Best "CineMatic Look" Settings?

Justin Marx

Justin Marx

Well-known member
I have had the camera for about three days.. Already done a large budget short film as the 2nd Unit camera OP (slow mo/blue screen), and a window TV spot (plays only on an HD TV in the store window) on the beach for a Local merchant.. I LOVE IT!!! Shot a kid eating strawberry ice cream, and made the client tear up ;-)

The one thing (I know it's me) I am confused about is: What my optimal settings should be for the "film look".. I have shot a 1/2 day today just of test footage.. I shot it in the 720Pn/720p FILM CAM 180.0d shutter mode (SCENE FILE 6 on the dial) and I did some very slow pans.. using an Oconnor 2575B..

They looked GREAT on the camera.. but when played back on my HDTV, it was a bit hard to look at.. maybe i just need to pan even slower (hard sometimes when following a car)..
Is it because there is so much more information in HD that you need to limit you pan speed? Argg.. what am I doing wrong?

Besides panning even SLOWER, are there any suggestions on settings to smoothen out the motion? shutter angle?

Could someone give me their optimal settings they have tried that you think work the best?

I searched the forum for about 2 hours, and only found bits and pieces of this answer..

Thanks guys and girls :-)

I cant wait till the short is edited so I can post some footage!!
 
There are no optimal settings. The reason for this is that one has to pick the optimal setting depending on what is in the scene. In the case of a pan right or left you may want to open up your shutter angle more to get more motion blur. If you have control over what you are shooting, you can also have the subject move slower and shoot at a slightly slower frame rate. Like 22fps or even 20. You'd have to do some math. Keep in mind that if your subject is stationary in relation with the framing, a slightly jittery background will not be as noticeable to the viewer.
An old cinematography rule of thumb is allow 7 seconds for the subject to travel from one side of the frame to the other. Also, if you have an ASC manuel, there is a chart for pans in the back. There is also a chart for compensating frame rate with the speed of moving objects. If you don't have an ASC manuel... Get one. They're expensive, but worth it.
If you need to use what you have already shot, try adding some motion blur in your NLE. I've never had to do this, but I don't see why it wouldn't at least help.
 
Any movement shot in Progressive mode will be jittery. It's because you only have half the fields. Technically 1 combined field per frame instead of 2 fields per frame.
Not exactly the same but comparitively like shooting high speed action or water splashing at a high frame rate compared to a slow frame rate. (weak analogy).

I can only speak for my tastes, but I've never liked the progressive mode. I know several people disagree, but I've always liked to get all the fields possible and THEN adjust the look in post. That way the client can make changes.
 
[SIZE=+0]ok.. example of what I was shooting (sorry thought I put it there): I was shooting a WIDE shot of a few people walking from left to right on the beach.. Following them panning left to right with them.. [/SIZE]
[SIZE=+0]shot in:[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+0]720Pn/Film cam mode/180.0d/1/48th.. Looks a bit jittery?[/SIZE]
 
if you're panning, you want a faster shutter speed. 180 degrees might be too slow for what you were doing. Try using a faster shutter (turn off syncro or bring the degrees down) and see how that works for panning. I imagine you'll get better results.

If the camera is stationary, you can use a longer shutter speed and just the subject will be blurred, this is a cool effect. but panning with a slow shutter just makes everything look like you know what.

It's not the fault of the progressive features of the cam. I shoot tons of action stuff, and it's all progressive. progressive is the way to go in my book.
 
Interested in this too. I think a basic summary could be "what improvements to the Cinelook D setting do people recommend?"

Heck, if people don't mind posting such, what would you recommend as some good custom scene file settings that might better serve videographers or indie filmmakers better than the factory defaults? :)
 
I'd say dropping the master pedestal down a bit is pretty necessary. not too much or you'll be sorry when you get to post and try to color correct. (plus, you can always drop the black in post anyways) I fiddle with detail coring sometimes, but find that usually cine d is ok.
 
Film 101

Film 101

d-mac said:
if you're panning, you want a faster shutter speed. 180 degrees might be too slow for what you were doing. Try using a faster shutter (turn off syncro or bring the degrees down) and see how that works for panning. I imagine you'll get better results.
Click to expand...

Wrong. If you "bring the degrees down" you will increase the jittery look. A video camera is not designed like a motion picture film camera. However, in the case of the HVX, the folks at Panny modeled many of the settings in such a way that film buffs can relate to. So for all intensive purposes, the same rules for a film camera apply to the HVX. This is how it works...
In a motion picture film camera the light passes through a lens and is "burnt" onto the film. This much I hope you know. That is how you get the image onto ONE frame. Now the camera needs to advance the film to the next frame. If there was no shutter to block the light while the camera advances the film the film would continue to get "burnt" creating a blurred or streaked effect traveling vertically (in most cases) on the frame. Hence, a gadget called a shutter is installed between the film and the lens to block the light while the film is in motion. When the film has stopped advancing for that fraction of a second, then the shutter allows light to pass onto the film.
Now let's talk about the shutter. The shutter in a motion picture camera is a spinning disc that has a "pie piece" cut out of it.

Let's take a disc such as a CD. Cut one quarter of that disc out. Now take that pie piece and throw it away. What you have now is a 45 degree shutter angle. Cut another quarter out of the disc and throw the "pie piece" away. Now you have a 190 degree shutter angle. It is important to know that the bigger the shutter angle, the longer light will be "burning" the film. If you have a 190 degree shutter angle and the film is running at 24 fps, then your film will be exposed to light for 1/48 of a second. If you shutter angle is 45 degrees and the film is running at 24 fps, then your film will be exposed to light for 1/96 of a second.

How we perceive these images is everything. Motion blur is when everything in motion blurs or streaks. If there is a little motion blur, the footage "appears" to be more fluid. Likewise, if you have too much motion blur it will be distracting. Remember how jittery the fight scenes were in "Gladiator"? Or the scary scenes in "28 Days Later"? That is because they shot the footage with either a small shutter angle or (in the case of 28 Days) a high shutter speed.

So now you may be asking how come the footage I see at the theater looks smother than what I shoot on my camera? Mostly this is due to the fact that each individual frame is projected twice in a film projector. A projector has a disc shutter like a film camera, but it has two pie slices cut out of it instead of one. So while the film camera originally shot the footage at 24 fps, you are actually watching footage at 48 fps.


d-mac said:
If the camera is stationary, you can use a longer shutter speed and just the subject will be blurred, this is a cool effect. but panning with a slow shutter just makes everything look like you know what.
Click to expand...


Again, this depends on how slow the shutter speed is. Balance is the key.


d-mac said:
It's not the fault of the progressive features of the cam. I shoot tons of action stuff, and it's all progressive. progressive is the way to go in my book.
Click to expand...

Agreed
 
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