stephenlnoe you are a valuable member of this forum now I must bring my cam in tommorow?
FREE upgade to "A" Version It's official
- Thread starter stephenlnoe
- Start date
Carcaridon
Well-known member
Now I only have one camera, but I brought mine into the center and dropped it off. They're not doing the upgrade while you wait, unfortunately.
egproductions
Veteran
Elton said:
Granted Canon has never made a firmware upgrade to ther cameras as of yet, They did upgrade the xl2 and began shipping the new version at the same price as the old one. You couldn't send yours in to be updated becasue it was a physical change that was made to the camera. If you were thinking of the lack of 24f support in NLE's with the H1 in HDV mode i dont think thre is anything they can do except add a pullup which would be rediculous.(they shouldnt have to take a step backward because other companies haven't come up the solutions that they have)
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jlames
Well-known member
Actually, I don't know. I’m leaving that up to someone else in the company but I’d assume we’re just sending one in at a time because they’re in use every day. I do want to correct you though on one issue and that is the use of the term "recall". While I suppose technically it may be correct, it evokes in many a feeling of fixing some major problem which is not, in my humble opinion, the case here.
As you know because we've talked about this at HD Expo, I'm not a JVC employee nor am I some flag-waving, Rush Limbaugh or Howard Stern-type radical (and I use these for polar opposite representations only. I have no opinion of either of them and have met neither of them) and JVC doesn't need me to explain things. I'm simply an outsider looking at the camera and the company objectively as a hands-on Producer and an Executive Producer with alot of money and hard-earned reputation on the line. We selected the company as much as we selected the camera. Remember, it was JVC who jumped in when we were having issues with IDX and straightened things out while I never even received so much as a “You’re an idiot, Sir, but we’d like to straighten this thing out” phone call from IDX. That right there tells me who understands what being a good corporate partner is all about and who doesn't...or at the very least, doesn't care.
To call this a “recall” is inappropriate as best and misleading at worst. From my understanding, the HD100's Version A upgrade has its origin in extensive discussions with NLE suppliers who are basing future JVC-compatible development on firmware now standardized in Version A. In addition, certain extended functionality enabled by peripherals whose designs were incomplete when the HD100 was launched last year can be added to existing HD100 owners'
cameras. In the process, some unusual events such as segmented scenes
experienced by Final Cut Pro users are also being addressed. The bottom line reality is that JVC will bring each HD100 owner's camera to the level of current GY-HD100 manufacture. Though a completely unconventional and enormously expensive undertaking, they felt it important to sustain the confidence certainly we as a corporation and others as both companies like Michel Pappas and individual buyers of all HD100 owners have in JVC, especially the very early purchasers.
The Version A upgrade is a huge investment in brand equity by a company whose beleaguered battleship needed turning around I the worst way. Perhaps it's easy for competitors who have not recently undertaken an initiative of this magnitude to offhandedly dismiss JVC's investment as a "recall" but the fact of the matter is the camera, as it stood when we purchased 5 of them a couple of months ago and not the “A” version, out-distanced the other three for our broadcast television purposes greatly so we acted to standardize on the JVC company…the company not just the product and that’s an important distinction. We did this knowing that when better intel came along, the company would act to bring upgrades along to certify that our decision and our cameras remained timely. We did not expect to have the upgrades provided gratis and averaged the cost of upgrades into the cost of ownership over the course of the production year.
With NAB coming up in less than a month, the camera is almost a year old for heaven’s sake. Technology reinvents itself every 18 months according to Moore’s Law which means that, in mainstream technology-time with which we are all familiar, this camera SHOULD RIGHTLY receive an upgrade that SHOULD RIGHTLY be charged for and someone is going to sit there in their comfortable armchairs and denigrate a company for providing a complete and wholesale upgrade of a product free to the public who bought it! Hogwash!!! (in my humble opinion) Nobody starts shouting “recall” every time a company who’s notorious for accusations, right or wrong, of manipulating the system and releasing versions they know to be deficient and providing “upgrades” along the way. And yes, I’m talking about Microsoft. “Recall”??? Hogwash!!! If anyone has a right, because of the time element, to complain it should be me who bought 5 two months ago and is buying another 5 after NAB and now has to send them back in, just like everyone else, to be upgraded. But you don’t hear me denigrating the company. Or Michael Pappas, or you or the dozens of other here on this great Board who just bought the camera. But we don’t because we see the whole picture and not a distorted clip of it taken out of context.
You know me well enough after the time we spent together at HD Expo and others out there know that we didn’t and don’t accept anything free of charge and have no ties to any corporation whatsoever. We don’t get discounts that anyone can’t get from EVS despite the many who say we should. You all also know that I’m given to these Rants but only occasionally and only when there’s been an injustice committed as was and is the case with IDX and is the case I believe here. I’d be fighting just as hard if someone was coming down on Panasonic or Sony or any other company which was the subject of unwarranted attack and to call a free upgrade that 1) must have cost JVC millions to execute, 2) must have had a proponent like Bob Mueller or Paul Kasparian or Eric Rosenberg in descending order of corporate hierarchy I understand (sorry Eric!!!) behind it fighting for the consumer against the freaking bean-counters over there (I hate bean-counters) tooth and nail for this thing and 3) should set an irrevocable, corporate, benchmark for Customer Service a “recall” is, again, at best, irresponsible and at worst, negligent.
Unless I missed something along the way, this Board’s purpose is to facilitate the proliferation of accurate and substantiated information and designed to help, not harm, the reader. This kind of false prophesy predicated on selective recall and reporting serves only to misdirect the reader and injure both the reader and the company’s reputation. I can’t speak for Stephen, Barry, Jared, and the dozens of other learned individuals who contribute countless hours to the readers here with the sole means of recompense being the feeling we get in helping others but if JVC is not going to come to it’s own defense, and bully for them for not taking the bait (they’re probably smarter than I) then I will and I’ll take the hits from those of you who feel that this post is in any way inappropriate.
I will say it again. Moore’s 1965 Law, coined ironically not by Gordon Moore himself, co-founder of Intel, but by Carver Mead, states, correctly, that that the number of transistors per square inch on integrated circuits had doubled every year since the integrated circuit was invented. It has come to mean, simply, that technology reinvents itself every 18-months and any company whoich doesn't is destined to failure and oblivion. (Media 100. Great product. Don’t know what happened) Moore predicted that this trend would continue for the foreseeable future and although, in subsequent years, the pace slowed down a bit, data density has nonetheless doubled approximately every 18 months and industry experts expect the Law to hold for at least another two decades.
Who among us can factually support the application of the term “recall” to JVC’s voluntary and free upgrade of a system designed with the best intel (no pun intended) available almost 18 months ago and released to EVS as a demo in August of 2005 a “Recall”? Not me. Bully to JVC and whomever was over there fighting the war of the bean-counters and thanks to them, I’m not sending a check along with the camera.
OK, I’m off my soap box now. And if you did\n’t get it, we’re sending one camera at a time in for upgrade while then others in the field continue to perform with the same excellence which formed the basis for our selection of them a couple of months ago.
As you know because we've talked about this at HD Expo, I'm not a JVC employee nor am I some flag-waving, Rush Limbaugh or Howard Stern-type radical (and I use these for polar opposite representations only. I have no opinion of either of them and have met neither of them) and JVC doesn't need me to explain things. I'm simply an outsider looking at the camera and the company objectively as a hands-on Producer and an Executive Producer with alot of money and hard-earned reputation on the line. We selected the company as much as we selected the camera. Remember, it was JVC who jumped in when we were having issues with IDX and straightened things out while I never even received so much as a “You’re an idiot, Sir, but we’d like to straighten this thing out” phone call from IDX. That right there tells me who understands what being a good corporate partner is all about and who doesn't...or at the very least, doesn't care.
To call this a “recall” is inappropriate as best and misleading at worst. From my understanding, the HD100's Version A upgrade has its origin in extensive discussions with NLE suppliers who are basing future JVC-compatible development on firmware now standardized in Version A. In addition, certain extended functionality enabled by peripherals whose designs were incomplete when the HD100 was launched last year can be added to existing HD100 owners'
cameras. In the process, some unusual events such as segmented scenes
experienced by Final Cut Pro users are also being addressed. The bottom line reality is that JVC will bring each HD100 owner's camera to the level of current GY-HD100 manufacture. Though a completely unconventional and enormously expensive undertaking, they felt it important to sustain the confidence certainly we as a corporation and others as both companies like Michel Pappas and individual buyers of all HD100 owners have in JVC, especially the very early purchasers.
The Version A upgrade is a huge investment in brand equity by a company whose beleaguered battleship needed turning around I the worst way. Perhaps it's easy for competitors who have not recently undertaken an initiative of this magnitude to offhandedly dismiss JVC's investment as a "recall" but the fact of the matter is the camera, as it stood when we purchased 5 of them a couple of months ago and not the “A” version, out-distanced the other three for our broadcast television purposes greatly so we acted to standardize on the JVC company…the company not just the product and that’s an important distinction. We did this knowing that when better intel came along, the company would act to bring upgrades along to certify that our decision and our cameras remained timely. We did not expect to have the upgrades provided gratis and averaged the cost of upgrades into the cost of ownership over the course of the production year.
With NAB coming up in less than a month, the camera is almost a year old for heaven’s sake. Technology reinvents itself every 18 months according to Moore’s Law which means that, in mainstream technology-time with which we are all familiar, this camera SHOULD RIGHTLY receive an upgrade that SHOULD RIGHTLY be charged for and someone is going to sit there in their comfortable armchairs and denigrate a company for providing a complete and wholesale upgrade of a product free to the public who bought it! Hogwash!!! (in my humble opinion) Nobody starts shouting “recall” every time a company who’s notorious for accusations, right or wrong, of manipulating the system and releasing versions they know to be deficient and providing “upgrades” along the way. And yes, I’m talking about Microsoft. “Recall”??? Hogwash!!! If anyone has a right, because of the time element, to complain it should be me who bought 5 two months ago and is buying another 5 after NAB and now has to send them back in, just like everyone else, to be upgraded. But you don’t hear me denigrating the company. Or Michael Pappas, or you or the dozens of other here on this great Board who just bought the camera. But we don’t because we see the whole picture and not a distorted clip of it taken out of context.
You know me well enough after the time we spent together at HD Expo and others out there know that we didn’t and don’t accept anything free of charge and have no ties to any corporation whatsoever. We don’t get discounts that anyone can’t get from EVS despite the many who say we should. You all also know that I’m given to these Rants but only occasionally and only when there’s been an injustice committed as was and is the case with IDX and is the case I believe here. I’d be fighting just as hard if someone was coming down on Panasonic or Sony or any other company which was the subject of unwarranted attack and to call a free upgrade that 1) must have cost JVC millions to execute, 2) must have had a proponent like Bob Mueller or Paul Kasparian or Eric Rosenberg in descending order of corporate hierarchy I understand (sorry Eric!!!) behind it fighting for the consumer against the freaking bean-counters over there (I hate bean-counters) tooth and nail for this thing and 3) should set an irrevocable, corporate, benchmark for Customer Service a “recall” is, again, at best, irresponsible and at worst, negligent.
Unless I missed something along the way, this Board’s purpose is to facilitate the proliferation of accurate and substantiated information and designed to help, not harm, the reader. This kind of false prophesy predicated on selective recall and reporting serves only to misdirect the reader and injure both the reader and the company’s reputation. I can’t speak for Stephen, Barry, Jared, and the dozens of other learned individuals who contribute countless hours to the readers here with the sole means of recompense being the feeling we get in helping others but if JVC is not going to come to it’s own defense, and bully for them for not taking the bait (they’re probably smarter than I) then I will and I’ll take the hits from those of you who feel that this post is in any way inappropriate.
I will say it again. Moore’s 1965 Law, coined ironically not by Gordon Moore himself, co-founder of Intel, but by Carver Mead, states, correctly, that that the number of transistors per square inch on integrated circuits had doubled every year since the integrated circuit was invented. It has come to mean, simply, that technology reinvents itself every 18-months and any company whoich doesn't is destined to failure and oblivion. (Media 100. Great product. Don’t know what happened) Moore predicted that this trend would continue for the foreseeable future and although, in subsequent years, the pace slowed down a bit, data density has nonetheless doubled approximately every 18 months and industry experts expect the Law to hold for at least another two decades.
Who among us can factually support the application of the term “recall” to JVC’s voluntary and free upgrade of a system designed with the best intel (no pun intended) available almost 18 months ago and released to EVS as a demo in August of 2005 a “Recall”? Not me. Bully to JVC and whomever was over there fighting the war of the bean-counters and thanks to them, I’m not sending a check along with the camera.
OK, I’m off my soap box now. And if you did\n’t get it, we’re sending one camera at a time in for upgrade while then others in the field continue to perform with the same excellence which formed the basis for our selection of them a couple of months ago.
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It's not worth splitting hairs over. Recall/upgrade, the camera was supposed to work with the Firestore over a year ago when it was first released. This upgrade/recall gives the HD100 the full functionality that its lacked. JVC marketing calls this an upgrade, but recall is also an apt word.
I don't think recall is a negative word either. I think it's great they're doing this. It will be good for buyers to go into a purchase knowing that their cam has the full functionality that was promised a year ago. You say tomato, I say tomato. Let's call the whole thing...
I don't think recall is a negative word either. I think it's great they're doing this. It will be good for buyers to go into a purchase knowing that their cam has the full functionality that was promised a year ago. You say tomato, I say tomato. Let's call the whole thing...
Stevet said:
Definitely.
jlames
Well-known member
Isaac- It was not you to whom I was referring specifically and in point of fact, I have followed your comments for a few months now not knowing until now that you are a Board moderator and they're as invaluable as they are learned and educated. But there is, in my humble but personal and experienced opinion, a marked distinction between the terms as we as a generation have come to accept them. The term "recall" has dissuaded countless millions of people in every imaginable industry to avoid a particular company or product without reason in many instances causing irreparable harm to their ability to remain viable and this comes from personal experience while I was at P&G. Just the word alone has founded basis in innumerable lawsuits when for want of a better word, the whole issue could have been avoided. I have learned that when people use this specific word and attach it to a particular product or company, it is for malicious intent and while I am not accusing anyone here of that intent, I , again, after personal familiarity with the repercussions when such a powerful and dangerous word is applied to something as good as the intentions of this company, caution against its use.
jlames
Well-known member
Filmgirl- That was a quick e-mail. Get a job!!! Yes, I changed my avatar after countless people, yes you Michael Pappas too, said I didn't look like the "fat" guy in the uniform picture. Diet and exercise led to losing 25 pounds in about 40 days and going from a 36" waist to a 30" waist again. This one's from the set of the show we're doing when they dressed me up put me on a horse and said I couldn't hit one target while riding full speed on a horse. They were wrong. I hit 2...out of ten. That's with a pair of real .45 Colt Single Actions I might add!!! I can't wait to finish the production so you all can see what we're working on. It truly is a new and exciting sport and it's alot of fun even for someone who goes 2 for ten!!!
J.R. Hudson
Spirit Animal
jlames said:
I'll bite.
Me ? :huh:
-
I agree with Isaac. It is splitting hairs to say Recall / Upgrade. It is what it is:
A fix.
I think it speaks volumes for the company and it's service (from what I understand this is a major pro with JVC ? ). Good for them, good for the customer.
But if it makes you feel better jlames; we can say Upgrade.
But I am not slamming JVC; I like the camera. Everything I see so far from the HD100 says 'Kool' (sans that damn SSE) and anyone concerned should be stoked this issue has / is being rectified.
How about update? We're talking firmware changes here, not an actual upgrade of components.
Mmmm...minced words.
Mmmm...minced words.
Thanks and I have to agree with you after sitting in on this studio's legal team's discussions for so long. There's a definite difference and I'm glad it's a simple drop it off and they'll upgrade it thing. I actually though it was a major issue when I first read this thread. You da man once a gain. And the pix is better too and I do have a job! Where are you getting all the time to sit at your desk and craft your raves like you like to call them? Must be nice to be the boss!
72 Hours ?
72 Hours ?
I am in a dilemma, I have a shoot coming up 3 rd of April , I have the old switching mode thing , it seems to happens only in 30p HD , and I loose 3 or 4 seconds of film, so far, but it is enough to worry me , I am constantly switching to view RET .
I live in NY , and I am thinking of overnighting my Camera body to JVC and get their " upgrade [A] version procedure .
My question is will JVC really do a turnaround in 72 hours, and will they send it back using regular mail or will they fedix it !
I do not wish to arrive at my shoot holding my lens.
sjr
72 Hours ?
I am in a dilemma, I have a shoot coming up 3 rd of April , I have the old switching mode thing , it seems to happens only in 30p HD , and I loose 3 or 4 seconds of film, so far, but it is enough to worry me , I am constantly switching to view RET .
I live in NY , and I am thinking of overnighting my Camera body to JVC and get their " upgrade [A] version procedure .
My question is will JVC really do a turnaround in 72 hours, and will they send it back using regular mail or will they fedix it !
I do not wish to arrive at my shoot holding my lens.
sjr
jlames
Well-known member
OK, this has gotten way out of hand. I meant no disrespect to anyone nor was I pointing the finger at any one person but rather everyone would who indiscriminately uses a word that I've seen lead to so much unwarranted grief. And I appreciate the defense I've received on this and other matters. The people who have been there know there's a big difference "recall" is just never used. Your lawyer are right Filmgirl and how long can you possibly have been in the business. You look like your about 25 but I should have asked when we met ad HD Expo. Anyway, so on to more important things.
SJC, I called JVC today in New Jersey to make darn sure that there was not a hold up and that the 72-hour guarantee was a good and honest one. I also pointed out the fact that any company, especially one that provides cameras that people make their living with need to know the truth about the numbers they provide because shooting schedules rely on them. I agree, no one wants to show up holding their lens. (What a great visual, sjr! Made me laugh. I wonder if that was what Filmgirl meant by lighten up? If so, I know I did. Good one.) And some people pretty high up guaranteed that the 72-hour time frame was good from the day they got it to the day they returned it. As for the return service method, stupidly I didn't ask but I will call them again tomorrow to see if I can find out for you. We're fortunate in that the repair facility is in Cypress so we just have to run them down there. They really do have a wait and return deal saying an average of 30 min. bench time is needed so our engineer is taking 5 of them down over 2 days so we're not down a day. But they also said they had, "a ton of camers on the bench and overtime people in working on the deal".
SJC, I called JVC today in New Jersey to make darn sure that there was not a hold up and that the 72-hour guarantee was a good and honest one. I also pointed out the fact that any company, especially one that provides cameras that people make their living with need to know the truth about the numbers they provide because shooting schedules rely on them. I agree, no one wants to show up holding their lens. (What a great visual, sjr! Made me laugh. I wonder if that was what Filmgirl meant by lighten up? If so, I know I did. Good one.) And some people pretty high up guaranteed that the 72-hour time frame was good from the day they got it to the day they returned it. As for the return service method, stupidly I didn't ask but I will call them again tomorrow to see if I can find out for you. We're fortunate in that the repair facility is in Cypress so we just have to run them down there. They really do have a wait and return deal saying an average of 30 min. bench time is needed so our engineer is taking 5 of them down over 2 days so we're not down a day. But they also said they had, "a ton of camers on the bench and overtime people in working on the deal".
Hey, thanks jl. 25! man I passed that way a long time ago but it's nice to see all the "right" food and the gym are working. I actually started at 17 where I told you in IATSE and just worked my way up off the lot and into the tower ---and now it's almost time to go out on my own which is why i started using instead of just monitoring this place. There's alot of great people here who's advice has turned out to be right on and I hate jerks shooting their mouths off. Yea, I know, I shoulda picked a different business if I hate jerks. Anyway, looking forward to seeing you at NAB. I'll be with "That" studio crowd as you put it but your studio's people aren't much better. Anyway, as you said, too much info on the board. Just wave and I'll catch up with you at the party.
stephenlnoe
Well-known member
We'll have to see. I sent a camera in yesterday from Chicago and I hope to get it back by next Friday. There is another one here that is getting on a plane to Buddapest tomorrow so the timing is not good for that camera. The problem is that once you go HD and start projects in HD then you must finish in HD. I have to admit the Sony and Panasonic SD camera's here have taken a back seat to the HD cameras quickly with our group.sjr said:
thanks for the information Jlams
thanks for the information Jlams
I did not have the patience to go through the JVC 1800 automated # s, actually when I finally arrived at what I thought I needed the office was closed Eastern time.
So I have the JVC upgrade form , with mailing address to Cypress CA, ? so i guess that means I cannot send it to NJ !
thanks for the information Jlams
I did not have the patience to go through the JVC 1800 automated # s, actually when I finally arrived at what I thought I needed the office was closed Eastern time.
So I have the JVC upgrade form , with mailing address to Cypress CA, ? so i guess that means I cannot send it to NJ !
jlames
Well-known member
As far as I can tell, the Cypress office is the repair center. Again, I'll be on the phone with them tomorrow so I'll add that question and let you know but remember. Jersey's and your time are the same but it'll be...wait. let me e-mail someone and I'l get back to you and the forum.