Big News in the World of Electric Cars!

[TwistedLincoln]

I'm going to self-censor myself and simply say that I don't believe that global warming is a problem, and as such don't particularly care about my vehicle's "carbon emissions" aside from how it effects air quality. And any discussion about taxing vehicles based on their emissions....well that's a political debate better spoken of elsewhere, so I won't comment.

That said, I would absolutely love to buy an all electric car, for plenty of other non-political reasons. For starters, I really like the idea of being able to "refuel" at home by plugging it in, rather than going to a station to fill up. Even if the costs to operate end up being the same, the convenience alone is worth a lot. Plus, if push comes to shove, there are plenty of ways to generate your own electricity...but good luck making your own gasoline.

Sadly, I can't see spending more than $20,000 for any vehicle, regardless of fuel type. That and I've always driven a truck or van, and couldn't stand to drive a regular car due to how low to the ground they drive (not to mention how often I haul things). I don't need the horsepower or towing capacity of a large truck, just the height and space for boxes, so if they made an affordable all-electric mid-size truck or van, I'd be the first in line.

 

[Matt Gottshalk]

You clearly have not read the previous articles, there are two components:

(1) End user requirements

(2) Net profits from product

Sure the "Market" may demand more fuel efficient cars, BUT the return on profits on making small cars is very small when compared to making big profits on SUVs, why would a company want to make LESS profit? and EVs would make the least profits.

Yes, but if the MARKET doesn't support SUVs, regardless of the profit, then they won't sell. And that IS what is happening.

There ISN'T a profit on cars sitting on the lot.

CNN: SUV sales down 55%

 

[wabbit]

Think of how many people rely on it for jobs. Think of how much you support it, even if it were $5 a gallon. Think about how much of it is left in the earth, a lot!

The main problem does not exist in how much is left but in how to get it out cheaply and at a rate in line with the constantly rising demand (passing Hubbert's Peak):

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/7203633/the_long_emergency/

http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/Archives2007/KingEvent.html

http://www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net/

The "tons" of oil left gets more and more expensive to pull out of the ground. Canada is sitting on the 2nd (or 3rd, I forget) largest oil reserve but it mostly oil shale that is VERY expensive to extract. Think gas is expensive now with the realitively easy and cheap to extract crude oil? Pray we don't still have a primarily oil based economy when it gets to the point we have to start extracting oil shale.

These people have been accurately telling us about this for a long time but their voices have been drowned out by $2 a gallon gas. Now that reality is setting in, it would be prudent to start listening.

Combine the passing of the Hubbert Peak with the Enron-loophole in our oil industry and investors no longer have any reason to hold back on just contantly jacking up the price (lessons of CA energy deregulations were not learned).

We are at a major turning point. Where this was simply considered a political issue in the past, now that the effects are obviously hitting us all, it is also an individual issue. Certain political forces have been telling us that "market forces" should always control this and we now are seeing the brilliance of this plan played out. The "market" of moving off of oil is either fast & expensive or slower & cheaper. In a world waking up to the inevitability of this move, we seemed hell bent on using the former.

Cheers

Cheers

 

[JOsh Fulton]

Oil will not run out in our lifetime, when it does they will worry about it then.

You sure, after_effects?

A lot of people say otherwise. According to this article,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_depletion


the estimated oil depletion year is 2057. Can you imagine what's going to happen before that? How much of a crisis there's going to be before we're at 0 ounces of oil left?

I for one plan on living more than 50 years. So, I'd rather start planning for it now. Even if I didn't live more than 50 years, I'm pretty sure other people will, so it'd be good to prepare for them too.

 

[Anhar_Miah]

I'm going to self-censor myself and simply say that I don't believe that global warming is a problem.

Well thats ok everyone has the right to their own views;

//EDIT:

The scientific consenus is that Global Warming is due to human activity is about 90% confident (true not 100%), its that 10% uncertaintity that some others try to use to argue the opposite,

thus far all computer simulations have confirmed the observed data, I've been lucky enough to see some of these simulations in my last Uni.

 

[Anhar_Miah]

Yes, but if the MARKET doesn't support SUVs, regardless of the profit, then they won't sell. And that IS what is happening.

There ISN'T a profit on cars sitting on the lot.

CNN: SUV sales down 55%

yes thats true for local sales, but not true when you look at Global sales:


in fact in Russia; SUV sales are booming:

http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11496858

 

[Matt Gottshalk]

yes thats true for local sales, but not true when you look at Global sales:


in fact in Russia; SUV sales are booming:

http://www.economist.com/business/displaystory.cfm?story_id=11496858

Thats because Russia has a great supply of domestically produced oil.

 

[Anhar_Miah]

True, but they are still buying American SUVs, thus American auto manufacturers are making profits on SUVs, profits on SUV are not down (when you look at all sales, not just local sales).

 

[after_effects]

You sure, after_effects?

A lot of people say otherwise. According to this article,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_depletion


the estimated oil depletion year is 2057. Can you imagine what's going to happen before that? How much of a crisis there's going to be before we're at 0 ounces of oil left?

I for one plan on living more than 50 years. So, I'd rather start planning for it now. Even if I didn't live more than 50 years, I'm pretty sure other people will, so it'd be good to prepare for them too.

I would like to live for another 50 years, but I cant say that i will.

I dont know about you but I will be 75 by then and there is a good chance i probably wont be alive.

 

[joemiked]

electric rip off!!
yeah i think everybody knows if its electric it has a short lifespan,
the electric dealer here for cars berkeley is just a joke you get like 50 80 miles on an 8 hour charge? electicity wont save the earth! you and i know where the juice comes from
nukes there wont be enough electricty for everybody to drive electric so nuke your town for it ..nah
oil is organic and geez its so plentifull i think? and in south america oil is almost illeagle due to huge sugar cane argentina gas is like .50 cents a gallon!! sugar water !! no chevron ceos or shell they get the melvin(underwere up the butt) treatment!
too bad.....
oil is usefull electric is costly more so in my opinion ,
and super size me fried food gas has a toll on humans directly!!
amagine being the fatty at mc fatso's ordering a super size me gas tank of fuel!
ill take a a 1000 peice mc chicken please and that oil used to make my meal so i can drive home thank you!!

mmmmm mc drive aways? super sized alternative fule disaster! save earth not humans--bad idea so was ble ray but hey these are "strange days"
mike d

 

[after_effects]

If you were to guess, how long until at least half the population is driving electric?

 

[joemiked]

electirc car population

electirc car population

50 years for half the population thats what i think!
m.d.

 

[Loki]

irrgardless of oil. Electric cars still need power. that power comes from somewhere....

We need more solar technology. its free. The sun will burn for 5,000,000,000 more years.

I agree. I think solar panel technology needs to move forward. Think of a car in the desert. Parked all day while someone is at work, the body of the car made of solar cells. You'd literally be charging you car all day.

while I am ranting.. why is it that house in hotter and dryer climates ala California, Nevada etc... aren't required in their building codes to have solar roof panels?

Kind of blows my mind that solar power isn't more prevalent. Expense may be an issue at the moment, but once you start ramping up production and getting competition in there.. price comes down.

 

[Mark Harris]

I agree. I think solar panel technology needs to move forward. Think of a car in the desert. Parked all day while someone is at work, the body of the car made of solar cells. You'd literally be charging you car all day.

while I am ranting.. why is it that house in hotter and dryer climates ala California, Nevada etc... aren't required in their building codes to have solar roof panels?

Kind of blows my mind that solar power isn't more prevalent. Expense may be an issue at the moment, but once you start ramping up production and getting competition in there.. price comes down.

Though not mandated, on the Greek Islands, almost everyone has a solar powered water heater on the roof of their house. Super smart.

 

[Loki]

Though not mandated, on the Greek Islands, almost everyone has a solar powered water heater on the roof of their house. Super smart.

That is super smart.

What blows my mind is that with solar paneling when you are not home.. you would actively contribute to the electricity grid.

Green roofs combined with solar paneling would make cities kind of their own self sustaining entities. imagine retro-fitting an entire cities worth of Skyscrapers with solar panels...

I don't understand what it is that holds us back from progress. We could build self sustaining buildings, with natural water filtration, solar energy, use energy efficient appliances. And we can do this now.

But yet we don't.

why is that.. people as individuals are smart, but it seems people in a group (society) are stagnant and dumb.

 

[Rick Meyer]

Whats sad is that the Model T ford, built in 1908 was capable of 25mpg. I read somewhere that in 2004 the average mpg for American automobiles was 20.8.

What's wrong with that picture?

 

[10s]

Solar is fine but try Lighting Power, How many tens of thousands of lightening strikes a year, and each one is full of more power than we can imagine. We need to figure out how to capture & store it. The Midwest could produce more power than anywhere on Earth.

 

[wabbit]

I don't understand what it is that holds us back from progress. We could build self sustaining buildings, with natural water filtration, solar energy, use energy efficient appliances. And we can do this now.

But yet we don't.

why is that.. people as individuals are smart, but it seems people in a group (society) are stagnant and dumb.

Several reasons that I can think of

A. Solar paneling, as the technology exist now, is expensive up front and depending on your location can take anywhere from 5 to 20 years before a return on investment is seen. It is like paying for your next 15 years of electricity today to get the 15 after that for free. Most would rather invest that money in something with more concrete and immediate returns. Business have gotten so short-sighted they often sell the company's future for one positive quarter. Shareholders are hardly gonna get excited about something that pays off in 10 years when they might not even own the stock anymore.

B. Politically there is little incentive to support 'free' energy resource development. I think someone here already made the analogy; you don't get rich off the razor, you get rich off the blades. Solar panels can last anywhere from 20 to 40 years; that is 20 to 40 years of lost profits for the people selling you oil, coal, nuclear, or even 'clean' energy like hydro or tidal, etc. Without getting political, we all know money bends the ear of politicians (on both sides of the aisle) more then a mild smattering of voters demanding we plan for the future.

Of course, all that is an over-simplification but it's at least one layer of the onion.

The good news is certain states and countries are wiser then the rest of us and are offering to buy excess 'clean' energy from customers at above market Kwh rates; basically subsidizing clean energy on an individual level. Germany has been doing this for several years and when you go to farms, everyone has solar paneling strewn across their property. Ironically Germany gets less sun then Seattle; and we get diddly-squat.

Cheers

 

[wabbit]

Solar is fine but try Lighting Power, How many tens of thousands of lightening strikes a year, and each one is full of more power than we can imagine. We need to figure out how to capture & store it. The Midwest could produce more power than anywhere on Earth.

Imagine how much time traveling we could do with that lighting power.

"My De Lorean gets 1000 years per strike, aka 1.21 gigawatts!"

Sorry, it had to be said.

 

[dvpixl]

everyone is doing it except America that's for sure. .. the answer is.. too much money to be made in this and that... but not for long.

I think things are changing tho... as long as everyone stays positive.

When people dont want oil no more, no one can profit from it. . . But that's just one out of millions of other problems that go along with it.