Difference between shooting 1080i/24p and 720p/24pn

dcdirector

dcdirector

Active member
Thanks guys in advance for any respnses. I was second camera for a shoot yesterday where the producer insisted on shooting at 1080i/24p instead of shooting at 720p/24pn -- he didn't give me a very good answer, so I am sure that I can get a much better explanation from someone here. Also, I was trying to use cine-d in the scene file but in the menu, it wouldn't let me adjust the knee (it was in auto mode), is there a reason why? Thanks.
 
If the producer has other HD footage he might have already shot 1080 24p with an HDCAM. Shooting 1080 would eliminate the need to resize a 720 file.
Cine-D setting has the KNEE adjustment locked out because that is how the Cine-like settings achieve that more film-like look.
You will see on Cine-Like V the KNEE is also locked out.
Try the other Gamma settings if you need to adjust the KNEE.
 
Thanks alot HVXguy for your response and I will use the other gamma settings to adjust the knee.
Regarding the 1080i question: the shoot was a short film and the producer had no other footage -- I just thought that maybe it looked better since he was only going to put it to a dvd?
 
If it was for an SD DVD you will hardly see a difference in quality.
If he has plans to make an HD-DVD in the future then you may say a 15%-20% difference in sharpness.
 
The 1080p24 mode also doubles the effective bit-rate (80Mb/s vs 40Mb/s -- although record time on P2 reduces by 2.5), as the frame detail doesn't increase much between the 720p and 1080p, these extra bits primarily go to reducing compression artifacts. This is a good reason to shoot 1080p24 in the HVX. If you are posting in uncompressed (or non-DVCPRO-HD intermediate) it can be worth shooting in 1080p24 and down-resing to 720p in post. That archieves the best looking 720p data, and make your post easier (disk & performance issues.) After all the the cameras 720p mode is 960x720, and the 1080p mode is 1280x1080, so the vertical only down-res from 1280x1080 to 1280x720 is very clean -- although that res will not fit in DVCPRO-HD, so you have to go with an intermediate post-production format.
 
wait wait wait wait wait. are you saying this camera can shoot 1080P? i thought it only shot 1080 interlaced...
 
But take note on the above thread, many are choose not use this mode other than for special cases like effect shots -- primarily because the short record times with limited resolution gain.
 
Most folks will tell you that the camera's favorite setting is 720pN. Even though I know this, when I shoot something more serious than a silly short, I'll be shooting in 1080p.

I look forward to Barry's book!

I'd love to see a firmware update that would allow us to shoot 1080p native so that we can get more mileage out of our P2 cards.

David: You've only posted 122 messages? Every message gives us so much information, I had assumed you had posted several hundred messages. Whenever I see you post something, I make sure I take the time to read it. Your knowledge is gold.
 
Well thanks Mike. I been in HD post world for a while now, and in image processing and compression for NLEs for 15+ years (eek!), although I'm still fairly new to the HXV, so I will get thing wrong occasionally.
 
David Newman said:
This is a good reason to shoot 1080p24 in the HVX. If you are posting in uncompressed (or non-DVCPRO-HD intermediate) it can be worth shooting in 1080p24 and down-resing to 720p in post. That archieves the best looking 720p data, and make your post easier (disk & performance issues.)
Click to expand...

If you had the computing power and/or used an intermediate codec, would you still recommend down rezzing to 720 from a 1080 capture?
 
BigMike: "oh allen you're super dreamy!"
David: "Array of frame-rate options, including 24P; advanced image and audio settings; wonderful viewfinder and control layout; wide lens."
BigMike: "..."
David: "Limited battery life; lens is short for some applications; lacks true 16x9 chips; moderately tough learning curve; not the best in low light.
BigMike: "nevermind."


:Drogar-BigGrin(DBG)
 
peter orland said:
If you had the computing power and/or used an intermediate codec, would you still recommend down rezzing to 720 from a 1080 capture?
Click to expand...

In most cases if you were shooting mixed 720p and 1080p project, I would favor normalizing to 1280x720p -- perfect for broadcast and HD mastering. If you have a film project, you going to up-res to 1920x1080/2k at some point for film-out, so with the beefy system up-res to 1920x1080 and post at that res. As I said elsewhere, now all your post-elements are not limited by DVCPRO-HD default resolutions.
 
David Newman said:
As I said elsewhere, now all your post-elements are not limited by DVCPRO-HD default resolutions.
Click to expand...

Thanks David, and yes you have, but not everyone may be following all your informative posting, thought I'd just make the distinction in this thread.
 
David:
Going over the specs for AspectHD, I see 1080 x 1440 but not 1920 x 1080. I assume, then, that Aspect doesn't support 1920 x 1080?
We would have to upgrade to Prospect. Right?
 
mcshyd said:
BigMike: "oh allen you're super dreamy!"
David: "Array of frame-rate options, including 24P; advanced image and audio settings; wonderful viewfinder and control layout; wide lens."
BigMike: "..."
David: "Limited battery life; lens is short for some applications; lacks true 16x9 chips; moderately tough learning curve; not the best in low light.
BigMike: "nevermind."
Click to expand...

Harlequin Romance is taking submissions. If you can carry that emotion for 180 pages, you can submit your manuscript to them: http://www.harlequinromanceauthors.com/
 
BigMike said:
David:
Going over the specs for AspectHD, I see 1080 x 1440 but not 1920 x 1080. I assume, then, that Aspect doesn't support 1920 x 1080?
We would have to upgrade to Prospect. Right?
Click to expand...

That is correct, we save to glamor modes to Prospect HD, it has 1920x1080 10-bit, and with the film-maker pack (a.k.a Prospect 2K) it goes to 2048x2048.
 
Hello David,
Great info for those on the fences. We have all flavors of footage.
I would bet to see more HVX shooters going to 1080 24pA when the P2 cards get cheaper with larger capacities.
Remember the HVX has only been out for about 5 months. And most of the footage we get are from brand new HVX users, as the summer goes on we expect to see an increase in quality and quanity of footage.
 
HVXguy said:
Remember the HVX has only been out for about 5 months. And most of the footage we get are from brand new HVX users, as the summer goes on we expect to see an increase in quality and quanity of footage.
Click to expand...

Indeed...right now about half of all HVX footage falls along the lines of "Hey! Check out how awesome my dog looks!...IN HD!!" :D
 
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