cordvision
Well-known member
I would love to see some pictures of the production unit? Do we get to see them anytime soon?
The reason why I will not buy Redrock
- Thread starter kaimakana
- Start date
hecklenjeckle
Member
shot this today
shot this today
i purchased the redrockM2, focus mount, and several other accessories for my HVX200 last November. spent about $2700, and my only complaint with Redrock was that they don't have a direct phone line to ask questions and clarify what items one may need before purchasing. therefore i did have an issue with needing a $30 part that prevented me from using the full rig once it arrived. certainly had i read through their site thoroughly i might not have run into the problem, but a costumer service line is always helpful. I do seem to recall that the invoice with tracking number was slow to arrive, ie it was not until the next day, and, given that i was anxious about the purchase, i was on edge about what i had bought given that i couldn't talk to a rep about it first prior to shelling out the cash, but everything arrived in a quick and timely fashion. If i could, my only suggestion would be that Redrock set up a costumer service line, and not simply use email. i know that when spending that kinda money for equipment, it is nice to have someone to talk to about when it has shipped, and whether or not one has ordered the right equipment. I would have loved to have known that i was missing a $30 item that would prevent me from using any of the my gear, which set my shooting date back another 5 days. as for the quality of the equipment i'm one happy camper.
heres a screen grab that i just shot today using a 14mm canon ef ultrasonic lens
shot this today
i purchased the redrockM2, focus mount, and several other accessories for my HVX200 last November. spent about $2700, and my only complaint with Redrock was that they don't have a direct phone line to ask questions and clarify what items one may need before purchasing. therefore i did have an issue with needing a $30 part that prevented me from using the full rig once it arrived. certainly had i read through their site thoroughly i might not have run into the problem, but a costumer service line is always helpful. I do seem to recall that the invoice with tracking number was slow to arrive, ie it was not until the next day, and, given that i was anxious about the purchase, i was on edge about what i had bought given that i couldn't talk to a rep about it first prior to shelling out the cash, but everything arrived in a quick and timely fashion. If i could, my only suggestion would be that Redrock set up a costumer service line, and not simply use email. i know that when spending that kinda money for equipment, it is nice to have someone to talk to about when it has shipped, and whether or not one has ordered the right equipment. I would have loved to have known that i was missing a $30 item that would prevent me from using any of the my gear, which set my shooting date back another 5 days. as for the quality of the equipment i'm one happy camper.
heres a screen grab that i just shot today using a 14mm canon ef ultrasonic lens
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As of Feb. 4, 2008 1:44 HST, still no sign of tracking number for product or any sign of product order. Also, viewed product order status page with no updated info.
Brian assured that item was sent out Friday of last week. With that I am assuming a tracking number? At least that's what the order page promised.
I've already postponed my shoot 3 times, banking on what the "orderstatus" dept. told me "it has been sent out" on Thursday, Jan. 31. Also, Brian PM'd me to assure mailout on Friday, Feb. 1st.
Who looks like the fool now??? If RR said they've shipped it out, then where's my tracking number as promised? That way at least I can anticipate it's arrival or maybe not.
Brian assured that item was sent out Friday of last week. With that I am assuming a tracking number? At least that's what the order page promised.
I've already postponed my shoot 3 times, banking on what the "orderstatus" dept. told me "it has been sent out" on Thursday, Jan. 31. Also, Brian PM'd me to assure mailout on Friday, Feb. 1st.
Who looks like the fool now??? If RR said they've shipped it out, then where's my tracking number as promised? That way at least I can anticipate it's arrival or maybe not.
bvalente
DVXuser Sponsor
Hi Folks - from kaimakana just a few minutes ago. As I've stated before great customer service is a continuing goal for Redrock. If there is ever a concern you are always welcome to write to me directly brian@redrockmicro.com
Redrock has been nothing but good to me. I had to send my unit in to get the motor replaced. They had it for maybe 2 days and then overnighted it back to me. I always get a response from them within hours of e-mailing them. As far as I'm concerned, their customer service has been amazing.
cheezweezl
Veteran
i don't know how the general cust svc is at rr. i have only dealt with brian. but i can tell you that he has gone above and beyond for me on multiple occasions. just hit him up and you will get results every time.
A Voice in the Wilderness
Member
Odd...the reason I wont buy a Redrock is:
Poor light performance
Bad Edge to Edge sharpness
Overall Sharpness is low
I guess my reasons are different
Hi,
Have you identified an adapter that performs better than the M2 within a comparable price range? I'm purchasing soon and am open to all suggestions.
Thanks a million.
DVX100B - G5 - FCP Studio 2
hoarp001
Veteran
When i was buying an adapter I considered them all. I ruled out the letus as I thought the unit was pretty ugly and the rails system is really strange. I didn't really like the format of the brevis (the tube) so it was a tossup between the redrock and the SGpro. I thought the redrock was pricey and I didn't really like the way the image was upside down so I decided to go for the SGpro with the flip unit and follow focus and it was still a lot cheaper than the redrock and I believe (and quite a few others do too) that the SGpro is better. I think the SG footage is more film like than the redrock....
SGpro.
SGpro.
Chris Santucci
Veteran
I've been using the M2 for a few years now and I've researched the other adapters quite a bit and it seems to me that they ALL have their own drawbacks and idiosyncrasies. The most comparable I could find to the M2 in terms of the quality of imagery I've seen is the Letus. Some people swear that the M2 is not as good as the Letus and some swear that the Letus is not as good as the M2. I have yet to see a clear example of someone's footage that supports either assertion.
I really don't have a problem with the upside down imagery the M2 produces and I'd be reluctant to add yet another mass of reflective surfaces or lenses to the optical path. Monitoring the upside down footage is easy and not even mildly annoying anymore to me and flipping it in post is easy also.
I'm not sure how the SG Pro can be better than the M2 or how it can produce more film-like imagery since it's basically the exact same design. The M2 is rock solid in terms of construction as opposed to the cheaper SG Pro.
One other thing to consider is the fact that you'll see more M2 adapters in rental houses than any of the other adapters which says a lot about its design, construction, and quality of footage it produces.
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cordvision
Well-known member
Have you ever used an SGpro? I personally found the SGpro to be better built than the m2 and I had the chance to "play" with both....
I thought the same thing... til I sold my M2 and bought the Letus Ex. As much as I loved my M2 and still use Redrock products... it's time for Redrock to step it up with a new adapter. Try using a Letus Ex or SG Pro for a week, then try going back to your M2. =\ I LOVE Redrock equipment. I can't wait for the Mattebox to go with my RR Follow Focus. There's no better choice for me in those areas but the LetusEx and SGpro are definitely ahead.
The M2, however, is good enough.
I think that Nathan Beaman reported his MicroX flip helped to produce even sharper footage from his M2. That's adding more glass, prisms, etc. Sounds weird, but try it... you may change your mind.
M2's build looks better than the SGpro to me as far as construction goes. I'll agree with ya on that. However similar they may be they are not the exact same design.
No one is doubting that the M2 still produces great imagery. It's old now, though. The reason that there are so many in rental houses is the same reason why the unit is in magazines, etc: Great marketing.
That's one thing that Redrock stomps on everyone with. Nobody Markets their product better than Redrock does at this point. That said, all of those rental houses will suggest you rent a Mini35 before an M2 openly... even with more light loss.
There's definitely a difference, this is coming from a recent M2 owner and one that still uses Redrock products ritually.
hoarp001
Veteran
The box and the way it functions may be the same across the SG and redrock but the image is projected onto the disk, and the disk in both adapters is certainly not the same. Its all about the opacity and grain and properties of the disk, and the disk in the SG and RR are certainly not the same.
If you look at this redrock vs SGpro shootout, you will see a very apparent difference in image quality/'look'. Its up to you to decide which one is filmier, its personal preference but I prefer the SG.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEUsegXyfV4
Postmaster
Dark Side of the Camera
Yeah, the GG makes all the difference.
I have a Kobold Light - Frost Glass as GG in one of my modified spinning adapters and that looks like early 50s Technicolor.
Here are some shots I done for a friends Speed Shop.
Since everything he does is pretty old school he wanted it to look like 40s and 50s commercials.
No colorcorrection or filtering - only the "raw" P2 of the HVX.
Frank
I have a Kobold Light - Frost Glass as GG in one of my modified spinning adapters and that looks like early 50s Technicolor.
Here are some shots I done for a friends Speed Shop.
Since everything he does is pretty old school he wanted it to look like 40s and 50s commercials.
No colorcorrection or filtering - only the "raw" P2 of the HVX.
Frank
Attachments
Chris Santucci
Veteran
Chris Santucci
Veteran
Are you saying the SG Pro and Letus are significantly better than the M2?
What online examples do you know of that supports that assertion?
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No online assertions. My own eye assertions, though. I can also point you to several owners that have switched from M2 to SGpro based on the fact that they are NOT optically the same.
Also, this is definitely subjective. You may prefer a softer look to your footage, I do now prefer a sharper image because of the degrading that occurs when post comes into play. Also, sharper's a little better for projection when considering an HVX.
Once you do sharpening in Camera the image looks "meh". You have to do a fair amount with the M2, with the Letus I can afford to drop to -2 on the in camera detail and still get a great image. Thus, reducing artifacts caused by detail enhancement.
However, by your use of the word "Assertion" I surmise that you're completely happy with the M2 and that you have no intent of acknowledging the possibility of another adapter superseding the quality. Translation: I ain't about to spend the time convincing you. =B
Worst thing you can do as a filmmaker is ignore the progress of technology. And the Letus and SGpro show obvious signs of progress over the M2.
Redrock gear is incredible, like I said I use it ritually and even used one on a shoot with a PL mount after my Extreme died on me (user error!!! NOTE USER ERROR!)). I love my Followfocus, can't WAIT for the RR Mattebox.
The M2 needs to grow up, at this point. I wouldn't doubt an M3 on the very near horizon, however.
Chris Santucci
Veteran
Dude, when I say "assertion," I mean - statement. Like, you say something is true, and I question what you say, as in - I need proof to agree with you.
That's all. I only ask for proof, in part because I'm NOT disagreeing with you. I'm actually being discriminating and looking for the best option for a lens adapter without having the benefit of hands on experience with more than just the M2.
And that's pretty funny about me preferring softer footage...
I've seen some really nice footage from the Letus and I have issues with soft edges just like anyone else. Footage I've seen from the SG Pro and Letus seems to have slightly soft edges on the same plane of focus but apparently less fall off and I'd agree that the Letus footage appears to be sharper than the M2 footage.
This is one of the best examples of Letus footage I've seen yet.
http://downloads.letusdirect.com/extreme/featured/letusdirect720.mp4
I'm having a real hard time finding some exceptional SG Pro footage online and their website won't play the example clips in either of the browsers I use.
To tell you the truth, I'm leaning towards the Letus 35 Extreme pretty heavily and I appreciate your feedback because I AM a little tired of the softness and vignetting.
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You have to download the footage from the sgpro website. Click on the link under "footage details" that says "link: please right click and 'save as.'"