Coollights 1200 HMI Par?

Hi Macville,

I know your chief interest is the 1200w HMI fresnel and I remember the conversation. I was hoping to have two this time, just for you, but I ran into a snag in getting certain of the aluminum extrusions necessary to produce the fixture body. These are such an unusual design that you can't find them on the shelf, so to speak. So, we're missing some key parts to bring it together in other words. The electronics are done but we're missing the darn fixture! I really want this to be right so I'm not cobbling together "frankenfresnels" which I could do as a last resort. In other words, I could take some 2000w tungsten units and transform them into a 1200w, but it wouldn't be the ultimate product for mass production and support. It wouldn't have all those finishing touches of something that rolls off an assembly line. So I'm patiently waiting until we can get the extrusions necessary to complete that fixture. The main issue with HMI fixture bodies is where do you hide the ignitor? Most designs opt to put it in a larger base (larger than the tungsten equivalent)--underneath the focusing mechanism.

As people will see when the final pictures of the 575w fresnel come out that I'm fairly serious about what I'm doing here. I would already have them up on the site, but I'm in a place right now where my computer resources are limited.

Otherwise, one major unit I have planned for next year that some will be interested in is another of the "CDM" line (you will see my metal halides divided squarely into two lines: CDM (the more advanced technology) or HMI (the older technology). I personally prefer the CDM line because you get longer life bulbs for instance. The only drawback is that many of the bulbs are larger so therefore more complex to design into the compact fixtures that the American market loves. To do a 1200w with a CDM bulb is a very very large bulb.

Anyway, the next CDM unit will be a 250w which will be the functional equivalent of a 1000w tungsten fresnel. It will be in the same package as our tungsten 1000w fresnel and have an included ballast in a separate box. I started with the 150w CDM because its a great way to introduce this technology to anyone that loves 650w sized fresnels but would like to reduce the heat / infrared output. And we could easily achieve the goal of a small wattage, HMI-like instrument, with long bulb life for significantly under $500 too.

I also need to finish up both the 575w SportLight project which has been waiting for my attention and the 575w economy par as well which needs a bit of redesign to make the lenses easier to put on and take off and also needs a better place to hide the ever present ignitor.

I know many of you prefer the 1200w solutions and we are going to do those but I'm holding out for the most professional solutions that are supportable as well. I am shipping one 1200w par and 110v/220v universal voltage pro ballast to the states this time for stock but no lenses yet which, as I said before is the main thing missing to finish that off as a product.
 
Richard,

Are your 1200 watt ballasts compatible with any other manufactures 1200 heads such as arri, mole, or cinemills?
 
Cool Lights said:
I also need to finish up both the 575w SportLight project which has been waiting for my attention and the 575w economy par as well which needs a bit of redesign to make the lenses easier to put on and take off and also needs a better place to hide the ever present ignitor.

I know many of you prefer the 1200w solutions and we are going to do those but I'm holding out for the most professional solutions that are supportable as well. I am shipping one 1200w par and 110v/220v universal voltage pro ballast to the states this time for stock but no lenses yet which, as I said before is the main thing missing to finish that off as a product.
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Thanks for the update! I didn't realize that you were doing an economy PAR, how are you going about that? (are you basically using the non-pro, fan driven ballast?) My main need for HMI's are to equal out lighting from indoors to outdoors so I'm not blowing out the background when I show a window (plus, being able to light when I'm shooting outdoors. That's why I am pushing for a 1200 watt solution because I like the thought of 5k worth of light! We do need the lens for operation, correct? My understanding is that they filter UV and without them our skin could be burned by the light.

Thanks,

Matthew
 
Bucknfl said:
Richard,

Are your 1200 watt ballasts compatible with any other manufactures 1200 heads such as arri, mole, or cinemills?
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I doubt that. It would all depend upon the ignitor in the lamp head and whether it can work with the ballast or not. I don't have a way to test that right now. At worst, it would probably require swapping out the ignitor to work with the one we use.
 
Macville said:
Thanks for the update! I didn't realize that you were doing an economy PAR, how are you going about that? (are you basically using the non-pro, fan driven ballast?) My main need for HMI's are to equal out lighting from indoors to outdoors so I'm not blowing out the background when I show a window (plus, being able to light when I'm shooting outdoors. That's why I am pushing for a 1200 watt solution because I like the thought of 5k worth of light! We do need the lens for operation, correct? My understanding is that they filter UV and without them our skin could be burned by the light.

Thanks,

Matthew
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Yes I talked about the economy par a couple of times. It's a cast aluminum and common fixture body I found here in China that I intend to adapt to HMI and film lighting use. Very attractive unit and very tough but mostly meant for studio/stage use. No, it isn't a par can--its a lot better than that. I don't have a picture at the moment but you can see the early prototype in my 2nd or 3rd article in my blog on the $500 metal halide fresnel project. Anyway, right now it requires changing the lenses in a complicated fashion. I intend to add a new accessory adapter to the front and metal frames on the lenses to allow drop in lenses that are super easy to change--like on the SportLight 575 and many other modern par designs. The barndoors will go in front of the lens on the new accessory adapter. Change 2 requires adding a small housing to the back for an ignitor. After that, we have the economy par which should go in the $699 range to go along with the $699 fresnel. Both using similar ballasts but the fresnel being a 575w HR and the par being a 575w cold strike. We simply can't fit the larger G22 socket into the par right now--so no hot restrike there. But you will have a 575w par for under $700 though.

On the 1200w, when I say it doesn't have lenses, I mean the wide, narrow and diffused types that often come with HMI pars. Right now, there is a safety UV protection glass on the unit so people should be fine but the effect may not be so good without the ability to tune the light as you may wish using one of those snap in modifying lenses. This is one very bright fixture though. The effect is somewhat of a spotlight right now without the other lenses to change the light in various ways.
 
Cool Lights said:
On the 1200w, when I say it doesn't have lenses, I mean the wide, narrow and diffused types that often come with HMI pars. Right now, there is a safety UV protection glass on the unit so people should be fine but the effect may not be so good without the ability to tune the light as you may wish using one of those snap in modifying lenses. This is one very bright fixture though. The effect is somewhat of a spotlight right now without the other lenses to change the light in various ways.
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Thanks for the info. I'm normally on camera, so I've never worked with HMI's, but I've seen grips putting them up. I'm guessing that my two uses for a 1200 are going to be shooting them thru a silk for nice defused light and just plain hard light to help fill the sunlight. So obviously I need the lenses because most of the time I would want hard light I would want it wide and not spotted.

I am really looking forward to these lights as I've had at least two shoots this year that I needed some HMI's, but didn't have any.

Matthew
 
Hey Richard, I was going to email you this, but thought other people might like to know the answer also. What size is the scrim holder on the 575 HMI, and 1200 PAR? I'm looking at speed rings for softboxes and wanted to see if I could get adjustable SP's instead of fixed ones for certain lights.

Matthew
 
Yes sir. 335mm on the 1200w par. 197mm on the 575w hmi fresnel. And finally, will be 229 on the 1200w fresnel when we finish it. In short, they're just what you'd expect.

I have the factory working on a sample 1200w HMI fresnel right now. We'll see how long it takes them. If they can build that, I'll commission a 2nd one and then you're in business. Its not an electrical challenge at all, its purely a "can we find all the metal parts we need" challenge. Next year all this should get easier than it is right now.
 
Cool Lights said:
Yes sir. 335mm on the 1200w par. 197mm on the 575w hmi fresnel. And finally, will be 229 on the 1200w fresnel when we finish it. In short, they're just what you'd expect.

I have the factory working on a sample 1200w HMI fresnel right now. We'll see how long it takes them. If they can build that, I'll commission a 2nd one and then you're in business. Its not an electrical challenge at all, its purely a "can we find all the metal parts we need" challenge. Next year all this should get easier than it is right now.
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Do you think this would still work even though you are getting 229mm on the fresnel (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/214774-REG/Photoflex_VCADJUST2M_Speed_Ring_Video_.html)

Right now I've budgeted for the PAR, but if you can bring in the fresnel for a few hundred less, then I'll be happy! I'm looking at the start of march to be buying (my RED shipping date!)

Matthew
 
Richard,

I noticed that B&H sells lense sets for 1200 pars made by Arri and Desisti. Any idea if these would fit the coolights 1200 par?
 
Buck,

Very good chance indeed. How much were they and was the size 250mm? Were they the snap in kind or the drop in kind? My par is a snap in type design.

Matthew,

Looks like it might work but may be just on the edge. 229mm is just tad bit larger than 9" at 9.016".

I'm building 4 1200w fresnels right now. 2 G38 sockets (HR type) with pro ballasts just like the one used on the par and 2 with semi pro ballasts and G22 socket (non HR) type bulb. These 4 will miss the current shipment of products which is leaving tomorrow but should be ready to tag along with our shipment of carrying cases in January so unless some part comes up hard to find, we can beat March by a month and a half.
 
Looks like it might work but may be just on the edge. 229mm is just tad bit larger than 9" at 9.016".

I'm building 4 1200w fresnels right now. 2 G38 sockets (HR type) with pro ballasts just like the one used on the par and 2 with semi pro ballasts and G22 socket (non HR) type bulb. These 4 will miss the current shipment of products which is leaving tomorrow but should be ready to tag along with our shipment of carrying cases in January so unless some part comes up hard to find, we can beat March by a month and a half.
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I was thinking...exactly what do those measurements mean? Is that 229 the biggest part across or the smallest part across the barndoor holder? Look at the attached image...is it A, or B? http://www.macvilleproductions.com/example.jpg

What are you expecting on pricing on the HR and non HR so I can update my budget? Also, whenever you can get the size for the 575's and ballast for it, I'd like to know so I can find a case for it (actually, I've got budgeted two of thoses and 1 1.2k)

Thanks,

Matthew
 
Hi Matthew,

The size of 229mm means the measurement from the inside of the left accessory holder to the inside of the right accessory holder. It's roughly the size of the barndoors because they fit in the same accessory holder.

I don't have the sizes in inches at the moment but the 575w semi pro ballast is 315mm x 110mm wide x 67.5 mm high. There is also a handle on the top which adds about 60mm to the height so the real height is about 130mm lets say. You can convert those to inches accordingly. I don't have the measurements for the pro 575/1200 ballast with me at the moment but its rather large. If you're going to be getting that one and making a case for it I'll need to get back to you on that. I have the measurements but I also need to give you the extra size for the custom cut EPE foam we pack them in which is adds about 2" extra to the measurements on all sides. You'll want to include that extra padding for your case to make sure it's well padded for travel and shipping.
 
Hey Richard, I wanted to check to make sure I am looking at the correct globes for the 575's, and to ask what lamp I will need for the 1200...

For the 575 I found this: HMI575W/SE Single Ended Hot Restrike CSR575SE/HR 48463 CSR575/SE/HR 95V 750 Hours 48000 Initial Lumens 43200 Mean Lumens 6000°K T9.5 G22 MOL 5.71"

All that for ONLY $135.30!

Thanks,

Matthew
 
Macville said:
Hey Richard, I wanted to check to make sure I am looking at the correct globes for the 575's, and to ask what lamp I will need for the 1200...

For the 575 I found this: HMI575W/SE Single Ended Hot Restrike CSR575SE/HR 48463 CSR575/SE/HR 95V 750 Hours 48000 Initial Lumens 43200 Mean Lumens 6000°K T9.5 G22 MOL 5.71"

All that for ONLY $135.30!

Thanks,

Matthew
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Yes thats the one and about the price we are selling the few we have for. Don't have too many in stock. We did however have one customer find this which is about $120:

http://www.dentertainmentgroup.com/Expendables/LampsMetalHalide.htm

As far as the 1200 goes you would need the G38 HMI1200W/SE. Seems to go for about $190 from the same link above. That is a hot restrike type.

We should probably talk in more detail soon about what you're needing and when so we can make sure we have it here in time. I seem to recall you were needing the 1200s by February. You can contact me any time via richard@coollights.biz so we can further discuss all these products and what you're needing. You can also call me at 877-272-1419 if you prefer.
 
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