Which comes first, the script or the budget?
- Thread starter Joshua_G
- Start date
j1clark@ucsd.edu
Veteran
The script comes first, even if it is 50 pages long, or by the time the production rolls around, it is a completely different script... I'm sure that someone can dig up a production that didn't have a hard script in place before production began... but that's sort of like building a house without a plan... and tends to lead to budget escalation to the point of bankrupting the production company.
Egg Born Son
Veteran
Chicken or the egg?
When reading scripts for potential production as I am doing at the moment you are checking off 'can I afford this?' through each scene, every location, every prop. Whether you are indie or hollywood you know what is the most you've ever spent, what return you got and what you expect you could get again. If you are indie in particular there is going to be a hard limit to what you can afford. Yet the right script shown to the right people could change this limit in the space of a conversation. A name actor could change the value of the script with the mere indication of willingness to be attached. A script that could be made by hollywood could be worth a budget of millions if it gets read by a producer. The same script might attract a budget of $3000 in the hands of an indie writer-director who is willing to compromise on actors effects etc.
If you are writing for independent production you are more likely to get the film made if you are conscious of budget while you write. Stunts and effects, costumes (normal clothes or elaborate outfits), locations (kitchen table or major metropolitan) and props (daewoo or ferrari) are all things within the writer's power to help control the budget. All these things can be made expensive or cheap depending on how creative the production is but it makes it a lot easier if these things are controlled in the script. If you know you can potentially access funds eg through a grant or for a competition, then not only will have a pretty solid idea of your budget but will likely have additional requirements like cultural content or required props or lines.
When reading scripts for potential production as I am doing at the moment you are checking off 'can I afford this?' through each scene, every location, every prop. Whether you are indie or hollywood you know what is the most you've ever spent, what return you got and what you expect you could get again. If you are indie in particular there is going to be a hard limit to what you can afford. Yet the right script shown to the right people could change this limit in the space of a conversation. A name actor could change the value of the script with the mere indication of willingness to be attached. A script that could be made by hollywood could be worth a budget of millions if it gets read by a producer. The same script might attract a budget of $3000 in the hands of an indie writer-director who is willing to compromise on actors effects etc.
If you are writing for independent production you are more likely to get the film made if you are conscious of budget while you write. Stunts and effects, costumes (normal clothes or elaborate outfits), locations (kitchen table or major metropolitan) and props (daewoo or ferrari) are all things within the writer's power to help control the budget. All these things can be made expensive or cheap depending on how creative the production is but it makes it a lot easier if these things are controlled in the script. If you know you can potentially access funds eg through a grant or for a competition, then not only will have a pretty solid idea of your budget but will likely have additional requirements like cultural content or required props or lines.
Thanks, all of you.
Please let me elaborate the present dilemma.
First, it's an Israeli film, which means fairly low budget (in US terms).
I encountered an amazing true story about chain of events that involves unbelievable coincidences. So, though I don't have previous experience, I decided to make a documentary out of it. The documentary is basically 'talking heads', where the participants in the chain of event narrate the story, each from one's POV. Looking for funding to complete the documentary from local organizations that support documentaries, I realized that having no previous experience (and being 71 y.o.), there is no way I'm going to get funds. So I looked for a producer to approach those organizations.
A producer I contacted was thrilled by the story and decided to make a feature movie, based on true story, out of it. The movie will be produced, written and directed by people other than me. Since my interest here is that the story will be known by as many people as possible, I agreed gladly. The documentary will be screened only after the feature. The documentary is necessary as there is no doubt in my mind that many people wouldn't believe that those events actually took place, the coincidences are remarkable and unbelievable.
For a feature movie, the core chain of events needs being 'juiced' with dramatization, probably adding happenings to the core chain of events.
Some events, those concerning the main chain of events, are mandatory, like a car crash and hospital scenes, including a surgery. Other events aren't mandatory, they are only to 'juice up' the story and create drama.
The producer is busy doing other business, in between producing movies, so I decided to speed things up by trying to raise funds from unconventional sources.
The producer's mind is elsewhere and he sticks to the idea that first some money should come in, then a good script should be written, then the budget will be determined and potential backers will be approached.
Since the non-conventional backers I have in mind aren't from the film industry, I'm quite certain they'd want to know what the budget is, before considering putting in their money.
Your views?
Please let me elaborate the present dilemma.
First, it's an Israeli film, which means fairly low budget (in US terms).
I encountered an amazing true story about chain of events that involves unbelievable coincidences. So, though I don't have previous experience, I decided to make a documentary out of it. The documentary is basically 'talking heads', where the participants in the chain of event narrate the story, each from one's POV. Looking for funding to complete the documentary from local organizations that support documentaries, I realized that having no previous experience (and being 71 y.o.), there is no way I'm going to get funds. So I looked for a producer to approach those organizations.
A producer I contacted was thrilled by the story and decided to make a feature movie, based on true story, out of it. The movie will be produced, written and directed by people other than me. Since my interest here is that the story will be known by as many people as possible, I agreed gladly. The documentary will be screened only after the feature. The documentary is necessary as there is no doubt in my mind that many people wouldn't believe that those events actually took place, the coincidences are remarkable and unbelievable.
For a feature movie, the core chain of events needs being 'juiced' with dramatization, probably adding happenings to the core chain of events.
Some events, those concerning the main chain of events, are mandatory, like a car crash and hospital scenes, including a surgery. Other events aren't mandatory, they are only to 'juice up' the story and create drama.
The producer is busy doing other business, in between producing movies, so I decided to speed things up by trying to raise funds from unconventional sources.
The producer's mind is elsewhere and he sticks to the idea that first some money should come in, then a good script should be written, then the budget will be determined and potential backers will be approached.
Since the non-conventional backers I have in mind aren't from the film industry, I'm quite certain they'd want to know what the budget is, before considering putting in their money.
Your views?
j1clark@ucsd.edu
Veteran
We must have posted nearly simultaneously... I was thinking in terms of a 'detailed' budget, but your comment seems to be in terms of 'max budget', as in what, as an independent filmmaker do for $10K... $100K... or in my case $0.1K...
j1clark@ucsd.edu
Veteran
Somewhere along the line, the naked ape invents clothing, then enforces clothing on all... at least for 99% of the world's 'naked' ape population.
wcmartell
Well-known member
And that clothing will increase the budget. Which is Doris Wishman was able to make classic science fiction films like NUDE ON THE MOON on small budgets.
Bill
shutterspeedfilms
Well-known member
For indie films, the Polish brothers recommended writing your script with a budget number in mind.
The same said Robert Rodrigues. Do you have a dog? Make film about the dog. Does your mom sells ice cream? Make a film about ice cream shop. Use what you have around you (that is your current budget).
Egg Born Son
Veteran
If you already have a producer and he's taken the project off you, then funding may be largely out of your hands now.
If the project has a personal, political or cultural resonance with these investors you mention and/or they are philanthropists or have a business angle such as product placement they could be very interested. If it has cultural significance there is likely several avenues your producer should know how to exploit such as state funding and private foundations. There is sometimes also the possibility of partnering with organisations (charities in particular) that can grant investments tax deductible status. If your producer is a real producer he should know all these avenues. The best thing you can do on the outside of your own project is to bring these potential investors to your producers attention and then organise an introduction.
Expect this project to take time to get started. There is a lot that needs to go into a preproduction. From the other angle also be aware that this is an industry where possibilities get talked up big then reality kicks in later. Everyone is always excited by a good idea but whether it goes the distance depends on a lot of factors. It's easy to get caught up in the energy. If the producer has a bunch of things going on, realise that the excitement is probably real but you are not their whole world right now.
If the project has a personal, political or cultural resonance with these investors you mention and/or they are philanthropists or have a business angle such as product placement they could be very interested. If it has cultural significance there is likely several avenues your producer should know how to exploit such as state funding and private foundations. There is sometimes also the possibility of partnering with organisations (charities in particular) that can grant investments tax deductible status. If your producer is a real producer he should know all these avenues. The best thing you can do on the outside of your own project is to bring these potential investors to your producers attention and then organise an introduction.
Expect this project to take time to get started. There is a lot that needs to go into a preproduction. From the other angle also be aware that this is an industry where possibilities get talked up big then reality kicks in later. Everyone is always excited by a good idea but whether it goes the distance depends on a lot of factors. It's easy to get caught up in the energy. If the producer has a bunch of things going on, realise that the excitement is probably real but you are not their whole world right now.
craigbowman
Veteran
I guess its a good thing I never paid the slightest bit of attention of what is supposed to be. I've always just figured out what needed to be what and then made it so.
j1clark@ucsd.edu
Veteran
Well, then there's hope for my "Planet of the Naked Apes"... well... the problem with Wishman and similar nudesploitation films of yore... is that with full on porn, they sort of don't appeal to a particularly wide market these days...
Try to hit underground market, foreign market, alternative market, invisible market, transdimensional market... and so on. If only market is your problem.