Denied Barry's book by Panasonic

It all just seems sneaky to me. I would never have put "B&H" and "Sneaky" together before. It's really disappointing.

I bought my 100b from B&H and was told something similar to a previous poster... That the cameras were brand new, unopened, never used... He said "We are Panasonic authorized dealers, but we did not get these cameras from Panasonic, so we have to sell them as used, even though they are brand new." He even joked that for such a good price I should buy all 10 of them and sell them for profit.
Well, i bought ONE anyway. I didn't even feel hesitant because B&H has such a great reputation.

S'pose they ARE following the rules but like I said, just seems sneaky. Don't mean to get ahead of myself, but I don't tend to continue relationships with people or companies that give me the creeps.

So, anyone know how I check the serial on the dvx100B? Is it the same criteria or whatever?
 
henryp said:
For new merchandise, B&H continues to distinguish a product's "grey market" (a/k/a IMP) vs "US" provenance when applicable. For used products, there's no manufacturer's warranty, no manufacturer's rebates, etc so the issue of provenance is moot.

Consider four customers:
- Buys a new "US" camera. He gets a manufacturer's warranty, any applicable rebates, etc.
- Buys a new "grey market" camera. No manufacturer's warranty, no manufacturer's rebates. He'd pay parts + labor for any necessary repair. If bought from an honorable shop, there might well be a store warranty.
- Buys a used camera which was "US" when new. It's used, so there's no manufacturer's warranty, no manufacturer's rebates, etc. The issue of provenance is moot. He'd pay parts + labor for any necessary repair.
- Buys a used camera which was "grey market" when new. It's used, so there's no manufacturer's warranty, no manufacturer's rebates, etc. The issue of provenance is moot. He'd pay parts + labor for any necessary repair.

You can see both of the hypothetical customers who bought used goods are in the same proverbial boat, so to speak.
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henryp,

just curious ... if everything is so cool, why not say "Hi, we are selling you a Japanese camera" (or whatever the truth in a given sale might be). That way no one is surprised and feels taken advantage of.

w/ respect.
 
Yeah, I'm getting a weird vibe from B&H these days also. Just too many "issues" being reported as of late. In all fairness, I've puchased from them with no problems in the past but never big ticket items. However, I will avoid buying from B&H in the future and will not be recommending them to anyone. If
I start hearing more positive customer experiences (no negative experiences) over the next few years, I may change my mind.


So for now, I'm all about EVS! Those guys have always done me right. So right that I need a cigarette afterwards! :grin:
 
Wow... it's remarkable to see how this Henry guy is acting. A guy shows a picture of a new Japanese camera, and the B&H guy insists it's used. It's like someone telling you the sky is purple when clearly it's blue.

Now if he was smart, he'd say, "Give me a call and we'll talk and figure this out. It's possible there was some mistake." Denial just says he doesn't care, or they did something shady.
 
jeffyjones said:
Wow... it's remarkable to see how this Henry guy is acting. A guy shows a picture of a new Japanese camera, and the B&H guy insists it's used. It's like someone telling you the sky is purple when clearly it's blue.

Now if he was smart, he'd say, "Give me a call and we'll talk and figure this out. It's possible there was some mistake." Denial just says he doesn't care, or they did something shady.
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It HAS to be used. It doesn't have a Panasonic warranty and it doesn't qualify for THE BOOK and we sold it through our Used Dept. Legally, it's used. It certainly does look very pretty and untouched and all, which is why it was sold with a "10" rating, but there's no mistake, no denial, nothing to talk about really. The sky's gray, by the way, but there's been nothing shady and frankly (and this should be obvious) if we didn't care I wouldn't be here, would I?
 
henryp said:
It HAS to be used. It doesn't have a Panasonic warranty and it doesn't qualify for THE BOOK and we sold it through our Used Dept. Legally, it's used. It certainly does look very pretty and untouched and all, which is why it was sold with a "10" rating, but there's no mistake, no denial, nothing to talk about really. The sky's gray, by the way, but there's been nothing shady and frankly (and this should be obvious) if we didn't care I wouldn't be here, would I?
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Henry,

It's hard to get the whole emotions of a person by reading a typed response, so forgive me if I am wrong, but, you seem to be getting more and more defensive as your posts progress and bordering on maybe coming off as a little rude. I think it's great that B&H has a presence on these boards and appreciate your taking the time to respond here and calm the masses. I think the basic request of most of the people complaining here is that B&H has a great reputation - don't spoil it! Obviously you are doing things legally by selling the cameras as used, but take a step beyond doing the legal thing, and do the customer service thing - inform your customers clearly of what they are purchasing. I'm sure there are plenty of people who have no problem purchasing an "import" at a better price. But people DO have a problem when they feel as though they've suffered the lie of omission. Selling it used but not giving the whole story runs the risk of an episode such as this one! Somebody figures out what is going on, they spread the word, and lots more people poke their nose into it, pretty soon you have a lot of people demanding an explanation. If B&H has no issues with selling these cameras and it's perfectly legal to do so, then B&H should have nothing to hide - no reason to keep it a secret. I would think that the alternative, AKA the backlash you see here, is less desirable for a successful company with a good reputation.

On another note, in the industry that you are dealing with, your customers in TV, Film & Media in general, i would think that it's risky to upset the wrong person. I would think that so many of your customers have access to avenues of "spreading the word" about their experiences with B&H. A segment titled "B&H and their grey market cameras" makes a greater impact and would draw more attention than a segment on how nice the folks are at ol' B&H...
 
Just a little re-cap (as this post is nears 6 weeks of age). What have we learned?

Not a peep out of the original poster since 9/18. I'm kinda wondering what happened to him, anybody know?

Jan said she's looking at it (no doubt).
Henry says he'll make it right (despite the abuses he has suffered here--my hat's off to you Henry).

At one point there were about 5 people with (or may have had) genuine issues which actually related to the title of this thread. Anybody not taken care of yet?

With the possible exception of Andre, who is mad that he got a new camera at a used price, everyone else pretty much understands that "used" means used, and that the original manufacturers warranty does not come with it, whether the camera was originally destined for the USA, Japan, or the North Pole . . . same thing with Chevrolet, Kenmore, and Hewlett-Packard. Used isn't the same as NEW, get "used" to it brother.

Been a lot of silly allegations, bashing, name calling, threats, etc. Previous to this I thought all posters (here) were mature adults . . . my bad.

Jan, get 'em to paint the USA-bound boxes Red, White, and Blue.

Just placed another order with B&H this afternoon.

Peace.
 
cara_starr said:
Henry,
It's hard to get the whole emotions of a person by reading a typed response, so forgive me if I am wrong, but, you seem to be getting more and more defensive as your posts progress and bordering on maybe coming off as a little rude.
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I am certainly sorry you've developed this misapprehension and quite sorry if I contributed to its formation in any way. In general, I don't ever get defensive and those who've seen my posts online here and there over the past 10-12 years can attest to that. As for rude -- I think rudeness is uncivilized and would never do it purposely.

cara_starr said:
I think it's great that B&H has a presence on these boards and appreciate your taking the time to respond here and calm the masses.
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Thank you.
SNIP

cara_starr said:
On another note, in the industry that you are dealing with, your customers in TV, Film & Media in general, i would think that it's risky to upset the wrong person. I would think that so many of your customers have access to avenues of "spreading the word" about their experiences with B&H. A segment titled "B&H and their grey market cameras" makes a greater impact and would draw more attention than a segment on how nice the folks are at ol' B&H...
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No disrespect intended, but if you think this is in any way limited to this board or this industry or this genre, you're mistaken. I can get my head bitten off in far busier forums than this one (and I say that with EVERY bit of respect for this site, its owner, and those who frequent it). This is, generally, a very civilized place with a refreshingly decent level of conversation. Diplomacy prevents me from naming others, but there're places out there frequented by supposed pros in which rock throwing, back biting and the hurling of thinly veiled insults is a varsity sport.

That said, while I don't want to suggest stifling debate or conversation I think I've said pretty much all there is to say on this topic.
 
cara_starr said:
Henry . . . you seem to be getting more and more defensive as your posts progress and bordering on maybe coming off as a little rude.
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Hey, don't mistake "rude person" for "New Yorker!" :grin:
 
Wicked f'n pissah!

Wicked f'n pissah!

henryp said:
You mean "Nu Yawkuh!" Thanks. :-)
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Thanks for the correction! I'm originally from next door (Boston), so I should know bettah! :beer:
 
I just checked my camera bought from www.bestpricecameras.com, and it has a NC in it. The company advertises in the web site about all products having a Us warranty. So it is fraud. I wonder if Panasonic will honor the camera's warranty. I sent an email to to the comany demanding an exchange ir a full refund.
 
Philip_38 said:
I just checked my camera bought from www.bestpricecameras.com, and it has a NC in it. The company advertises in the web site about all products having a Us warranty. So it is fraud. I wonder if Panasonic will honor the camera's warranty. I sent an email to to the comany demanding an exchange ir a full refund.
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I don't think you did alot of research before selecting a vendor, you've picked a company that has an extremely poor reputation for service:

http://www.resellerratings.com/seller8754.html

Don't give up when they give you the inevitable runaround. They misrepresented the product, so you may have to threaten or take legal action. Good luck.
 
cara_starr said:
Heeeyyyy... I wasn't calling him a rude person - :)
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I know, I know . . . we are FAR too civilized on THIS forum to do such things! :engel017:
 
I'm yet another formerly steady B&H customer who will be steering clear of them from now on. That they tried to get away with misleading customers is one thing. To compound the trust problem they created with purely technical excuses here on this board smacks of arrogance.

From a customer-service and public-relations standpoint, the right strategy for B&H in this thread was obvious:

1) Clearly state that B&H recognizes the seriousness of its original bad act.

2) Apologize for the "confusion" suffered by the original poster.

3) Outline a clear policy with regard to gray-market merchandise and pledge to stick to it in the future.

I mean, you could learn this in a Business 101 class at a community college. When you do something to cause your customers to stop trusting you, YOU FIX IT.

Instead B&H has:

1) Refused to confess its original bad act in selling the original poster in this thread a gray market camera as "new" (the invoice Jan mentioned seems to be the critical evidence here).

2) Not apologized for what every person on this board can tell is a serious personal-trust issue, if not a legal one.

3) Offered no clarification on its original policy (selling gray market HVX cameras as new without informing customers), or its new policy (selling gray market cameras as "used" without informing customers of the gray market status).

B&H's policy seems to be: "We don't think you need to know, so we won't tell you."

They should put that under their logo on the website.
 
Philip_38 said:
I just checked my camera bought from www.bestpricecameras.com, and it has a NC in it. The company advertises in the web site about all products having a Us warranty. So it is fraud. I wonder if Panasonic will honor the camera's warranty. I sent an email to to the comany demanding an exchange ir a full refund.
Click to expand...


What you have is a camera whose warranty is in Japan. That will be honored there. If you need to have it fixed, we will do it here but you will be charged. The vendor you are referencing does advertise a US warranty but it is their US warraty, not a Panasonic US warranty. It is a little slimy on the wording, misleading enough to get you to purchase.

Sorry for the bad news.

Best,

Jan
 
well it has been a while since this issue occured. B&H was supposed to exchange camera for a US version however they opted to just refund me [hmmmmm] since then it has been a while till they even gotten them in stock again [hmmmm hmmmm] so in the mean while i am doing without any camera at all. but now starting to look into another purchase. Not sure if i wanna roll the dice on B&H again but this time i know what to look for soon as it arrives. but i am starting to sway towards the canonA1... anyway YES they did something shysty but they did correct it.
thanks all...
 
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