Critique my script, please...

You know what? I'm really starting to sound defensive here, aren't I? And that's not what I want to do at all. Believe me, I'm not just looking for platitudes -- I truly do want to know what people see as the weaknesses of the script. I'll explain, and even defend, the positions I adopted when writing the script -- but only in the context of a debate where we each explain why we feel the way we do. If I can see your points, I will massage the script in whatever ways will make it better.

That being said, nothing can ever make the script perfect for everyone, obviously. But I do appreciate all the input, and the time and energy you have all expended to read the script and post your thoughts here. I hope we can keep the good, constructive dialogue going.
 
David,

I just finished the script and I want to give you some of my immediate thoughts. I purposely have not read any of the previous comments, but I did catch a glance of some discussion about the length of the script. I'll address that first since that is one of the top issues on my list. What you currently have is too short for a feature length film, especially because this is a dialogue driven piece. That being said, I really don't think you should lengthen it. Here's why... you basically have one simple concept here - a battered wife who is having an affair. If I were to go back to the script to count the pages, I would say you established this concept within the first 15 pages of the script. After that, everything was a regurgitation of this concept until the last scene. I don't want to come off too harsh, but I want you to think of this from an audience's point of view; 70 pages of that is boring. Without adding any elements to the story, I would suggest cutting it down to 15-20 pages and reworking the scenes and dialogue that you have. If you want to keep it feature-length, then truthfully, you've got a lot more work ahead of you.
 
OK, I got up for a few minutes and I realized I had a few more 'initial' thoughts I want to touch on. #1) Did I read the script correctly? Did the whole thing basically take on the POV of the webcam? I hope that I am wrong, because I would not suggest that. Even 15-20 minutes of that would be too much. #2) I remember in my first screenwriting class one of the mottos of my teacher would always impart upon us was "Make me care". If I learned nothing else from that class, I will always remember that statement. If I'm giving you honest feedback on this script, I'd have to share that with you, because frankly, right now I don't care. The one person I should care about above and beyond all else (Shannon) doesn't really have anything for me to care about. OK, she's in an abusive relationship... seen it waaay too many times just to make that good enough. Her very brief moment in the beginning of the script with her kids was rather cliche, so I can't even use that as something to relate to. As far as the abuse is concerned, you have basically told the reader that she is abused, and we are left to wonder if it is physical abuse or just verbal. Not until midway through the script do we even get an 'abuse' scene to clarify that point. Why do we like her? Use "Sleeping with the Enemy" as an example - and I'll argue that this is NOT the best example, but nevertheless... we get a good 10 minutes to warm up to Julia Roberts before we find out she is in a similar situation as Shannon, and when we do it comes with a bang, not just a complaint to a friend.

E
 
Last edited:
IBE, thanks for your input. I'll mull over it.

Meanwhile, I started reading your script. Here's what I've come up with so far...

I don't understand why bother with the opening scene? It only seems to be a few seconds long, and doesn't seem to have a point. What is there to grab the viewer's attention? A 'seemingly' dead body? No matter how attractive the victim might have been, nobody cares about her (yet). I just don't get the hook.

"Pullman four-door" -- a railroad car??? Might help to say "Mercedes Pullman four-door", if that's the car you mean.

Mention the long black overcoats in the first description of Reno and Gypsy Jack.

Too much description of set dressings that are irrelevant to the story.

A man comes to Archie's secretary and wants to hand a note to Archie personally because 'it's important' -- yet we don't get to see Archie go to the outer office, meet the man, and receive the note. We just have to sit looking at Archie's empty office -- where nothing is going on -- until he returns. That bothers me. Any particular reason?

I can't visualize seeing any readable words on a piece of paper that has been crumpled up and tossed at a trash can.

It reads a bit more like a book than a script to me...

"Although it seems that Georgia’s menopause has struck years early, it is obvious that her menopause is about to turn into meno-play." How is a director going to convey this information to an audience???

"Archie is atop Georgia: his face labored, her’s bored." I think you need to describe a little more of what Archie is actually doing. Could be he's just lying there. Or he could be....busy.

I'm confused about the era this story takes place in. Everyone talks, for the most part, like they're out of an old noir-style period. And yet once in awhile someone says something like "Be quick about your bad self.", which is a decidedly modern turn of a phrase. Also, everybody seems to talk the same -- like out of an old noir movie. Everybody has personality, but they're all the same personality. Nobody seems to have any unique, interesting or entertaining quirks. I have that problem with my characters' dialogue too.

Some of the names and things leave me cold. "The Spicy Whiteboy"? "HOTTER THAN A THREE-PECKERED BILLY GOAT"? "The Grand Poobah"? Makes the whole thing seem cheesy, in my opinion. But that's just me.

"Better men than you haven’t walked out of this office after a crack like that." It's an uncomfortable line -- doesn't flow well. Not sure how to fix it, but it sticks out glaringly, in my opinion.

I agree with Poobah -- why on Earth would Georgia go to a dangerous scum like him if all she needs is someone to take some compromising photos? It doesn't make sense, and I don't understand her explanation.

Well, talk about not caring about any of the characters.... I'm hitting page 20, and if a bus hit the lot of them I wouldn't care at all. I didn't care when the General got killed. I didn't care when Max Fickle got caught by Reno and Gypsy Jack. I don't care that Archie has a girlfriend on the side. I don't care about Georgia. Who is the 'hero' of this thing supposed to be? There doesn't seem to be a savory character in the lot.

"Bowser pulls a bell from is pocket and RINGS it." Who the heck is Bowser??? He seems to have appeared out of nowhere.

Poobah and his boys have been looking for someone named Maxwell Fickle -- so when Max Jr. tells them his name, why would Poobah say "Maxwell Fickle, Jr.? Sounds like the name of a faggot sailor" as though he'd never heard such an odd-sounding name before???

Then Poobah says "Maxwell Fickle, Jr. Then your father must be Maxwell Fickle, Sr.?" Ummm...duh.

Backtracking for a second -- how is the audience supposed to know that the apartment Max Jr entered actually belonged to Max Sr.?

"Max watches Reno root through a file cabinet." I think you need to describe Reno walking over to the file cabinet, wherever it's located, and opening it.

"DO NOT BE AFRAID OF SUDDEN TERROR, NOR OF TROUBLE FROM THE WICKED WHEN IT COMES." That's a lot to expect an audience to be able to read off a tiny piece of paper from a fortune cookie. Especially on the small screen.

It doesn't seem well established that Archie is an elected official -- at least, not before Georgia makes a passing remark to Poobah about it. I wasn't absolutely sure at that point that she was talking about Archie, since it hadn't been established prior to that exactly what it is that Archie does. Unless I missed it.

BTW, I don't think it's necessary to put establishing shots in the script as scenes. Establishing shots are a given -- they might get put into a shooting script, but not into the preliminary script. Unless, of course, something happens in that shot or it is needed to establish something other than the location for the scene that follows. For instance, if Reno and Gypsy Jack were sitting in a car outside of Bowser's Pawn Shop, watching the building, then that would be important. But just establishing that we're at Bowser's Pawn Shop is unnecessary.

You don't describe Max entering the pawn shop. He's just suddenly there.
The first scene in Bowser's Pawn Shop seems pointless and ends abruptly. It doesn't seem adequate.

Okay, I'm up to pg 35 and I still don't know who I'm supposed to care about. I still don't care about any of 'em.

Hmmmm....Bowser the pawnbroker says to Max that Poobah says Max should go home. Consensus seems to be Poobah plans to kill Max. So why does Max just obligingly trot on home and wait for the killers to show up? I know I wouldn't.

A BOOK called "How To Get Rid Of A Body"??? No offense man, but puhhhleezzzze!

"Archie hands Max an envelope. Max slips the picture out. It’s the advertisement of Rose, which was switched out, apparently unbeknownst to Archie. Max slips it back in and sets it on the counter." How do we know it was supposed to be a photo of Archie's wife??? Why should we think it's supposed to be anything different than what it is -- a photo of Rose???

"Why not? She sings outta tune." Archie's wife is Georgia. Georgia sings??? Since when? We know Rose sings, but never heard that about Georgia. I'm confused!

"Fifty-four cents? Since when does a paper cost fifty-four cents?" "Twenty-nine cents tax?" So Max doesn't know how much a newspaper costs??? What's the point of this?

Okay, I've hit page 43 and that's about all I can do tonight. I still don't know who I'm supposed to care about -- I still don't care about anybody. I don't find the plot compelling after nearly 45 minutes. I guess Max needs to get money before the end of the weekend or else he's dead, but I don't care if he succeeds or fails. Anyway, I'll pick up tomorrow where I left off.

You've got a gift for writing, IBE, but I'm just not getting involved by this story. Wish I could say I was.
 
I'm still reading it now, but just wanted to suggest that you check out a show that was on Canadian TV that used webcams exclusively as well... can't remember what it was called, but they interacted solely through webcams with other characters interacting in the background too. Interestingly, it was in HD quality and didn't have that grainy low-quality look associated with webcams, but just the actors talking into the camera to each other (and to us directly... Spike Lee!) played on a new level of audience interactivity that I thought was great.

It was a great concept and it definitely works to grab the audience in a sense of realism. So you're on the right track :)

And what you have going is great with the OS voices and that "stealth mode". Very creepy!
 
Last edited:
Picking back up on page 43...

Did Rose take the $200 from Bowser or not? It's not clear. What was with the pearl handled knife? Where did Rose get it? What's its significance? And other than identifying Bowser as Rose's father, what's the point of this scene?

"The whole of the setting longs for a past that never really existed." Again, I don't understand what this means or how the director is supposed to convey it to an audience.

"...an impending look of doom across his face." I think you mean "a look of impending doom".

Pg. 49 -- how can it go from Max driving his car to Max playing solitaire on the hood of his car, and the scene be labelled "CONTINUOUS"??? Time has clearly passed between those two scenes. Better to slug it "EXT. COCOON CIRCLE - LATER".

"The ACCELERATION of a taxi kicks up dust as it propels toward the cabin. Rose exits the taxi." Ummm...does the taxi STOP first? Or does Rose leap out at speed and roll a few dozen yards? Inquiring minds want to know.

MAX: "Everything we see is just a shadow cast by that which we do not." Huh??? What the...? Max is sitting all alone on a deserted road in the middle of nowhere, and out of the blue he decided to wax poetic with this cryptic comment? I don't get it.

ROSE: "I believe our shadows dance when we’re not looking." This comes completely out of left field. Is she drunk? High on drugs? The statement makes no sense in the context of the conversation, as near as I can tell.

Pg. 51 -- I can't envision a piece of furniture coming between Rose and the gun in Max's hand in such a way that it prevents her from seeing it. I'm sure it could be done, but I'm just not able to see it. Better, I think, to just have Max turn slightly sideways to hide the gun from her.

Pg. 53 -- "She goes to the table to refill." Why? There's been no indication she drank the last bit she poured into her glass.

Pg. 60 -- How did Max get the car started???

Why did you bother to give Shamus Rigby a name? Since his name is never said in dialogue, the audience isn't going to recognize it in the credits.

"Shamus drops both guns. Max secures his gun..." C'mon...let's have a little description of action here! How about "Max makes a dive and grabs his gun before it hits the floor."? Something... "Max secures his gun..." makes it sound like Max stowed it in a locker and pocketed the key.

Pg. 67 - MAX: "Even with those pictures, it’d take a helluva lawyer to prove guilt. There isn’t one drop of blood in that cabin. Not one drop." Well, no....but there's a dead body stuffed into a trunk just sitting there. Who needs blood?

For some reason I always envisioned Georgia as being glamorously beautiful -- until I got to pg 68, where she's described as 'plain'. It would be good to establish this from the very beginning -- stress the contrast between the 'plain' Georgia and the gorgeous and sexy Rose.

Also Pg 68 -- Georgia "tries to seduce her own reflection, but can’t even sell herself on herself." You need to describe the actions involved with this in detail -- I have no idea how this would happen on-screen. Show me.

A lot of mirror-breaking going on with Georgia and Archie, eh?

Okay, now I learn that Archie is a sheriff -- on pg 69. Could we establish that the first time we meet Archie? (Or did I miss it?)

The scene where Archie goes to ask Poobah why Georgia came to see him seems pointless. He gets no answers, and the question Poobah asks -- "Do you know where your wife is right now?" -- is pretty pointless. Of course Archie knows where she is -- he called the cabin and she answered the phone. So I don't see why this scene is relevant.

I assume Max is beginning to feel the effects of the alcohol when Georgia approaches him in the bar. Why not let that show a little? GEORGIA: "I’m Georgia." MAX: "Georgia, huh? (sings offkey) Just an old sweet sooonnng.... (beat) Got a cigarette, Georgia?"

The whole Rose death scene seems misplaced. It seems like something that would occur near the end of the movie, not 2/3 of the way through. But we'll see what comes after...

A number of the scenes don't seem to have interesting endings. I like a scene that ends with a sort of 'cliffhanger' -- something that piques your interest, makes you wonder what's going to develop from it. The scene at the bottom of pg 71 just ends with Georgia saying "Because you look like you’ve been up all night doing something very bad, or, perhaps, planning on doing something very bad. And I find that terribly interesting." And while that's fairly interesting dialogue, it's not really a good way (in my opinion) to end the scene.

Once again, in the scene on pg 72, suddenly we have a line of dialogue from Bowser, when I didn't even know he was in the room.

"Added to that, you’re so damn near close to sitting on my lap that someone could mistake you for a cherry on a sundae." This line doesn't make sense to me. Nobody could literally mistake her for a cherry on a sundae just because she's sitting close to him. Maybe something like "Added to that, you're so damn near close to sitting on my lap that we look like Siamese twins joined at the hip." Or "....that you can probably tell me how much change is in my pocket." Or "....that I'm starting to wish you WERE." I dunno....just spitballing.

"This dress doesn't have pockets" doesn't sound like much of a 'secret'.

"Max reluctantly sits back down." A beautiful woman just told Max she wants to have sex with him, and will PAY him for it. Why is he 'reluctant'???

Pg 78 - going back to the thing about how Shamus Rigby never said his name (so the audience doesn't KNOW his name), now Reno asks Bowser "You still got Shamus Rigby on a leash?" If I'm in the audience, I'm asking myself "Who the heck is Shamus Rigby???"

"Start spilling your guts, or we’re gonna start spilling ’em for you." Good line! Actually, there are a lot of good lines in this -- I'm just not calling attention to them. But this one's especially nifty. (Although I probably would've written it as "...or we'll start spilling 'em for you." But again, that's just me.)

"He misses once -- strike one. Again -- strike two. Again -- clipping Max’s shoulder: a foul ball." This would be cute in a book, but is totally useless in a script. It can't possibly be conveyed to an audience.

"Max and Georgia pull up the floorboards and hit pay-dirt." Two questions. #1 - Why on earth are they pulling up the floorboards? and #2 - What 'pay-dirt' did they hit?

"What would you have us do? Leave his body rotting in the house." Ummmm...hate to mention it, but they did leave Rose's body 'rotting in the house'.

"...and hadn’t seen any action since shower time in the WAR." How does Georgia even know what 'the WAR' is?

Okay, I'm up to pg 88 and stopping for tonight. Still don't care what happens to anybody, but at least now I think I know who I'm supposed to care about -- Max, right? More tomorrow...
 
chapelgrovefilms said:
Okay, now I learn that Archie is a sheriff -- on pg 69. Could we establish that the first time we meet Archie? (Or did I miss it?)
Click to expand...

Unfortunately you've missed a lot. Actually, just about every point of confusion you've stated thus far is right there in the script. If you would post your review on Simplyscripts.com (like we discussed in the PM) you would see that the last reviewer outlined all of the story beats. He didn't miss a thing.

David, I have no problem with your thoughts about the script. You're not the first person who hasn't liked my work and I'm certain you won't be the last. I just feel that it is a little inappropriate on a thread about your script. The people reading this thread have no reference for your statements. It means nothing to them. They came here to read your work, not mine.

Eric
 
chapelgrovefilms said:
Okay Lt Col and Welton, you've given me things to chew on. Let me ask you some things...

Welton, you say the first 20 pages the film was 'just ambling along'. What would you do differently? I kinda felt like I was establishing the characters, their relationships, and the central conflict for Shannon. I know that could all be done in just a few sentences, but it doesn't seem that emotionally satisfying for me. I suppose any film could be cut way down and turned into a short -- even 'Titanic' or 'Lord of the Rings'. But for me, the whole point of a feature-length movie is to be able to really get into the people, their relationships, and building up to the climax.

I feel like the timing of events is fairly solid -- finding out about Shannon's relationship with Taylor is a turning point in the story. That event falling around pg 20 seems about right to me. So let's start with the first 20 pgs. What would you add to what's already there to make it better? (I'll ponder about what could be taken out later.) I don't really want Shannon to find out Taylor is spying on her until the end.

Next question -- you both seem to think there's too much expository dialogue going on at the end. Maybe you're right -- but without it, how can I explain to the audience what happened?
Click to expand...

IBE has a good point about the webcam, one which I am going to relate in this post to another criticism I have about the script. Essentially you have staged a play with this movie. The entire thing plays out from one unchanged angle, which means your audience is likely to get bored very quickly. If they wanted to see a play about abuse, they would go see a play. This is a tough thing because the concept is good; the whole voyer thing is interesting, but the story fails to live up to this concept. I can't say it would work better as a short, because honestly I don't think there's enough punch in this story to trim it down and still be effective. The last thing you want is to end up with a thirty minute short (too long for a short, too short for a feature). I've done it, and trust me, it's not worth it.

As far as the timing of events, I do feel it's fairly solid in concert with screenplay standards, but I just feel that the events themselves are not impactful. For instance, when we find out about Taylor (which according to you is supposed to be the turning point), it's honestly not that big of a shock. In fact, I was kind of waiting for it to happen. The main reason for this is that Shannon obviously has a webcam set up in her room...what else would she possibly use it for aside from an online relationship? Maybe it's just me that saw that coming, but I doubt it.

We mostly get to know Shannon's situation through her complaining to Kelly, which looks good on paper, but when played out on film I have a feeling that the audience is going to get tired of that after a few minutes. I think you should establish the abuse from a first-hand perspective early on in the story. Alex's anger in the beginning is not quite enough to firmly root him into the "bad guy" role. We need something meaty at the beginning to keep us watching.

When I say you need more conflict, I mean you need more going on in this story besides Shannon being depressed and chatting online. Use the voyeur perspective to your advantage. You could do a lot of things with that and get really creative. Build suspense and tension.

One suggestion I have from a staging perspective is to only use the webcam view when Taylor is watching in "Stealth Mode". Apart from those scenes, you can have the camera be a little more free. It could still take place within the room, but switching the angle up would make things more interesting and your audience will thank you.

As far as the ending is concerned with all the expository dialogue, you're right in that it would be impossible to convey all the info without the characters saying it. So what do you do? Change the ending. In screenwriting, usually if a scene doesn't work, it's because there's a problem with the scene that came before it. Change the catalyst and you change the reaction. I think with a fresh ending you would have something more original with less (or no) obligatory exposition.

Don't give up on this concept, because I think the story can be made quite interesting. It just takes a bit of ingenuity and creativity to make sure your script doesn't veer down cliche lane.
 
Weltonfilm, thanks for the input. I've been concerned about the 'boredom factor' of having everything from a single locked POV. For the shoot, I plan to roll tape on Taylor as well as Shannon. That way if, in editing, I decide it's just not interesting enough from the single POV, then I can intercut between Shannon and Taylor -- or even split-screen them.

But I'm trying to avoid going back and forth between the webcam POV and a more 'normal' cinematic view (master shot, coverage, etc.) With just the webcam POV, I can get the whole movie shot in only a couple of days. If I revert to the more 'normal' approach, it will take considerably longer. But if I have to go back and re-shoot some things in the 'normal' way, then I will.

To be honest, I don't know any way to change the ending to eliminate the need for the expository dialogue. Got any suggestions?

And backing up for a moment, you say that the first 'twist' -- where we discover that Shannon has an online lover -- isn't that big of a 'shock'. It's not meant to be a shock, it's just meant to be a turn in the storyline. By and large, this isn't a 'shock' kind of movie -- it's probably closer to a Lifetime Channel movie than anything else, if you take out the whole techie angle.

And it's interesting that you say Alex needs to be more brutal early on. Others have chided me for making Alex TOO mean. Have to give that some thought, though.

Thanks again!
 
Actually when I was talking about the first twist, I was talking about the end where we discover that Alex, Taylor and Kelly are colluding with one another against Shannon. The second twist (in my opinion), is Shannon waking up and filling us in on how she was onto the scheme and introduced Bobby as a third party witness.

I'm not sure how you could change the ending, but again, that's more likely a problem that has to do with the story itself. Like I said, you can get very creative with this concept, but if you are just trying to make a Lifetime Original Movie then you probably don't feel like doing it. It's all up to you, I'm just telling you what I think.

As far as Alex being brutal, I didn't say he needed to be MORE brutal, but rather introduce it EARLIER and so that we see it. We find out about it through Shannon telling Kelly (if I remember correctly). SHOW it to us. Make us experience Shannon's pain so we care about her earlier.

Also, I haven't commented on individual plot points because I feel that it's better to map out the larger brush strokes first, but I have a huge problem with Shannon attempting to kill herself. Throughout the whole film we see Shannon as the loving mother who just wants her kids to be happy and does everything she can to protect them. Killing herself is the LAST thing a caring mother would do in such a situation. With her gone, Alex gets the kids, will abuse them, and they won't get her life insurance.
 
Last edited:
You say " if you are just trying to make a Lifetime Original Movie" as if there's something wrong with that. I'd love to make a good Lifetime movie!

No, I was talking about your previous comment where you said discovering Shannon has an online lover "isn't much of a shock". I'd referred to that as the 'first twist', because that's what it is -- a turn in the story, a new element.

I agree a concerned mother would never kill herself -- IF she's in her right mind. But at that point Shannon has collapsed emotionally and isn't thinking clearly. Taylor helps bring her back, making that very point -- that if she's dead, there's no one to protect her kids. Shannon's suicide attempt comes in a moment of desperation, following a terribly severe beating and the shock of knowing the man she loves had to witness it. It's an irrational act during a moment of insanity.

As for Alex, other people have said I'm 'beating them over the head' with the fact that Alex is evil and mean and brutal. I sort of feel like introducing Alex's brutality earlier -- and more graphically -- would only make those people feel even more that Alex is one-dimensional and we're overly-stressing his brutality. But I'll give it some thought.

I'll also give the ending some thought. Again, thanks for the input.
 
Okay Eric, I copied my comments to the board on SimplyScripts.com. Hope it helps.

And I DO like your writing -- it's just this particular script doesn't grab me. But you've obviously got talent.
 
My $0.02 (less taxes of course)

My $0.02 (less taxes of course)

chapelgrovefilms said:
...you said discovering Shannon has an online lover "isn't much of a shock". I'd referred to that as the 'first twist', because that's what it is -- a turn in the story, a new element.

...Shannon has collapsed emotionally and isn't thinking clearly...

...people have said I'm 'beating them over the head' with the fact that Alex is evil and mean and brutal...
Click to expand...

I'm not a script writer, but if an outside opinion my be helpful, just from a story-telling aspect...

I loved reading your script. I enjoyed watching it play through in my mind's eye. Some of the comments are quite valid though, here's my suggestions:

1) I would have thought 'twist' referred to something unexpected ... so you confused me there too. The online lover can't really be a plot twist, since a) it's pretty common and believable, and b) since we are watching her through the webcam from the get-go, it's not an event in the story, it's already started. This isn't too big an issue anyway, just terminology.

2) The suicide felt odd to me too, I figured her panic-driven state would cause her to fight for her kids in a cornered-animal sort of way, not give up. One thing that might work is to find a plot order in which Alex has now taken the kids, and is forcing her to accept that she has already lost, will never find them / have them etc. *Then* maybe she can feel helpless, useless, and worthless enough to consider suicide. Or simply have her so angry she wants to shoot some part of the room with the gun, and thus discovers the lack of bullets instead of through suicide. Just a thought.

3) One reason others might find the lead-up less compelling is that her initial situation is in fact, very common- jerk husband, unappreciated wife, affair - it's been done before, of course. If you had more depth to it, like his being a jerk because of something she did that, say, accidentally hurt him or their home/family. Then we have more reason to believe his poor opinion of her, and her character has more to it - eg. another reason she feels she can't let anything threaten her kids ever again, another reason for her to feel depressed if she can't be there to protect them (in the suicide idea above.)

4) The ending did have some denoument for me too - as soon as she got back up, you had given up the final twist, and even saying "you got all that, Bobby? ... Yup, glad to help out!" would have told me everything that Bobby must have done, without spelling it all out. In fact, when she initially rushed him out of the room I thought Taylor's gig was up - I envisioned her asking him what he had found but downstairs where Taylor couldn't see. No need to describe a phone call 2 days later.

5) As for the webcam approach, what I noticed *after* I read it was, that in my mind I had been subconciously imagining the filming starting out each scene with the webcam-quality shot, but then gradually zooming toward one character, and the quality increasing to regular film. Then cuts amongst characters, and possibly even shots of the webcam itself, with it's tell-tale red light, and finally fade to black OR smooth slide back to the webcam's POV and quality. Weird, but you could probably play with lots of similar ideas and keep the traditional look and your ingeneous feel in there. Saving some time and money by shooting with just a webcam sounds like a small savings if it sacrifices what could make for such a cool film, IMHO.

That's enough from a guy like me, you've done a great job, I would still watch it even if you didn't change a thing, but thanks for letting us make suggestions too. Cheers -

Dip
 
Dip, I appreciate your input. I'm trying to weigh what everyone has said and see what I can take from it to make the script better.

I had the same experience -- 'seeing' the camera POV transitioning back and forth between the 'webcam' view and the more traditional shots, and I know that would be very interesting. But I have to explain -- you see, I developed this project specifically because I wanted a feature that was done strictly from the webcam POV. Not because it's a cheap way to do it, though -- although that's a perk.

You see, I'm actually trying to get investors to back a truly major webcam-style feature that will be MUCH more involved than 'Tangled Web' -- and will take a lot more money, too. But investors are skittish about it -- they like the script for this other feature very much, but I can't seem to find people willing to risk their money on it. They think it's too 'different', and aren't sure it can find a profitable audience.

So with 'Tangled Web', I'm trying to lay the groundwork. I want to prove that, first of all, a movie told entirely from the POV of a single webcam can be riveting without getting boring. I also want to prove that such a movie can find an audience and make money. If I'm successful at that, then hopefully investors will be more confident about backing the REAL 'webcam' feature -- which is the one that will really make a mark.

So that's why I need to stick with the webcam-only POV. I need absolutely the best, most believable, most riveting actors I can get, because they have to pretty much carry the whole show. But if it works, it's going to be great!

Fingers crossed..... :-)
 
Oh, one other thing.....

I intentionally didn't have Bobby immediately tell Shannon what he discovered about the webcam, because I didn't want Shannon aware that anything was amiss that night when she was having her romantic Valentine's Day dinner with Taylor online. That's why I had him calling her a couple days later to let her know.

Also, I know what you're saying about tipping off the ending as soon as Shannon stands back up -- but that really IS the ending. And I almost HAVE to do the explanation because Alex quite naturally would want to know who the heck Bobby is and how Shannon knew it was all a setup. So even if she doesn't have to explain it all for the audience's benefit, I think she'd still have to give at least SOME explanation to Alex and Co. In fact, she would probably WANT to tell them how she and Bobby outsmarted them. At least, that's what I'm thinking.

But again, I'm still weighing things. And I really do appreciate the input!
 
And one other 'one other thiing'....

I'm not sure if I made this clear to everyone, but we're not actually using a webcam to shoot the movie -- we're using 3 different MiniDV camcorders -- one for Shannon, one for Taylor, and one for Bobby. Obviously, Shannon and Bobby are both written to appear on-screen via their 'webcams'. Taylor is written to never be seen -- but if it turns out the finished movie is just too dull that way, then we want to have Taylor's footage ready to intercut with the rest of it to perk things up.

I guess the trick will be to make the MiniDV footage look enough like webcam video to be fairly believable, but not so much like webcam video that it looks crappy on somebody's big-screen plasma TV. :-)
 
Cool

Cool

chapelgrovefilms said:
Oh, one other thing.....

I intentionally didn't have Bobby immediately tell Shannon what he discovered about the webcam, because I didn't want Shannon aware that anything was amiss that night when she was having her romantic Valentine's Day dinner with Taylor online. That's why I had him calling her a couple days later to let her know.

Also, I know what you're saying about tipping off the ending as soon as Shannon stands back up -- but that really IS the ending. And I almost HAVE to do the explanation because Alex quite naturally would want to know...
Click to expand...

OK I can see why, I just wonder if it's as critical to the story as some of the other plot elements, somehow I still think there's 6 different ways to work around it. One cool thing about some movies' plot twists is that we find out at the end (s)he has know for a while and was leading the other character on to make her own ending work out. Just an example. But I still like your story, either way. As for the ending, the audience is king, once we feel like we got treated to a good story, we don't usually care if/when/how the other characters learn the whole truth. Although of course it would be very vindicating for Shannon to get to tell him...

I can see how you would want this to be a 'proof of concept' for the webcam POV now, but you will have your work cut out for you. As you said, the acting has to be spot on, but I can imagine ways to spice it up- a pan/tilt webcam can give the audience different views to keep in interesting. Or make it a laptop and have her move it from time to time? Not sure but it might help. Anyway, best of luck, and thanks for sharing!

Dip
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top