WARNING: B&H is selling HVX Japanese Rejects!

Unlike the scam shops in Brooklyn who respond to complaints by making death threats, B&H has a rep here actively trying to resolve these concerns. He has stated that B&H was sold a batch of gray-market cameras from another authorized dealer (who represented to B&H that they were official US product).

While it's certainly a matter to be concerned about, I think the way B&H responds will be far more telling. So far it sounds promising, but I look forward to hearing from our membership to see if B&H "makes good" in all ways. If they do, then that's a great sign. If (and this seems unlikely, but if) they leave the customers dissatisfied and stuck with gray-market product, then you can bet there will be a lot of people doing their shopping elsewhere.

I say we give Henry Posner and the B&H crew a chance to make it all good.
 
Barry_Green said:
I say we give Henry Posner and the B&H crew a chance to make it all good.
Click to expand...
Thank you. Much appreciated. For the record, we're closing for Sukkot (or Sukkos or Sukkoth depending on where your father went to Hebrew School :)) at 1:00 on Oct 6th - today. We reopen Monday Oct 16th but I won't be back until Oct 19th or so due to an unavoidable business obligation.

I am ABSOLUTELY committed to making sure that everyone involved in this is 100% satisfied and that any questions about our reliability, etc. are resolved. I just want to make sure you all know about the hiatus.
 
henryp said:
I am ABSOLUTELY committed to making sure that everyone involved in this is 100% satisfied and that any questions about our reliability, etc. are resolved.
Click to expand...

...and this is why i love and continue doing business with B&H.

much respect.

:thumbup:
 
Buying discounted excess inventory outside the authorized channel (not from Panasonic) is playing in the gray market. If this is the case, it seems B&H knowingly bought gray market product for resale. They may have been assured the product had been manufactured for the U.S. from this third party, but that is not relevant. Product does not have to be foreign(Japanese) to be gray market, just outside the direct channel.

Now if B&H is admitting to buying product outside the channel, there is no guarantee that this isn't occurring on other HVX's (bought from other third parties) or any other electronic equipment. The problem with an authorized vendor going outside the channel is that you have to take the third party at its word, and they have a lot of reasons to lie. They then, B&H, represent this inventory as coming from the manufaturer, when it did not. Here it didn't work out so well.
 
Last edited:
I think you assume facts not in evidence.

My read on Henry's post is that they are admitting to a commitment to a satisfactory resolution, nothing more.
 
henryp said:
B&H bought several cameras from another retailer who was overstocked. At the time, that retailer assured us the cameras were 100% "kosher." Apparently they were not. We regret this and certainly apologize for your distress and inconvenience.
Click to expand...

Unless this purchase was in agreement with Panasonic, B&H seems to have gone outside of the authorized channel. I would be interested to hear in what circumstances that this is allowed within the distribution agreement with Panasonic. Having scene a few disty agreements, OEMs are very parochial over the supply chain and would not allow this transaction; mostly for the reasons posted in this thread.

Perhaps Panasonic allows B&H to augment their direct supply chain with excess at other vendors (authorized third parties or not) Maybe B&H can respond or Jan for that matter.
 
Last edited:
Those are interesting comments.

I *think* that Panasonic is the one entity is the sole position of doing anything about the "non-US" supply chain. It appears (to me) that while it might be unreasonable to expect the manufacturer to somehow control when/whether dealer "A" sells product to dealer "B" (before the fact), but they certainly must have options to remedy the situation afterwards as these are all serial numbered items. I would leave it to the manufacturers authorized representative to choose whether or not to comment on the topic.

I believe that some have decided to take B&H to task here for something (given their long history of exemplary sales & service) which appears (to me) to be pretty much a one time only issue--although the transaction involves more than one item. Personally I think that's a little unfair given their explanation and stated commitment to resolve the issue. I would be as interested as anyone in learning of the final outcome—as has often been said, “Time will tell.”

If it's as large a concern to Panasonic as you suggest, a couple of simple steps could be taken which would both serve to protect the end user and clearly demonstrate their commitment to solving a perceived problem:

1. Publish a current listing on their website of authorized dealers (simple).
2. Make the slightest change in packaging of the US product . . . this could be as easy as a printed package tape (color of their choosing), or a large "FOR US MARKET ONLY" graphic or text on the box. Quite possibly there are more intelligent and easier solutions than I have suggested here.

I don't feel that Panasonic should have to inform us as to what internal measures they are (or are not) taking in regard to business between them and their dealer base. At the same time I think it's ludicrous that their customers should have to e-mail or PM Jan to learn if a dealer is authorized or not, or if the camera they have just purchased will need to be sent to Japan for warranty repair.

(In my view) these measures are, at the very least, practices that should already be in place and until they are the finger pointing should be shifted in the direction that it belongs. There is absolutely no plausible explanation for any manufacturer not to take such steps. Permitting the current situation where the customer has to invest the time and effort into becoming a policeman to persist is irresponsible (again, my view).
 
I am so glad that Henry Posner is offering to reimburse me for the shipping (both ways, as I never got one of those Return pre-paid sticker things). I have bought over 70K of stuff from them in the last two years and I never had a problem until now. But as he states, it won't be a problem now either as he and B&H are willing to make good.

Per Barry's wishes, I will let everyone know what happened after the 19th when Mr. Posner comes back to work. In the mean time I am sorry they lost my purchase to Spec-Comm. I am, however, going to be purchasing about 10K worth of more equipment (dolly, track, grip stuff) in about two weeks... and I am willing to purchase it from B&H if the matter of the original post is resolved.
 
Dregenthal

I see your point and I know they have been good for you. B&H is a valued supplier to many here and I am sure they will make thing right on these purchases. There is no eveidence that they knowingly bought Japanese version cameras and sold them as US. All of this does not necessarily mean though that this transaction was not a gray market transaction.

We go to great effort here to recommend "authorized" vendors to people looking to buy the camera and most of us buy from "authorized" dealers. We do that because when a company is "authorized" there is, in my view, and implied warranty between that company and the customer that the procurement of product will come directly from the manufacturer throught the proper channel. This way, people don't have to worry about ending up with a bad warranty or worse.

Here B&H has said it bought excess inventory from another vendor. The result of that transaction is that it ended up with Japanese cameras it then resold to its customers. I think it is a fair question to ask, "we buy from you because you are authorized, was this buy of product an authorized purchase within the agreement you have with Panasonic?" It may have been, but I am not so sure given the facts. Panasoninc allowing these transaction can lead to more issues like these.

Buying and selling gray market product is not illegal and many reputable companies do it. (some of course are not) Panasonic is supposed to Police the channel and it does, most likely, through it's agreements. There are realities that don't always make it realistic or possible to do so. Anyway, I hope it works out for everyone because i am sure we could agree at the very least, if we received one of these cameras, we would be bummed.
 
Last edited:
dregenthal said:
1. Publish a current listing on their website of authorized dealers (simple).
2. Make the slightest change in packaging of the US product . . . this could be as easy as a printed package tape (color of their choosing), or a large "FOR US MARKET ONLY" graphic or text on the box. Quite possibly there are more intelligent and easier solutions than I have suggested here.
Click to expand...


Very simple, very effective and it would completely resolve most (if not all) of these "gray" area issues.
 
A previous poster suggested looking for a "TC" or "NC" in the serial number, to distinguish the origin of the camera.

I received an HVX200 in California from B&H with an "NC". Is this a telling sign of a Japanese model?

Or should I just stop starring at my new neon green warrenty cards, which have no english?

-a
 
I believe "NC" means Japanese Market. The camera that is for the US market should have waranty information for US, Canada, and the Dominican Republic if I remember correctly (in English!), and should have the contact info for the correct service centers.

I think you may be holding one of the infamous cameras discussed in this topic. They are mechanically 'identical' to the US model except for the black NTSC level, which I believe someone here mentioned would be set lower due to Japans slighly 'different' NTSC standard.
 
********************************
N O T E ** N O T E ** N O T E ** N O T E
********************************

Since this original post B&H has solved all
problems & reimbursed all money owed to
me to my complete satisfaction.
DATE: October 22, 2006



ORIGINAL POST EDITED WITH ABOVE TEXT
 
TheThe said:
Since this original post B&H has solved all problems & reimbursed all money owed to me to my complete satisfaction. DATE: October 22, 2006
Click to expand...
Good to know. Thanks for taking the time to say so.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top