Can you edit HD with Premiere Pro?

Soundmaster, I don't know what you're talking about, and I would hesitate to employ 9 exclamation points in the same message, but:

Raylight works fine. And the P2 Viewer supports DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, and DVCPRO-HD in both 720 and 1080 varieties.
 
Barry_Green said:
And the P2 Viewer supports DVCPRO, DVCPRO50, and DVCPRO-HD in both 720 and 1080 varieties.

P2 Viewer specs right from Panasonic:

System requirements: Microsoft(R) Windows 2000 SP4 or later, Windows XP Professional SP1 or later, or DirectX 9.0b or later; full-color (32-bit) display; sound card; and P2 driver (comes bundled with the P2 cam, P2 deck, and P2 drive)
*An MPEG4 decoder must be separately downloaded for proxy files.

Main Features
• Plays P2 clips (DVCPRO 50, DVCPRO, DV)
• Plays proxy files
• Displays a mark over icons of clips containing shot markers, voice memos, 16:9 wide images, and proxy data
• Displays metadata-based clip filtering
• Displays clip properties, allows partial editing of properties
• Uploads metadata to a P2 cam using an SD Memory Card
• Records, plays, moves and deletes voice memos
• Writes, displays, moves and deletes text memos
• Copies clips to another P2 card or to a hard drive
• Reformats P2 cards
 
reflex said:
Do all macs handle HD better or something? Whats teh reason?
Presently the Macs use a microprocessor that was specifically designed from the ground up to do graphics. Therefore, the CPU is more efficient at doing photo graphics, and video graphics at the micro instruction level. Additionally, the author of Premiere Pro is also the author of Final Cut Pro. But FCP has benefitted from the mistakes he made in the Premiere Pro design. Every developer will usually get better at the same product types with time especially when he DOESN't have to continue trying to build new functions on top of poor code.

However, a Premiere P2 solution is in the works and we should see results at NAB.
 
Oh great! I just broke a got Avid. :( Grrrrr. Having to learn the navigation is very hard for me since being a straight PPro user, but my 1080i files play great. I can even grab the timeline marker and scrub fast forward and back again and my machine keeps up without stutter. If PPro comes up with a solution that is just as good, I'm gonna kick myself in the butt. When is NAB? Grrrrrrr.
 
HagerNYC tell me about it bro!

you KNOW premiere are gonna catch up but I need a solution now! It will be too late by the time ive gone to mac (although apple are making that difficult by not supporting us PAL peeps)
 
SoundMaster said:
Presently the Macs use a microprocessor that was specifically designed from the ground up to do graphics. Therefore, the CPU is more efficient at doing photo graphics, and video graphics at the micro instruction level. Additionally, the author of Premiere Pro is also the author of Final Cut Pro. But FCP has benefitted from the mistakes he made in the Premiere Pro design. Every developer will usually get better at the same product types with time especially when he DOESN't have to continue trying to build new functions on top of poor code.

However, a Premiere P2 solution is in the works and we should see results at NAB.
Are your talking about their Intel CPUs?

Wasn't FCP created well before Premiere Pro?

Wasn't Premiere Pro a major re-design from the ground up?

You keep saying "he". Are you saying that Premiere Pro and Final Cut Pro were made by a single programmer?

Just want to clear some of this stuff up... Thanks.
 
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MrPolarBare said:
Are your talking about their Intel CPUs?

Wasn't FCP created well before Premiere Pro?

Wasn't Premiere Pro a major re-design from the ground up?

You keep saying "he". Are you saying that Premiere Pro and Final Cut Pro were made by a single programmer?

Just want to clear some of this stuff up... Thanks.

INTEL processors are just now being introduced to the Macs. Mac processors have always been made by Motorola until just recently.

Yes, Randy Ubillos and other members of his team originally created Adobe Premiere. Its ironic though that they were hired by Macromedia to create what is now known as Final Cut. Yes, Adobe remade Premiere Pro in 2003 from a new codebase, copying many FCP features, and then Macromedia BOUGHT Adobe!
See the history of final Cut Pro at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Cut_Pro
See the history of Premiere Pro at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Premiere_Pro
 
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from a new codebase, copying many FCP features, and then Macromedia BOUGHT Adobe!

Actually, Adobe bought Macromedia last year.

A lot of inbreeding going on out there, ya'll.
 
HagerNYC said:
Oh great! I just broke a got Avid. :( Grrrrr. Having to learn the navigation is very hard for me since being a straight PPro user, but my 1080i files play great. I can even grab the timeline marker and scrub fast forward and back again and my machine keeps up without stutter. If PPro comes up with a solution that is just as good, I'm gonna kick myself in the butt. When is NAB? Grrrrrrr.

I don't know.. my PPRO 2.0 plays the naitive HDV clips just find now. At first they seemed kind of studdery...but I dont know what happened but it works great.

my system is

P4 3.0GHz
2.5GB ram
128 MB videocard

I can have multiply clips play back in realtime and adding cross dissolves and all that is quick. I just put a bunch of clips on a timeline, threw 9 cross dissolves in there and hit enter.. only took like 20 sec to render them out. I'm very happy with PPRO 2.0 now.
 
SoundMaster said:
INTEL processors are just now being introduced to the Macs. Mac processors have always been made by Motorola until just recently.

Yes, Randy Ubillos and other members of his team originally created Adobe Premiere. Its ironic though that they were hired by Macromedia to create what is now known as Final Cut. Yes, Adobe remade Premiere Pro in 2003 from a new codebase, copying many FCP features, and then Macromedia BOUGHT Adobe!
See the history of final Cut Pro at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Cut_Pro
See the history of Premiere Pro at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adobe_Premiere_Pro
So you are saying that the Power PC processors are built from the ground up for graphics. And that they perform better than Intel and AMD. Then why is Apple bragging about all of their performance boosts they are now getting with Intel? The reason why Apple changed to Intel was because the PowerPC processor overheats, is an energy hog, and is currently unable to get to the 3GHz benchmark. Doesn't sound like a great design to me. Apparently it doesn't sound like a great design to Apple anymore either.

You said the guy that created Premiere Pro created FCP. So now you are saying the guy that created Premiere (not Pro) is the guy that created FCP, and Adobe actually copied FCP to make Premiere Pro. You seemed mixed up. Your two responses are conflicting. Your second response is correct. Thats why I wanted you to clarify yourself before I chopped away.

And like it was already mentioned Adobe acquired Macromedia, not the other way around.
 
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reflex said:
I don't know.. my PPRO 2.0 plays the naitive HDV clips just find now. At first they seemed kind of studdery...but I dont know what happened but it works great.

my system is

P4 3.0GHz
2.5GB ram
128 MB videocard

I can have multiply clips play back in realtime and adding cross dissolves and all that is quick. I just put a bunch of clips on a timeline, threw 9 cross dissolves in there and hit enter.. only took like 20 sec to render them out. I'm very happy with PPRO 2.0 now.

reflex....so the Raylight/PPro 2.0 system is working well for you?

what about render times with some colour correction?

thanks for your help mate.
 
SoundMaster said:
Mac processors have always been made by Motorola until just recently.

I do not spend to much time here, but Motorola fade away starting with the G5 processors in 2003:

a) original PowerPC processors are IBM (AIM group)
b) G3 processors made by IBM and Motorola
b) G4 processors are Motorola (IBM helped with non altivec procs)
c) G5 processors are IBM
d) new core duo processors are Intel
 
adam powell said:
reflex....so the Raylight/PPro 2.0 system is working well for you?

what about render times with some colour correction?

thanks for your help mate.
For a 1 minute sequence, it takes me 12 minutes to render (720/24P). That is without any color correction though. And that is rendering out as a Quicktime with Avid DV100 codec.

My system is Athlon 64 X2 4200 with 2GB of ram.
 
SoundMaster said:
Presently the Macs use a microprocessor that was specifically designed from the ground up to do graphics. Therefore, the CPU is more efficient at doing photo graphics, and video graphics at the micro instruction level.
Because thats why Apple is switching to Intel processors.

Right now the software support is on the Mac for p2 because the demand is there. Many professional houses are using Macs, because for a while they were the fastest to do the video work, but with the advent of some of the newer AMD X2 processors, and their price, alot of editors have been going PC.

Avid 5+ supports p2 (1080i DVCPROHD) I'm not sure of the performance because My company doesn't have a HVX-200. However AVID is the only PC editing solution right now that supports p2 format as of RIGHT NOW. There are other work arounds, but the workflow isn't going to be worth the speed.

Give it a year, there are going to be many solutions for P2 on PC.

FCP is going to be your least headache for editing right now. It is very similar to Premiere Pro and you wont have to learn anyhting new to use it. Avid is going to slow you down if you have been on Premiere for a long time, becaue the learning curve for it will be steeper for you as an editor.

If you have to stay PC, you can try buying FCP, OS X, and run it on your INTEL PC. However the current binaries for FCP are still for PPC, so you'll be running them in OSX under rosetta emulation. (its about half speed of a current Mac)

It really all depends on if you can 1: Wait for a PC p2 solution, 2: Buy and learn Avid 5+, or 3: Just break down and buy a Mac+FCP right now.
 
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adam powell said:
reflex....so the Raylight/PPro 2.0 system is working well for you?

what about render times with some colour correction?

thanks for your help mate.

What's raylight again? I just have PPro 2.0 and edit the HDV clips naitively.

again my pc is a:

3.0 GHz P4
2.5 gig's of ram
128MB nVidia geforce fx 5200 V card

clips all play back fine / smooth and transitions like cross dissolves render REALLY quick. (obviously)

When using Magic Bullet.. it renders out at about 1 frame per second. So it takes a bit of time, but if you need it for a serious project then it's worth it, and hell, you can just let it render over night, while you sleep.

Color correcting and gamma , levels etc... those types of things render faster than MB, but not a TON. Noticabally faster though. I tried the Cineform Aspect HD and to me wasn't worth it. Some other people might need it, but for me, I didn't want to shell out 500 bones for features that I won't really use.

I don't convert to 24p. I can edit the clips naitively. Rendering out transitions takes only a second ( realtime ) anyway so it's not like I'm losing precious time waiting for that. I mean that plugin did what it said it would do and well... but it just wasn't for me. I might have thought twice about getting it if it dramatically decreased rendering times with MB.
 
MrPolarBare said:
So you are saying that the Power PC processors are built from the ground up for graphics. And that they perform better than Intel and AMD. Then why is Apple bragging about all of their performance boosts they are now getting with Intel? The reason why Apple changed to Intel was because the PowerPC processor overheats, is an energy hog, and is currently unable to get to the 3GHz benchmark. Doesn't sound like a great design to me. Apparently it doesn't sound like a great design to Apple anymore either.
You are doing what so many of my programmers do and that is extrapolating one statement into your choice of ideas inspite of what was NOT said. I did NOT say that Motorola processors perform BETTER - that is an extrapolation of "efficient graphics" without bothering to understand what is meant by "efficient graphics". And this is a statement about history not present or future. "Efficient graphics" means fewer instructions are required to produce a result. Since the early 70's when I first began building computers the Intel processor was always the processor of choice even though the x86 model was not necessarily the best design. Even in most of my Masters in Electrical Engineering courses we used Intel processors. However, we also briefly studied the Motorola design as well, which by the nature of its instruction set is more efficient at doing graphics. That does not mean it is the BEST processor, the coolest processor, or the most desired processor. Apple went with the Motorola processor because its instruction set was most efficient at performing graphics. Compared to the 8080 processor (the first x86 CPU) the Motorola processor performed a graphic task faster at the same clock speed. That was 1973! Since then processor designs have improved to where there is little difference now in performance. However, Motorola's quality control is still not much better than it was in the early 80's when Motorola sold their Quasar plant to Matsushita Electric. Which is very disappointing. That's part of why Apple is switching to Intel processors. The major reason is what Steve Jobs and Apple has always been about - graphics and education marketing. Once Mac OSs can use Intel microprocessors, then Apple can start cutting into Windows market share, especially in the graphics and education markets where their market strength has always been high.

Just keep in mind that there is alot more to computer design than the CLOCK speed. Clock speed is NOT the key to high performance computers. The key is in the I/O management. That is where the supercomputers have always had the advantage. The Opteron design comes the closest to what supercomputers have been doing for decades. In fact Cray plans to use Opteron processors in its next generation supercomputer. But their motherboards and communication boards are designed for much higher I/O frequencies than a typical PC motherboard.
 
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reflex said:
What's raylight again?
Raylight is a special codec that translates the HVX200's MXF files into Windows AVI files. It doesn't create a whole new video file. The codec actually creates a wrapper file that basically acts like a translator between any program that accepts AVI files and the source MXF file. Basically it allows you to use your MXF files that you shoot with your HVX200 on almost any windows based video application (Premiere, Vegas, After Effects, etc). If the application can accept Windows AVIs, then it can accept Raylight. The nice thing is that it keeps 100% quality of the original MXF file, since it doesn't replace the MXF file, but just translates it. Sorry if this is confusing...I am trying to describe it as simple as possible..
 
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MrPolarBare said:
Sorry if this is confusing...I am trying to describe it as simple as possible..

No no not at all, I understand. Basically the same as Aspect HD. it's a good deal if you are using a NLE that doesn't let you edit naitively and you don't wanna drop some cash on another one.
 
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