Upgrading Camera, Canon XL2 or DVX100B?

Mike Krumlauf

Mike Krumlauf

Award Winning Filmmaker
Hey,

I got a job paying 200 a week and around december-ish i am going to take that money and the money i get for selling my DVX100A and get a new camera of some kind! The problem is, i am stuck between the new DVX or Canon's massive XL2? Now i understand this is a DVX fourm but i want peoples honest answer on this matter cause its buging the crap out of me.

Thanks DVXuser,
Mike :dankk2::thumbup:
 
The XL2 can give you some pretty good looking footage if you tweak around with the settings and set it up right but the DVX100B should give you terrific footage right out of the box. Add to that, the ease of use of a smaller camera, though less motion stability than a shoulder-mount camera, and you've got yourself a winner.

I would have to say to go with the DVX100B as it seems to be the easier camera to use. I personally love the XL-series of cameras because it gives you that extra "I'm really professional"-kind of feeling since it's a big shoulder-mount camera, but in terms of image quality, it takes a real pro to get the best footage out of it.

For instance, some students, two groups, in one of my film classes recorded one scene last week or so to show off their directing and acting talents (the class is split between directors and actors). The two directors are among a group of friends that seem to always be together in the film classes I have had with them. One of them owns an XL2 and they each practiced being DP's for eachothers' projects over the course of the past three years of college. One of the films looked fantastic, almost HD-quality to my eyes! Yet, the other one looked terrible, like something from a Canon ZR100, maybe less (as in Hi-8). Lighting situations were different, which is a major factor to consider, however, there was a lot that could have been done had they been using an external LCD display to monitor their footage, they simply flipped the XL2's viewfinder up and monitored on the 2" viewfinder screen.

So what does this tell you? With the XL2, you'll have to get an external screen, whether it's a cheap portable DVD player screen, a cheap Ikan LCD screen, or a professional screen like a Marshall or Panasonic display, you'll need one just to be sure you're filming everything correctly. If you go with the DVX, you've got a great viewfinder and LCD screen right there.

Some may also say that the XL2's native 16:9 is a no-brainer, but do keep in mind that the DVX is no pushover when using squeeze mode. Squeeze mode has been used to great effect time and time again, so there's no need to worry about 16:9.

But the real question you should be asking yourself, Four Eyed Monsters, is "Why a DVX100B or XL2?". By December there's going to be the new Canon A1 and G1 cameras, both of which will have terrific SD and HDV support as well as 24F. Then you also should consider the November trade shows that could yield new camera announcements as well, such as DV Expo. Perhaps we'll have U.S. versions of the new Sony cameras, new Panasonic HD cameras (perhaps an AVC-Intra-based DVX-replacement?), or price drops on current sub-$10k HD cameras. These are just little possibilities, we won't know yet until something is leaked or November rolls around.

But seriously, man, you'll be cutting yourself short when there's all this new stuff coming out.
 
I personally would reccomend neither. If you have a DVX100A you are not going to notice any difference shooting with a 100B or an XL2. It looks like you are dying to buy a new camera though from seeing your previous posts, but if you do, buy something that is actually an upgrade. Why would you spend all that money just to get a few upgraded features? Like Jack said, there are going to be alot of great new cameras coming out, take serious note in those. I would also reccomend, since you already have the camera spend money on lighting, stands, tripods, mics, or just financing your next film, but then again, it is your dough, so spend it on whatever you like.
 
scharky said:
I personally would reccomend neither. If you have a DVX100A you are not going to notice any difference shooting with a 100B or an XL2. It looks like you are dying to buy a new camera though from seeing your previous posts, but if you do, buy something that is actually an upgrade. Why would you spend all that money just to get a few upgraded features? Like Jack said, there are going to be alot of great new cameras coming out, take serious note in those. I would also reccomend, since you already have the camera spend money on lighting, stands, tripods, mics, or just financing your next film, but then again, it is your dough, so spend it on whatever you like.
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I agree 100%.

Also... that question is WAY too vague. "What should I buy?" That all depends on what you're going to use it for, among the other 100 questions you should ask yourself before buying.
 
Four Eyed Monster, you have a buying isse.

Instead of constantly wanting to sell your camera and upgrade, why don't you use the camera you have to its full potential (yes, I remember your old posts).

The only reason you should upgrade is when the camera you're using does not suite your needs. What do you not like about the DVX100a that you think you will get from the XL2 or DVX100b?
 
I'd go for the DVX as the most value for money. The XL2 is at least 1 to 2k more and the image quality isn't improved that much drastically though I like the focusing better. I've used all three cameras of this range - The DVX, PD170, and XL2... and the DVX still ranks top for me - The XL2's LCD really pisses me off and lugging around a silly DVD player or attaching a screen on top just doesn't cut it for me. Big and bulky. But I agree with what they said - I wouldnt get rid of my 100a just yet if I had one just to 'upgrade' to an XL or 100b. Anyway, its ultimately your choice. Just my 2 cents.
 
if you already have a dvx100a then i don't think u should be shelling out ur money on a mere upgrade... better if u invest it in a project etc.
 
I've still got my good old DVX-100 (original) and I don't plan on buying the B anytime soon. I am holding out for an HVX or something else that comes down the pipes later... wait or upgrade, my two choices..
 
Geting The XL2 i have decided

Geting The XL2 i have decided

After talking with a good friend of mine who is actually a DVXuser (Rouge Crew) and looking at many videos, i have decided to go with geting an XL2.

Mike~

Thanks everyone who replied to this :)
 
Just curious.....What is it that the XL2 offers you that your DVX doesn't that you're willing to pay for the 'upgrade'? I'm just asking because you never really said in your original post what was "bugging" you about your camera decision. Of course I realize there are things that the XL2 does better (16:9, etc.), but as many of those are balanced out by things the DVX does better, I'm curious as to your thinking.
 
Well, first of all i am a person that likes to get the look of whatever i am working on in-camera and have less work to do in post. I also like the fact that the XL2 has native 16:9 and interchangable lenses! Really, if you look at it, the XL2 does take a little more work to get the "Film Look" as everyone calls it, but once u get that look (in my views) it totally is better then the DVX's. Plus, the cromatic abberation on the DVX's lens bugs he crap out of me as well as its efforts of trying to get 16:9 using squeeze or the anamorphic adapter. I was testing my friends adapter about a week ago and i realized you can't do a full zoom with the lens so that option went straight out the window! i am not going to change my dission and i know there are going to be some people pretty pissed off that i am giving up my DVX for a CANON lol. :)
 
My problem is that you're giving up your hamburger for steak when you could be getting filet mignon!

I don't know about interchangeable lenses, that's something that hasn't really panned out for the XL-series. Unless you're getting a LetusXL or a Mini-35, you're not going to get much use beyond the stock lens and the wide angle 3x lens.

As far as the native 16:9, there's a lot of newer cameras that do just that, heck, even a tiny Sanyo HD1a does 16:9 and in HD! I still feel that you'll be better served by a Canon A1 when it comes out and, if interchangeable lenses REALLY matters to you, you can always try a JVC HD110U for a little more (sure the lens isn't that good but neither is the Canon 20x lens).

I just don't get your thinking, man! Lol! :)
 
Four Eyed Monsters said:
i know there are going to be some people pretty pissed off that i am giving up my DVX for a CANON lol. :)
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Actually I'm sure no one will be 'pissed off', but may be confused as to your idea of an upgrade. You posted the original question saying you were stuck between the XL2 and the 100B as an upgrade, but didn't say why, and asked for opinions. In other words, we were left to question exactly what need the 100a did NOT fulfill for you that the other two cameras will? I think the obvious majority opinion is that if you want to spend the money, great, go for it. But for a true 'upgrade' one of the HD options would be worth saving a bit more before leaping.

I've seen no DVX (or even HVX) bias in the answers, just suggestions that you're spending a lot of money to move sideways rather than up. BUT, if that's what you want, then knock yourself out. Other than trying to help you with your original request for input, I don't think anyone else will really care.....unless of course you ask them to borrow money for the new camera.
 
Jack_Felis said:
As far as the native 16:9, there's a lot of newer cameras that do just that, heck, even a tiny Sanyo HD1a does 16:9 and in HD! I still feel that you'll be better served by a Canon A1 when it comes out and, if interchangeable lenses REALLY matters to you, you can always try a JVC HD110U for a little more (sure the lens isn't that good but neither is the Canon 20x lens).

I just don't get your thinking, man! Lol! :)
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I realise being comfortable with your equipment can help your work, but Id be getting into bed with something with a bit more oomph that will take you from A to Z rather than from A to .... well A. Dont worry Im jumping ship to the new Canons, and I really think little of brand loyalty, but I would stop for a moment. Your $ your choice.
 
Interchangable lenses are friggin expensive. Having used an XL2 before, I realized that you might as well buy a whole new camera rather than a new lens plus lens adaptor. XL2 footage is arguably better in my opinion and the native 16:9 aspect ratio is great but I would pay so much extra cash for it. I agree completely with what everyone's saying. Maybe it would be more worth it if you saved up for a Canon A1 HD Camera or a H1. Another thing is that I swear the viewfinder will piss you off.
 
You know, I was trying to figure out which I wanted, then I helped a friend film something with an XL2 they got, and I didn't really like it. It was bulky and a little awkward, and straining on the wrist. I can do a lot more with a smaller, hand-held camera rather than a shoulder mount. And I hate the eyepiece/monitor. It made us look more professional, but in the end that wasn't important. Plus it doesn't look very filmic to me. It still looks kind of like video.
 
Your asking the wrong question. If you already have a DVX100A then you shouldn't waste cash trying to decide between a DVX100B and XL2 both sold for 4k. You should be looking at the cheaper HD cameras. Hell, I don't see how I could justify paying 4k for an XL2 with the A1 coming for the same price.
 
Dude youre seriously wasting money jumping to a different camera of the same class. you basically are burning money for no reason. BE cause in like a year. youre gonna say, oh hell now i want HD.... Shoot i shouldnt have spent money on an Xl2. Then when you try to sell it, it will resell for like half of what your paid and you will eat another 2 grand. Just like you will eat a grand or two by reselling the 100a which btw are like flooding the used camer amarket as the HD cams are coming up.

Im sorry ot say this but fiscally speaking i think its foolish. You will be much happier if you spend that money instead on a great lightign kit. because a "better" sd camera which BTW 100B and Xl2 are MARGINALLY bette than an 100a. However if you light i with a great light kit with the proper tools, you will be able to craft beautiful images. and once a scene is lit well it looks Great on any camera. that 3% difference between a 100a and the "better" SD camera will not even be noticeable. Plus you can rent out a good light kit and make money on it.
 
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