starcentral
Veteran
Theoretically not having to zoom as far onto the screen would mean less grain pattern would it not?
Extreme Vs Brevis
- Thread starter johnnyspack
- Start date
Barry_Green
Moderator
No, not necessarily -- I mean, within any particular adapter/camera combo then yes, but if you're talking about different adapters then it doesn't matter how far you have to zoom in -- once you've zoomed in such that you're filling the frame, the grain pattern will be the same size to that camera's sensor as it would be to another camera that didn't have to zoom in so far.
Hopefully you followed that...
Of course, zooming in further is less preferable for a different reason, which is the loss of wide-open f-stop that happens the further you have to zoom.
Hopefully you followed that...
Of course, zooming in further is less preferable for a different reason, which is the loss of wide-open f-stop that happens the further you have to zoom.
Jason Ramsey
Admin
I think the problem is that the flip unit isn't out yet, and I believe the unit he has been testing with doesn't have the spec optics yet which are on the way now, so the zoom level is different with the test version than what the final number would be. Hence no ability to give you an answer yet as the final retail version isn't yet available.
Later,
Jason
Later,
Jason
Lenilenapi
Carbonite Member
In theory the Brevis, Redrock and Letus all can do full SLR image size (I'm not using the word vistavision anymore because I saw some definition of it here and it wasn't what i expected.)
My SGPro Rev 2 doesn't get that wide, but i don't know about a Rev3.
However it depends on whether the adapter is centered. I did fine with redrock and Brevis but my Letus is so off center that I'm not getting anything like full SLR. I don't know if its 35 academy or not, might be wider - I haven't tested because I don't care about the academy thing. It is a problem for me, but frankly I suspect that Letus will engineerr some kind of fix. ZThose guys are very industrious. Hien already talked to me about milling an offset adapter ring .
My SGPro Rev 2 doesn't get that wide, but i don't know about a Rev3.
However it depends on whether the adapter is centered. I did fine with redrock and Brevis but my Letus is so off center that I'm not getting anything like full SLR. I don't know if its 35 academy or not, might be wider - I haven't tested because I don't care about the academy thing. It is a problem for me, but frankly I suspect that Letus will engineerr some kind of fix. ZThose guys are very industrious. Hien already talked to me about milling an offset adapter ring .
PappasArts
Veteran
If I recall Dennis said back in October that late November the correct optics should be in his hands and in quantity. So very soon the flip will be out I assume. I can't wait, the last footage was very promising. The Cinevate Brevis is an amazing tool, and the PL lens mount I can't wait to use....
Pappas
Pappas
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
Papa, Jason is correct...and I apologize for missing the question. The final optics will change what we're seing right now (approx. 20% less zoom-in) as they're optimized in three ways:
1. Chromatic correction.
2. Spherical correction.
3. Zoom-in levels and tolerance for smaller image frames...without using a spacer ring
What I can tell you is that our light loss quotes so far use the same framing with and without the adapter..so in that sense we've dealt with the zoom-in loss by doing this. I can also confirm that the .7 to .9 stops of loss we're seing (that's including the 50mm lens, and zoom-in factor) will actually be less with the final optics when used with camera's like the XH-A1. The optical engineer had a highly defined objective before he even started work with the modelling software. What most folks don't realize is that this footage was shot with a test rig that was less than ideal with respect to optics...that's why we're so excited about the shipping version.
On another note, our machine shop has brought a new high speed CNC mill online this week to handle all the extra milling chores as the flip modules are the most machine-intense project we've ever done. They start off as two billet blocks of aluminum about half the size of a brick and are milled down to what I can best describe as a piece of functional art. The rather long lead time of the project has allowed us a bit of breathing room to get our new facility finished and get two new staff fully trained before the craziness begins. Our clean-flow bench has now become a small clean-flow room .... another requirement to get the adapter and flip assembled to our standards of cleanliness.
Lenny, the alignment issue is one that we've dealt with based on all the data we have from our existing customers...I can promise perfect alignment, and FOV better than SLR film, with every cam out there. The alignment issue is something we feel is very important as it can dramatically change the zoom level required. It's a factor that I've been talking about in light loss comparisons between adapters for some time now. Research on the issue with cams like the HV20 (constant aperture) reveal that although aperture may remain the same, edge falloff is very dramatic as zoom in levels are increased. What this tells us is that extra zoom in with cams like the HV20 make edge falloff an impossible issue to get rid of...it's inherent in the camera's lens, and no adapter can fix it. In other words, less zoom-in can yield image improvements in ways that many shooters would not predict
1. Chromatic correction.
2. Spherical correction.
3. Zoom-in levels and tolerance for smaller image frames...without using a spacer ring
What I can tell you is that our light loss quotes so far use the same framing with and without the adapter..so in that sense we've dealt with the zoom-in loss by doing this. I can also confirm that the .7 to .9 stops of loss we're seing (that's including the 50mm lens, and zoom-in factor) will actually be less with the final optics when used with camera's like the XH-A1. The optical engineer had a highly defined objective before he even started work with the modelling software. What most folks don't realize is that this footage was shot with a test rig that was less than ideal with respect to optics...that's why we're so excited about the shipping version.
On another note, our machine shop has brought a new high speed CNC mill online this week to handle all the extra milling chores as the flip modules are the most machine-intense project we've ever done. They start off as two billet blocks of aluminum about half the size of a brick and are milled down to what I can best describe as a piece of functional art. The rather long lead time of the project has allowed us a bit of breathing room to get our new facility finished and get two new staff fully trained before the craziness begins. Our clean-flow bench has now become a small clean-flow room .... another requirement to get the adapter and flip assembled to our standards of cleanliness.
Lenny, the alignment issue is one that we've dealt with based on all the data we have from our existing customers...I can promise perfect alignment, and FOV better than SLR film, with every cam out there. The alignment issue is something we feel is very important as it can dramatically change the zoom level required. It's a factor that I've been talking about in light loss comparisons between adapters for some time now. Research on the issue with cams like the HV20 (constant aperture) reveal that although aperture may remain the same, edge falloff is very dramatic as zoom in levels are increased. What this tells us is that extra zoom in with cams like the HV20 make edge falloff an impossible issue to get rid of...it's inherent in the camera's lens, and no adapter can fix it. In other words, less zoom-in can yield image improvements in ways that many shooters would not predict
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PappasArts
Veteran
" What this tells us is that extra zoom in with cams like the HV20 make edge falloff an impossible issue to get rid of... """
Dennis maybe Im reading this wrong. Are you saying that the HV20 doesn't perform good with the flip or it does...?
Dennis maybe Im reading this wrong. Are you saying that the HV20 doesn't perform good with the flip or it does...?
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
The HV20 is amazing with our flip...but if you use it on another adapter requiring a high degree of zoom-in, you'll get serious edge falloff from the HV20 lens itself! In other words, correct alignment and less optical zoom in both improve image performance with the little cam. I was so impressed with HV20 (and predicted high demand for a solution) that we even manufacture a one-piece 43-72 step up ring for it.
The Brevis is the only adapter that has a specific setup for the HV20 and the other small HD cams...they do need one for full frame performance at all focal lengths.
The Brevis is the only adapter that has a specific setup for the HV20 and the other small HD cams...they do need one for full frame performance at all focal lengths.
I wonder if that'll change soon. Lots of people investing an HV20's, gotta have as many choices to go with it as the large format cams.
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Oynk
Well-known member
Wow. I am really on the fence between these two adapters. I need to purchase in the next two weeks. I really cant decide. I like that the Letus is an 'all in one' package, but I am still looking at the Brevis. It is so hard to make a purchase like this without using one.
It appears anecdotally that whatever people buy, they like.
I just don't know. Maybe I will flip a coin....
It appears anecdotally that whatever people buy, they like.
I just don't know. Maybe I will flip a coin....
puredrifting
Major Contributor
Hi Oynk:
No need for tearing your hair out, either one is a great solution. I own the LEX but was seriously considering the Brevis. I am very happy with the LEX but I would also be just as happy with the Brevis and the flip. Dennis has moved forward with Cinevate, hiring new staff and improving his shop and The Le Bros are also improving their product on an almost weekly basis.
I seriously think you will be very happy with either. I only ordered the LEX because it was before Dennis announced the Brevis flip.
Flip a coin.
Dan
PappasArts
Veteran
starcentral
Veteran
What's the difference between Letus 35 mini and Letus extreme flip?
Oynk
Well-known member
Since this thread was comparing Letus and Brevis....
What would be the advantage of buying either a Letus Mini or Letus Extreme vs. a Brevis which would work on both large and small cameras?
If you own, let's say, an A1 and an HV20, doesn't this seal the deal for the Brevis?
I am still deciding so I am really interested in other opinions.
What would be the advantage of buying either a Letus Mini or Letus Extreme vs. a Brevis which would work on both large and small cameras?
If you own, let's say, an A1 and an HV20, doesn't this seal the deal for the Brevis?
I am still deciding so I am really interested in other opinions.
DeGrey
Well-known member
The Letus Extreme works on smaller cameras as well.
We made the Mini for those who wanted a smaller adapter for their smaller cameras and didn't have a need for an adapter of a larger size.
If you own an A1 and a HV20 and want to us both cameras with an adapter, you would want to get the Extreme over the Mini as the Extreme would work on both. However, if you JUST had a HV20 with no plans of using a larger camera, the Mini would be the better fit.
We made the Mini for those who wanted a smaller adapter for their smaller cameras and didn't have a need for an adapter of a larger size.
If you own an A1 and a HV20 and want to us both cameras with an adapter, you would want to get the Extreme over the Mini as the Extreme would work on both. However, if you JUST had a HV20 with no plans of using a larger camera, the Mini would be the better fit.
Oynk
Well-known member
Gotcha. I didn't know that. Thanks.
Barry_Green
Moderator
Nothing's changed about the extreme, it works on all cams, they've just introduced a smaller version for those who don't want to bolt a 3.3-pound adapter on the front of their mini-cam. You could probably easily hand-hold a Letis Mini/HV20 combo, or even one of the smaller cams like an HSC1U, with no need for rails etc.