From Vincent Laforet: If you want 24p on the 5D MKII...
- Thread starter f64manray
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egproductions
Veteran
Of course I could be wrong but I have a feeling if canon adds 24P is will be 24P normal and maybe call it cinema mode. The way I look at the video feature on this camera is "video for photographers" I don't think Canon was looking to make a still camera that independent filmakers could use as an HD video camera (whether or not it can serve that purpose). If I were designing a professional still camera (for still photographers) that had a video feature I would do as canon did; make sure it is high quality, could have the DOF I was used to but target it for simple editing (60i timeline, no major color correcting).
I am assuming that the majority of people buying this camera probably have no interest in video (fair assumption? I think so). A simple video feature could intrigue these consumers but if it gets very intricate and adjustable it could throw off the target market for this camera. People might feel they are paying for the video functionality of the camera.
I am assuming that the majority of people buying this camera probably have no interest in video (fair assumption? I think so). A simple video feature could intrigue these consumers but if it gets very intricate and adjustable it could throw off the target market for this camera. People might feel they are paying for the video functionality of the camera.
Rylan Zolinski
Well-known member
Majority, yes, but MANY videographers will likely purchase it as well. As for people feeling like they are paying for video, I HIGHLY doubt it.
John Sandel
Active member
booggerg2, you have a link to that? Where was it posted?
Rubbersquare
Well-known member
so it's pretty much useless as a video camera.
John Sandel
Active member
That's OK. Weddings give me cold feet.
At his blog, Laforet has qualified his descriptions of the 5D2, in each post & in his responses to comments, by noting that he was using a prototype & that he had no manual. Under his post "September 26th 2008, 11:17 pm," he comments (9/27/8 at 12:43p) that he used a method very like what Kholi Hicks devised with the D90, to fool the 5D2 into behaving. I think he stumbled on the same track we all have: the 5D2 is usable, even if the controls are badly implemented.
Can you at least post what Westfall says about how it works in his words as you did with the last statement.
Even disregarding Laforet, my understanding is that the exposure can be locked and can be adjusted via the exposure compensation dial which would thereby give you control most likely of the aperture. Also pointing the camera to a dark area forcing it to open up and then locking etc. It still can be controlled.
Rubbersquare
Well-known member
but what about the aperture? is it all luck of the draw so to speak for what you get before you lock down?
It's not really luck of the draw. Point the camera to a dark area, it's going to open up the aperture, no question. Lock the exposure and you have your F2.8 or whatever max is on your lens.
Laforet says he shot at F2 for the whole shoot. In those lighting conditions, I'm sure that's the aperture the camera would have picked anyway in auto mode.
At the worst, were saying that Reverie is a result of a guy that had no clue about how the camera worked and it's virtually a point and shoot endeavor. I'm not sure whether to be depressed or completely astounded and amazed. I don't want to live with that, but I guess I could. It is pretty amazing if that was a point and shoot movie. I guess I will just point and shoot then. It looks like Canon has it all well in hand. ....at least in those lighting conditions which is where I live creatively anyway.
Also let's not forget about ND filters. They can also force the camera open nicely in brighter conditions.
I have a new slogan for Canon:
Even if you don't know what the hell you're doing, don't worry about it, she'll be right mate.
I wonder if the same could be said about the 35mm Panaflex. ;-)
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I was under the impression that, like the D90, you had some level or aperture control on the 5DMKII. If nothing else probably one could use an adapter and put Nikon lenses with manual aperture rings on it, but I thought I read that the 5DMKII honors the aperture, chooses a shutter 1/30th to 1/125th and then does auto ISO.
Interesting exchange from Vincent and a professional cameraman that worked on Superman II Comparing the 5D MKII low light capability to Panavision HD Genesis (Genesis was also used on "Click" and "Apocalypto" "Sacry Movie 4" "Fly Boys")
i worked at panavision for a long time and those raw clips are amazing. i have some mounts that take the panavision lenses and fix em to my canon still cameras. everything ive shot up to this has been mostly on the genesis …which is an epic camera, but this low light stuff looks crazy… and with my panavision mounts combined with a camera like this…. the funny thing is i worked on superman for fx shots over new york and have used those heli pads off to the side of the city… we shot genesis and i was constantly batteling the grain at night to get the cleanest image… this camera is just wow..
(FROM VINCE: Will - you’re right! I think a LOT of people are missing the point - this is indeed NOT meant to replace motion picture cameras. BUT it must be said - that the low light performance is groundbreaking… period - end of story. Anyone who has complained about the noise etc - doesn’t know what they’re talking about… sorry. Yes - there might be some “weird” H.264 on some small spots - but compared to most other solutions out there - it’s still heads above what is available out there (there are 1-2 very very high end HD cameras that might be able to match this. Most CANNOT.)
This is to funny when I read some photographers remarks that the video feature in the 5D MKII is just a gimmick. Apparently some pros wish they had this useless toy for some aspects of film production.
i worked at panavision for a long time and those raw clips are amazing. i have some mounts that take the panavision lenses and fix em to my canon still cameras. everything ive shot up to this has been mostly on the genesis …which is an epic camera, but this low light stuff looks crazy… and with my panavision mounts combined with a camera like this…. the funny thing is i worked on superman for fx shots over new york and have used those heli pads off to the side of the city… we shot genesis and i was constantly batteling the grain at night to get the cleanest image… this camera is just wow..
(FROM VINCE: Will - you’re right! I think a LOT of people are missing the point - this is indeed NOT meant to replace motion picture cameras. BUT it must be said - that the low light performance is groundbreaking… period - end of story. Anyone who has complained about the noise etc - doesn’t know what they’re talking about… sorry. Yes - there might be some “weird” H.264 on some small spots - but compared to most other solutions out there - it’s still heads above what is available out there (there are 1-2 very very high end HD cameras that might be able to match this. Most CANNOT.)
This is to funny when I read some photographers remarks that the video feature in the 5D MKII is just a gimmick. Apparently some pros wish they had this useless toy for some aspects of film production.
Yup, that along with a 1/30th shutter as Reverie proves. What if I don't want 1/30th?
Then I guess you clould pay $30,000 for a for Red One with less low light capability.
You mean 23k for a working dedicated video acquisition system with manual controls for repeatable successful results.
I'm just sayin'.
Rubbersquare
Well-known member
what he said.
I thought it was around 30K to get Red One to a fully functioning unit if I remember reading the Red site correcty. I'm sure it's a great kit, but for 20K there is alot of mighty fine "L" series glass that could be bought if your willing to do some back bending work arounds with the 5D.
It doesn't matter, I'm sure there's a Scarlet somewhere in my future as well in addition to the 5D if they can deliver to me full manual controls, full size low light sensor as capable as the 5D, interchangeble lenses, variable frame rates and of course XLR phantom powerd mic/line level audio inputs (no mini jacks!) .....or did I just describe the upcoming Canon 1Ds MK IV ;-)
John Sandel
Active member
Well, let's do a checklist …
1. working … Red: yes—5D2: yes
2. dedicated … Red: yes—5D2: no
3. video acquisition system … Red: yes—5D2: yes
4. with manual controls … Red: yes—5D2: yes
5. for repeatable … Red: yes—5D2: yes
6. successful results … Red: yes—5D2: yes
Oh, and let's just add these little items:
7. that's easy to use: … Red: yes—5D2: TBA
8. which costs $3,000 … Red: no—5D2: yes
9. which costs $23,000 … Red: yes—5D2: no
So if I worry exclusively about #2, I'll go with Red.
Odd, though—that shiny #8 keeps distracting me. All I have to be willing to do is adapt my work habits to adjust for the tool, which I do every time I shoot anyway, and I can buy, hmm, let's see … 7.666 Canons for the Red I didn't buy.
How many crew lunches is that? How many insurance bonds or location bribes? How many completed short films? How many new Macs on which to post some of the shorts?
Etc.