My reaction to the HVX v.s. others

ripupthehwy

ripupthehwy

Well-known member
Well after months of debate and weeks of salivating over buying an HVX, I finally got mine this week!

I work in Broadcast TV production and have worked extensively with 2/3" Studio & ENG cameras, including Ikegami and Sony. I used to own a Sony DSR300 (DVCAM 1/2", shoulder mount camera).

I've read all the talk on here about the HVX vs. other cameras like the JVX HD100 and most recently the Canon XHA1.

I've always been leary of the lower end, more prosumer cameras with 1/3 " chips and lacking pro features. I was intrigued by the JVC HD100 however because its the only camera in this class with the most professional ENG style features. I had the priviledge of shooting with this camera on the weekends for the last year, shooting a TV drama series for local cable. It's a fine camera but after seeing alot of the footage and reading about the HVX I decided to hold off on buying a JVC. Then a friend of mine took me to demo the CANON XHA1.

Yeah I know all about how it has more resolution than the HVX and tons of features, but the Consumer feel to it turned me off very quickly. The lag in the focus and iris rings made me want no part of it. I mean after all if I'm going to be shooting with this camera day in and day out, I'd rather have something more professional feeling and behaving. I'd like to demo an HLH1 to see if its any better, but if its anything like the original XL1's, then NO THANKS.

So, I took my chances and decided to buy the HVX for 3 reasons:
1. DVCpro HD format instead of the 4:1:1 HDV formats of the others.
2. Numerous format/frame rate options'
3. The overall look of the pictures it makes look more filmic than JVC's (in my opinion)

I've only had the camera 2 days and so far I'm very glad of the decision I made.
I took the camera out to the Florida state fair for a couple of hours. Just shooting in 480i. I was impressed with the overall functions and the feel of the camera. Although I'd much rather have a shoulder mount camera, I didn't feel like I was holding a consumer type camera like I did when holding the CANON.

I took the footage I shot back to a TV station where I work part time and played it on a high resolution Ikegami monitor. WOW, very nice. I thought it looked much better than any footage I used to shoot with my $12k DVCAM camera from 5 years ago. Definatlely much less noise.

In my 14years of TV experience the only cameras I've seen without bad pixels after 5 or 6 years are Ikegami (the GOD of cameras!!!) and Panasonic. I'd never buy another Sony because I've seen several of them with bad pixels just after 2 years (the DXC 30's get them alot it seems and my DSR 300 developed one as soon and my warranty ran out on it. lol). The consumer and prosumer ones however seem pretty solid on pixels.

Much more testing and using to do but so far Im quite happy. My new HVX camera has much more of a PROFESSIONAL FEEL while shooting with it than the JVC or the CANONs that I've used/tested. And to think I almost backed out at the last minute to order the JVC HD110.

I'd still take a JVC HD110 or better yet the new HD 200, given the chance/extra money to buy one. It would be great for ENG work. But I bought the HVX because I wanted something that would give me more filmic looking pictures and a higher end recording format.
 
Last edited:
I agree. Forget counting pixels and just enjoy the gorgeous imagery and pro features.


Have fun! :thumbsup:
 
ripupthehwy said:
Well after months of debate and weeks of salivating over buying an HVX, I finally got mine this week!

I work in Broadcast TV production and have worked extensively with 2/3" Studio & ENG cameras, including Ikegami and Sony. I used to own a Sony DSR300 (DVCAM 1/2", shoulder mount camera).

I've read all the talk on here about the HVX vs. other cameras like the JVX HD100 and most recently the Canon XHA1.

I've always been leary of the lower end, more prosumer cameras with 1/3 " chips and lacking pro features. I was intrigued by the JVC HD100 however because its the only camera in this class with the most professional ENG style features. I had the priviledge of shooting with this camera on the weekends for the last year, shooting a TV drama series for local cable. It's a fine camera but after seeing alot of the footage and reading about the HVX I decided to hold off on buying a JVC. Then a friend of mine took me to demo the CANON XHA1.

Yeah I know all about how it has more resolution than the HVX and tons of features, but the Consumer feel to it turned me off very quickly. The lag in the focus and iris rings made me want no part of it. I mean after all if I'm going to be shooting with this camera day in and day out, I'd rather have something more professional feeling and behaving. I'd like to demo an HLH1 to see if its any better, but if its anything like the original XL1's, then NO THANKS.

So, I took my chances and decided to buy the HVX for 3 reasons:
1. DVCpro HD format instead of the 4:1:1 HDV formats of the others.
2. Numerous format/frame rate options'
3. The overall look of the pictures it makes look more filmic than JVC's (in my opinion)

I've only had the camera 2 days and so far I'm very glad of the decision I made.
I took the camera out to the Florida state fair for a couple of hours. Just shooting in 480i. I was impressed with the overall functions and the feel of the camera. Although I'd much rather have a shoulder mount camera, I didn't feel like I was holding a consumer type camera like I did when holding the CANON.

I took the footage I shot back to a TV station where I work part time and played it on a high resolution Ikegami monitor. WOW, very nice. I thought it looked much better than any footage I used to shoot with my $12k DVCAM camera from 5 years ago. Definatlely much less noise.

In my 14years of TV experience the only cameras I've seen without bad pixels after 5 or 6 years are Ikegami (the GOD of cameras!!!) and Panasonic. I'd never buy another Sony because I've seen several of them with bad pixels just after 2 years (the DXC 30's get them alot it seems and my DSR 300 developed one as soon and my warranty ran out on it. lol). The consumer and prosumer ones however seem pretty solid on pixels.

Much more testing and using to do but so far Im quite happy. My new HVX camera has much more of a PROFESSIONAL FEEL while shooting with it than the JVC or the CANONs that I've used/tested. And to think I almost backed out at the last minute to order the JVC HD110.

I'd still take a JVC HD110 or better yet the new HD 200, given the chance/extra money to buy one. It would be great for ENG work. But I bought the HVX because I wanted something that would give me more filmic looking pictures and a higher end recording format.
Click to expand...


I did a lot of pondering and now I am so glad that I got the HVX-200!
What was i thinking? Good luck!
 
ripupthehwy said:
So, I took my chances and decided to buy the HVX for 3 reasons:
1. DVCpro HD format instead of the 4:1:1 HDV formats of the others.
2. Numerous format/frame rate options'
3. The overall look of the pictures it makes look more filmic than JVC's (in my opinion)
Click to expand...

For me it was slightly more #2, but very close behind was #1.

No brainer, isn't it. :thumbup:
 
Mini-DV tape actually was my 4th reason for the HVX. We've made a lot of revenue we wouldn't have gone after with our BetaCam. A lot of people have had us shoot Mini-DV to send out of market for post or to match other stuff they shot. It's helped me pay off the HVX faster then the HD side.
It's just one more awesome feature on the HVX. :thumbup:
 
After weeks of eye gouging research/forum browsing, I've decided on an HVX200 as well! I should receive it soon. It was a tough weighing out 1) saving some dough and losing some frame rate options, as well as some other limitations, by going w/ the XH A1 and 2) shelling out more for the tasty HD200 w/ image flip, since I'll be using a 35mm adapter. Basically, I thought I HVX200 provided the best bang for buck. Can't wait to get my hands on it!
 
Arrik wrote:

I've decided on an HVX200 as well! I should receive it soon. It was a tough weighing out 1) saving some dough and losing some frame rate options, as well as some other limitations, by going w/ the XH A1
Click to expand...

If you are used to shooting with Consumer handheld dv cameras, then you will probably love the Canon HXA1. But if you're like me, someone used to pro cameras, you'd be so sorry if you blew your money on it. I think you'll be happy you spent the extra $$ for the HVX
 
ripupthehwy, thanks for your story. I am debating the same thing as I work part time at a station shooting as well. My question is how is this camera for run and gun situations and low light situations on mini DV and P2. The reason I liked the Canon A1 was because it seemed to produce a better image in low light situations, according to some of the footage that I've seen posted. I also liked the fact that it had a BNC connector if I ever needed to use it for a live shot or plug into a live truck. I demo'd the HVX and Canon last friday and one thing I did like about the HVX was the Focus and Zoom rings. It does have a more professional feel to it, where the canon doesn't allow you to focus while zooming and can lag a bit while focusing. However for some reason I like the colors the canon produces. (don't flame me, but) The HVX seems to look darker and more "video" like to me. However I did see something shot on the HVX at 30 fps and it looked more film-like and colorful to me. I hope I don't stir anything up. just my opinion. this is definitely a hard decision for me.
 
Spdamf said:
I hope I don't stir anything up. just my opinion. this is definitely a hard decision for me.
Click to expand...

No worry. The way you state your opinion was hardly "flameable". Well said.

Don't forget, there are so many looks to the HVX and more time with it would make you a master at getting the look you want.

I wouldn't say the HVX is the best low light camera out there. But there is a reason high end cameras don't go after "low light" bragging rights.
Good luck with your decision.
 
I was stunned by the 1080 images i got this weekend. absolutetly stunned. the images held up solid in color correction. the images looked like degrained shout images. I also de-artifacted the images and was amazed. the cine gamma setting with detail set to zero, when thrown into AE has a linear curve slightly below the stock kodak stock reference. the only images that did not hold up were the night time shots. I have seen scenes on this forum with 35mm adapters that looked way better than mine. So I will have to try with those. this is definetly a good investment. Now if only panasonic will write P2 driver software for Vista, that would be huge savings.
 
TedRR said:
Don't forget, there are so many looks to the HVX and more time with it would make you a master at getting the look you want.
Click to expand...

I think this is a key point with the HVX. I've had mine for nearly a year, and I still find new and useful things to try with it. The choice of shooting modes and frame rates make it adaptable in a way film is adaptable. You learn with the camera, improve as you learn more, and devise shortcuts to get what you want. I've never had this sort of situation with a video camera in the past.

Barry is correct in his assertion that all the prosumer HD cameras produce similar images. I've been shooting a doc and mixing the HVX with an HD100, Z1 etc, and the results ARE similar. But the HVX images always stand out - they look a tad filmic to my eye - which is as good a compliment as you can ever make to a video camera. Comparing the above cameras, the low-light issue is a non starter. They are so similar. Trust me on this ;)

The thing that swings it for me is actually the buttons. On the whole, everything you need is to hand, fast. And the manual zoom, and seriously wide field of view. And the fact that I've been shooting a doc for four months - primarily on the HVX, and it looks brand new.

And my love/hate relationship with P2 continues. Yes, it is limiting, but the limitations help. I went off today with a Z1 and wasted so much tape because I had no time frame. P2 forces you to consider shots before you hit record - and this is a good thing.

If you are reading this as an HVX owner, you probably didn't even bother to read this far. If not, buy one, buy one. Sure it has its faults, but I love mine. I check on it every night after shooting. I open the bag and stare at it.:kiss:
 
I heard 480i on the HVX has some problems, specifically a stair-stepping issue. I haven't done any extensive tests myself, but I take it you didn't notice any problems at 480i? Were you shooting DV or DVCPRO50?
 
I've avoided 480i due to a well known expert also saying it had known jagged edge problems. To dig further, maybe it was on mini-DV or DVCPro 50 only???

Barry, what's your take?
 
Jaggies is definitely a DV problem, and of course a lack of rez problem.

I haven't really shot much but 1080 since I got the cam, but 50 is a very nice format to edit.

Gunleik
 
instead of avoiding 480i because someone says "it has jaggie problems" shoot some and look at it on a monitor. if it looks good to you, im sure it sgood enough for the cllients.

I think the HVX shoots WAY better looking SD than the DVX does. Its not as sharp, in 4:3, but its Noise is much less, and the Dynamic range is higher. Over all it looks better.
 
480/60i on an HVX is prone to significant aliasing/stairstepping, much moreso than a DVX ever was.

480i/24p or 480/30p is perfect, the issue only affects 480/60i. You can minimize it by turning detail level and v-detail-level down to -7.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top