Tascam HD P2 vs MarantzPDM 671

A

Aje

Active member
Have a DVX 100B (PAL) and a Roede NT4 mic and I shoot
a lot of musicevents.
I have used the DVX mic inputs but would like to record sound
with an external recorder.
Which one - Tascam HD P2 or Marantz PDM 671 - is the question?
The HD P2 has firewireport - is it possible to remote it from the DVX
firewireoutport?
If so the choice is simple.
Anyone who knows?
/Aje
 
I have the 671 and like it quite a lot. But for film production work (I do mostly FX) I would go with the Tascam.
The reasons are, it can lock to TC, better metadata, firmware updates. Physically I like the 671 better. As far as I have been able to tell they are pretty much the same quality. But the 671 has some very limited and not too standard metadata, and no naming flexibility. This is fine for FX since everything gets renamed anyway and the meta data isn't really used - the opposite is true for production. Also Tascam has updated the firmware a few times. Marantz has also but to get the new firmware you have to badger them and then send the box in to have them make the change. This could change but I wouldn't count on it. Again for my work this isn't really an issue since every thing works fine but in the wild and wooly world of production it could be important. And the fact that Tascam respects it's users enough to let you update the firmware is a good thing.

So while I think they are both fine recorders I think Tascam has the edge on features and support.
 
Hey I just got through using the HD-P2 for a project and was very impressed with the unit. TO my knowledge though you cannot send TC form the DVX100B FW. But the Tascam is a very solid unit.
 
I owned a 670 and now a HD-P2. My Tascam has been great, and has been used in numerous shorts and features, and some ENG work. I will say that it is a bit heavy for bag work (heavier than my 670, anyway), but still pretty functional. Both have bag limitations (too many controls on the top), but in general, this hasn't been a problem.

As you read through the archives (you did do a search, right, since I know this has been discussed a lot) you will see some people complaining because the P2 is made out of plastic and therefore is not "well built". This is a false statement and assumption. My P2 has been dropped and kicked a couple of times and doesn't even have a scratch on it. (Oh, and BTW, the 671 is also made of plastic). Sound quality is very good, and the flexibility in the controls is excellent.

Scott referred above to the respect Tascam has for their customers in allowing them to update the firmware directly...the cynical side of me thinks that this was just prudent planning on their part - they knew they had bugs so why not make it easier to fix them? But, the normal me likes the fact that they have been responsive to problems reported and have fixed them and made the fixes available.

Unfortunately none of the DVX's or the HVX have TC in or out (other than camera to camera via FW) so there is no way to jam from or to the camera. Nor is there a way to remote roll from the camera using FW. I have heard that there are people working on getting TC out the FW, and even remote roll, but I have not heard anything new on that front. The P2 can be setup for remote roll on TC change (I have not done this, but it was reported in a recent review in DV magazine).

So, bottom line is I like the Tascam better than the Marantz, and it has served me well. Is it a Deva or (my dream recorder) a Cantar? Nope. But, it does well what it is designed for.

Phil
 
You prefer cantar to deva, phil? wow, i'd rather go deva anyday. but maybe thats just cuz there is one cantar in SA, but not a single Deva. God i want to be the first :)

PS - have you checked out the Sound Devices 702t Aje? Man, I love that 7 series of recorders... thats what I would buy if I was in the market... (Well, actually Id go with 744t, but you get the picture)

Tim
 
I totally think the Cantar is the way I want to go. It is much more "baggable" but yet still a full featured multi-track when not in a bag. And it is just plain cool looking (check out the pics of Scott Farr's bag on Jeff's site and you can see what I mean).

(Honestly, I haven't actually done a feature comparison yet, and probably my first multi-track will probably be Boom Recorder, but still, it just plain looks cool!)

;-)

Phil
 
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like I remember reading the review of the Tascam HD-P2 in DV magazine and it was only capable of 24-bit recording in theory and on the spec sheet. It's actual measured performance was not much better than 16-bit, if I recall.

edit:

I found the review-

http://www.dv.com/news/news_item.jhtml?articleId=190500070

"Today's mega-thousand-dollar field recorders have dynamic ranges better than 112 dB at 24 bits; the best we could get from the HD-P2 was 96 dB in that mode. It's better than other prosumer recorders, but not a big enough difference to justify the increased media at most shoots."
 
Last edited:
Jay Rose has said that he doesn't think any of the under $2K recorders give you a real 24 bit. I don't know. He (if I remember correctly) thought the Tascam came closest. I don't really care (except intellectually) what his lab tests showed. The bottom line for me is that I can easily hear the difference between 24 bit and 16 bit on the 671. If it's only giving me 20 bits on the scope well OK then I can clearly hear the difference between 20 bit and 16 bit. I use the MixPre in front and I LOVE the recording quality. And my comparison deck is a Nagra V so this not that I just moved up from MD and am blown away by a real recorder. Everything I have heard about the Tascam has pointed to it sounding as good or better than the Marantz. Truthfully I might have bought the Tascam if it had been out at the time. If I had to buy today I would be torn. I really like the layout of the Marantz but the support might make me switch. Of the competition. I hated the FR2. I tested it with a friend that really wanted to like it. She hated it also. It really felt flimsy, though I hear it is pretty durable. I'm in a bit of a love hate relationship with the SD boxes. THey were what I was saving up for, but after playing with one (my friend went for the 722 instead of the FR2) there are a number of things I don't like about them. For one thing they are TOO small. BUT SD is a really good company and they will be (and have) putting out firmware changes based on users needs (rather than marketing Dept, hype) and the sonic and build quality is great. If I had the $$ an SD box would be top of my list. Deva is too clunky for all the over the shoulder stuff I do, but the Cantar looks Great. And they also will be fixing things. The Nagra sounds Fantastic but it weighs a TON. 12 hours with that on your shoulder and your in real pain. It has it's good points though, the batteries last forever. I did that 12 hour day and the batteries were still in the green.

But one needs to put all this in perspective.
Micro Track ~ $350
671 - ~$800 (it's what I got mine for anyway)
P2 ~$1,000
FR2 ~1,200
SD ~$2,000 - $3,600
Nagra ~ $7,000

Deva ~ $12,000 + (I could be a bit off here , but same ballpark)
Cantar ~$13,000 + (I could be a bit off here , but same ballpark)



Jarrod King said:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like I remember reading the review of the Tascam HD-P2 in DV magazine and it was only capable of 24-bit recording in theory and on the spec sheet. It's actual measured performance was not much better than 16-bit, if I recall.

edit:

I found the review-

http://www.dv.com/news/news_item.jhtml?articleId=190500070

"Today's mega-thousand-dollar field recorders have dynamic ranges better than 112 dB at 24 bits; the best we could get from the HD-P2 was 96 dB in that mode. It's better than other prosumer recorders, but not a big enough difference to justify the increased media at most shoots."
Click to expand...
 
Phil,

I've heard that comment about the P2 also.?? THe 671 is plastic but certainly doesn't feel fragile. I think it might be because the P2 looks like modified DAP1 that people expected more heft. I haven't heard of anyone having problems who used it, so I think it was just a first impression thing.
 
Scott,

I've used the DAP1 and the P2 is definately heavier, and feels just as sturdy. DAP1's were workhorses, which is why I'm not worried about the P2's build.

For your chart above, you can get a P2 for a little less than $900 if you push hard. Also, to be a fair comparison, you should add the cost of the TC card to the FR-2. ;-)

PHil
 
Thanks a lot for your valuable comments everybody!

I think I´ll go for the Tascam HD P2

/Aje
 
better to go with the fostex , in the future you can add tc capability for automatic sync whith any tc camera ,about 700$ ,to work normally and not something that lost tc when you shut down the recorder :-)
if you dont think about that ,the tascam is good enouth
 
Oleg,
Out of curiosity, did you ever use the FR2? From my experience with it I would not think you would recommend it but??? It takes a while after you press stop for it to "finish writing to disk" During which your locked our of the system (though you can apparently go back into record while its "writing"). It felt VERY fragile and plasticy in a toy kind of way. Also not good finish, mold seams where they shouldn't be etc. It really eats batteries and it is very hard to change them with out them flying all over the place. God awful display, small and clunky. Very low gain on the mic pre. Maybe I missed some great must have feature?
 
played with few times , never worked in the field , the internal battery doesnt bother me at all , normal person have external power any way .
the metadata thing is quit good ,
the preamps - never checked it directly , the recorder was attached to consol when i played with ,also i dont see my self work directly except doing sfx .
the curent shooting i run 4-5 mics into 2 channels of 750 so the preamps are alwais not the real thing i carry about , if they are ok its good ,if they are wonderful its better

plastic , they all plastic

the tc thing is the real issue , save time on editing and i am quit exsosted to preach on that ,sorry i stopped care if someone want to pay extra money in editing .
 
Yes I think the metadata editing and such is better than most and you can hook up a keyboard. I could agree with the external power IF there was a decent external connection but its a little non locking thingy, fairly fragile. I wasn't complaining that it was plastic just that it feels unfinished. The others while also made of plastic feel more "finished" to me. Might well have no impact on the sound. I won't argue the TC issue. It isn't an issue for me but I'm not doing production so it's a little apples and oranges. If you need full TC features then the FR2 is the cheapes option. Though for a tad fewer TC features you can get the Tascam for about $800 less. And for a few hundred more you get the SD 702T which I think you would agree is a better box.

Glad to hear your voice.
Take care
SK
 
i'd agree on that... for me, (although I never use external recorders), I wouldnt get anything less than a 7 series Sound Devices of some description.
 
Hey Tim, it all goes back to value - even the lowest end SD recorders are pricey. Since the 671 and the P2 are about the same price, I would recommend AJE that you start there. If you find that you need more, then you can move up. With the P2, I think you can get a pretty good resale value (yes, I know that the resale value on SD is amazing...but still.)

Phil
 
I'm researching the same question

I'm researching the same question

Jarrod King said:
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like I remember reading the review of the Tascam HD-P2 in DV magazine and it was only capable of 24-bit recording in theory and on the spec sheet. It's actual measured performance was not much better than 16-bit, if I recall.

edit:

I found the review-

http://www.dv.com/news/news_item.jhtml?articleId=190500070

"Today's mega-thousand-dollar field recorders have dynamic ranges better than 112 dB at 24 bits; the best we could get from the HD-P2 was 96 dB in that mode. It's better than other prosumer recorders, but not a big enough difference to justify the increased media at most shoots."
Click to expand...

I'm reading right here that the

Tascam HD-P2 samples at 44.1kHz -192kHz with a resolution of 16 or 24 bits

while the

Marantz PMD-671 samples at 16 kHz to 48 kHz with a resolution of 32-384 bits!!!

So what's better; higher sampling frequency or increased resolution (more bits)?


I'm just a poor public school biology teacher who wants to capture human voice, birdsongs, and frog calls.

Any assistance with this decision will be greatly appreciated.
 
If that's all you're planning to record, then you may want to look at some of the smaller units.

I was going to say that another factor in the PMD vs. HDP2 analysis is timecode, which the HDP2 does, and the PMD does not (okay, to make sure I stay 100% accurate - the HDP2 can be jammed and hold TC but does not have TC out capabilities so it cannot be your TC master). But, for your application, TC is a non-issue.

Phil
 
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