Types of lights

PaPa

PaPa

Major Contributor
Alright.

So im still learning alot about lighting since i've purchased my new lighting kit.
I went down to the local photography store to pick up some gels and i notice they haev an ARRI 1000w light with barned doors for sale.

I thought it used, naturally, sitting alone in an awkward spot, checked its price tag, and noticed it was only $350 canadian. I was extremely confused because i had picked up my britek flood lights, with barned doors, softboxes, and heavy duty stands for about the same price. Hoewver, i am very much aware of the quality difference between the two. Now i am begining to quesiton somethign else after doing some research on pricing.

There are many different types of lights. This i am becoming more and more aware of.

- Flood lights ( home depot, briteks, those arris with barned doors
mostly i see them with halogen bulbs inside, 500W 1000W and so on.
It is quite a harsh light and if gone passed 1200W, known to blow fuses from my experiences. But it really does work great as a directional light source with plenty of power.

-Kino flo's (fluorescent bulbs? those long tuby ones)
very soft light, not that that strong but a wrapping light that is flattering to skin tons.

What exactly are these HMI's that i read about? For some reason i am under the impression that they produce more light with littler power? IS this why they are so expensive?

I went to bhphotovideo.com and looked up some of the arri light prices, and surprised when i looked at the ones in comparison to my britek flood lights. They were almost all the same price, 500W 1000W and so on. I had always thought them to be the most expensive lights.

But then i cliked on HMI, with the 2000W 4000W and up or arris and they were several thousand dollars.

What exactly are special about these lights? Do they all require generators? What other kidns of lights are there that are available? I seem to be gettign lost in each of their special effects.
 
PaPa said:
What exactly are these HMI's that i read about? For some reason i am under the impression that they produce more light with littler power? IS this why they are so expensive?
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Yes. They're also daylight balanced, so they work great outdoors and for night scenes.
 
so than ARRI's really arent that expensiev if im not going for either flo's or hmi's

i should change my investments. lol
 
Another thing to think about is that 1000 W tungsten is alot different than 1000 W HMI. We recently used a 1200 W HMI, that was equal to about 3,000 W Tungsten. HMI's are awesome and there really is no reason to own them when you can rent for so cheap. That, depending on where you live of course.

Tim.
 
PaPa said:
so than ARRI's really arent that expensiev if im not going for either flo's or hmi's

i should change my investments. lol
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ARRI's are alot more expensive than some of the cheaper brands, but totally worth the investment. I can't imagine Britek's being as expensive as Arris. Where do you see that? On the B&H page?
 
If you're in an area that has lighting rental houses, your dollar will go further. You can look at what you need to light your movie and get just what you need for the time you need it. Of course, if you have no lighting and grip rental facilities, you're pretty much stuck with buying...or borrowing.
 
man, now i know what those hmi's are all about.

jesus,, i want some....

What do most of you guys out there settle for?
 
I always rent my hmi light package so that I can order what I need for that particular shoot. hmi's and kino-flo lights can get quite expensive. I have a few around for small shoots and then rent the rest.
 
i definately think its worth while to build those DIY kino's. from what i remember there are several of them in the DIY foru,
 
PaPa said:
i definately think its worth while to build those DIY kino's. from what i remember there are several of them in the DIY foru,
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It's not quite that easy. From what I've heard there are all kinds of issues w/ flicker, etc from the DIY ones.
 
ian hunter said:
have a look at the 2 lighting for DV webcasts on this site:

http://www.pqhp.com/cmp/dvxe05/topic3.htm?launch=yes#

a bit basic , but well worth a look.

yes HMI's are daylight balanced (5600k) the bulbs are also extremely expensive

ian
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thanks for putting that link up! do you know if theres a part 1 to this that was also on the page Maximizing Success with DV Cameras, Part 2

also can you tell me what website those are from?

thanks
zim
 
HMIs are extremely efficient daylight balanced lights. They produce light with an arc of electricity that vaporizes the elements in the globe.

But most of all its about the quality of the light - its a very sharp direct light source that is very good for simulated bright sunlight or moonlight. Its a great rim or backlight - and a great key when put through a silk.

If you want to see what it looks like just look at terminator 2 - especially the scene at the hospital - to me it looks to be lit completely with HMIs
 
HMI is a metal halide bulb and is available in other color temps besides just daylight. They are energy efficient like fluorescent and whereas fluorescent provides a great soft alternative to incandescent softboxes, metal halide is our point or hard light source energy efficient alternative to incandescent fresnels, pars and even spotlights.
 
special effects

special effects

Yes, each type of light has it's own "special effect" like you mention. Your idea of the lighting design will determine what effect your after and hence the light you are looking for. There is not one basic bang for the buck light. You could spend thousands on an HMI but it could be that all you needed for a particular application was a 1K open face (cheap). So gather information, practice and eventually you'll be able to say "oh, Terminator 2 hospital look... lets use the $5000 HMIs because it's sharp, bright and is already daylight balanced" ... "oh, poker game in that 70's show basement... let's use the $5 chinese latern with a 100w bulb in it beacuse it's soft, tungsten balanced and provides just enough light for the look"

A note on that Arri you mentioned. It could be the arri you looked at has a fresnel lens in it (added costs). This lighthouse type of lens softens the light, adds more even control over the beam,and is built robustly - all great things. Add barndoors and it's quite a versatile little light. (But it will do nothing for you ouutdoors on a bright sunny day)
 
As mentioned, rent what you need when you need it.

Sources like an Arri Sun or Jokerbug have a range of lenses that are added in front of the open face. This gives you a great range of coverage choices and with a set of wire scrims, you can control level and spread very easily. Punch an HMI through a 6' x 6' silk and you have what is effectively a very large softbox (just be certain to flag off the spill).

Give me a big enough HMI and enough grip equipment and gels and you can light just about anything!
 
khmuse said:
As mentioned, rent what you need when you need it.

Sources like an Arri Sun or Jokerbug have a range of lenses that are added in front of the open face. This gives you a great range of coverage choices and with a set of wire scrims, you can control level and spread very easily. Punch an HMI through a 6' x 6' silk and you have what is effectively a very large softbox (just be certain to flag off the spill).

Give me a big enough HMI and enough grip equipment and gels and you can light just about anything!
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Caveat being you live somewhere where renting is possible. I'd have to drive almost 3 hours to rent lights...i'll pass and just continue to build up my kits to where a budget justifies the trip to pick up the lights and rentals.
 
jah

so in your opinions, are fresnel lights softer than my open faced, barned door flood lights?

in general are they just a little more friendly as light sources? Softer light, i constitute also meaning less light from further away?

I am using, as i said two of the britek 600/1200 watt flood lights with barned doors.

Getting the arri fresnels, will that produce similar light but just softer? I would quite like that me thinks.
 
The advantage of fresnels in and of themselves is not that they are soft, but that they are even and more controllable.

EVEN in that the beam that they produce, whether spotted or flooded out, is a fairly even intensity across it's big, or little, round pattern

CONTROLLABLE in that they only light up what you point them at because the beam of light that comes out the front of the light is FOCUSED by the big glass lens. This is the opposite of an openface light where the light pattern tends to fly out all over the place like a shotgun instead of a rifle.

Control is good when you want to light moody scenes where you want one subject or element lit up, and you also want the rest of the scene to stay dark.

In college we only had these cheap Lowell open faced lighting kits, and I always wondered why, after setting everyhting up the way the text book mentioned, my shots just looked like the same room before pre-light, JUST BRIGHTER.

It wan't until I got a job at a studio using Mole, Arri, DeSisiti, and HMI fresnels that I realized how critical fresnel lights are.:thumbup:
 
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