I would say 1080P footage on a well calibrated 1080P projector would look nearly indistinguisable from native 2k footage on a well calibrated 2k projector. In a perfect world with perfectly smooth shooting ,perfect boom operators, a perfect workflow and perfect distribution pipeline either would be fine.
But does 2k have an advantage in the imperfect world.
 
f64 - the japanese stuff looks great... I can work around the 30fps issue... the quality, colour, DOF etc looks perfect (in fact, as I don't make films, 30fps is probably better for me)

Can't wait till 5th Dec when mine gets deleivered!!
 
I agree, it's amazing on many levels. The user says this video is shot in a completely dark room lit only by the residual light from the street lamp outside the window. Incredible, I say!

http://www.vimeo.com/2245181

Look how clean it is. Funny narrative under the clip. I agree with his sentiments.
 
The Canon footage is indeed stunning; however, at least on the web video, there is a noticeable amount of noise and color aliasing (color banding) in the shadows and gradients.
 
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