Enough Bowing Before Actors: Take Time to get Actors Who Trust The Director!

[Doc Bernard]

David has put it much more eloquently than I could. Me, I am blunt in this area. I already have a list of people that I am too busy to work with/for. Detested the attitude and way the set was run. And some.....I just say "thanks, but no thanks" with no consideration of what the pay is. Life is too short.

Look, I know I am not the best at much......but I also know not many people in this world are either. But in a few areas, I do have some knowledge and experience. Treat me like I am a nobody in those areas when you have no knowledge/experience in those areas.....frankly, I don't need the stress, and I am going to treat you with at least the same respect (meaning NONE). You wanna tell me how to do audio on set, when you are fresh out of school, or have no real experience on set as a director....it's your name. I will do exactly what you ask.......but believe me, when asked, I will definitely say you that is what you asked for me to do, if you are paying me. If I am volunteering my time, I am going to tell you where to shove your opinion and advice. I have PAID my dues in this biz, and some inexperienced prima donna is not going to treat me like a kid. If you ask my opinion and at least give me some respect for what I know, hey , that I am good with.

That's where the "leader of the pack" thing dissolves and the collaboration begins. My work either enhances yours or it brings it down. And every position on set can say the same thing. So your "dictatorial" style of leadership WILL bite you in the butt if you give disrespect to ANY department you should be working WITH, including your actors. And as a real leader, you would know this instinctually in a heartbeat. But you have yet to understand this and, yes, really experience the end results of being disrespectful of your "shipmates". Then again, maybe you have experienced this and this thread is the result.

Do you want me on your side, or do you want me just to phone it in? Don't need you to kiss my butt, but give me the same respect I give you on set. I earned my degree and level of experience. If you are new to this, and treat me like some 15 y.o kid...you will get the same respect. I think that will go for any experienced crew/cast member in your retinue.

You will get the exact level of respect you give in return. And disrespect has diminishing returns.

Believe it or not, I like to work with inexperienced directors. I look at it as a chance to help someone who is starting out. If they ask my opinion or ask me to give qualified advice, I give it freely and discreetly. It's about helping the craft of film-making. It's not about me, and it is not about you. It's about the project and knowing what you know and accepting that others could know more than you in areas. You can incorporate their knowledge and experience, or you can ignore it. As the "DIRECTOR", yep that's your choice. And it's your risk if you treat others around you with disrespect and ignore their advice. Because, even if you don't acknowledge that they tried to give the advice, you better believe they will speak up about how you ignored the advice, if you fail.

Heck if a PA asks for assistance, and I can give it, I do so gladly. That PA may be the next Scorsese. That's the way this business works.

But the opposite is also true and more prevalent: How many "directors" are out there that were full of their own ideals, thought they knew everything, ignored the advice of the experience they brought in on the project, and was full of themselves........and......... we will never know their names nor ever see their work?

 

[Barry_Green]

So, do you want to work with professionals? Then be one. That's all there is to it.

brilliantly said.
[/end thread]

 

[Melvin Harris]

David has put it much more eloquently than I could. Me, I am blunt in this area. I already have a list of people that I am too busy to work with/for. Detested the attitude and way the set was run. And some.....I just say "thanks, but no thanks" with no consideration of what the pay is. Life is too short.

Look, I know I am not the best at much......but I also know not many people in this world are either. But in a few areas, I do have some knowledge and experience. Treat me like I am a nobody in those areas when you have no knowledge/experience in those areas.....frankly, I don't need the stress, and I am going to treat you with at least the same respect (meaning NONE). You wanna tell me how to do audio on set, when you are fresh out of school, or have no real experience on set as a director....it's your name. I will do exactly what you ask.......but believe me, when asked, I will definitely say you that is what you asked for me to do, if you are paying me. If I am volunteering my time, I am going to tell you where to shove your opinion and advice. I have PAID my dues in this biz, and some inexperienced prima donna is not going to treat me like a kid. If you ask my opinion and at least give me some respect for what I know, hey , that I am good with.

That's where the "leader of the pack" thing dissolves and the collaboration begins. My work either enhances yours or it brings it down. And every position on set can say the same thing. So your "dictatorial" style of leadership WILL bite you in the butt if you give disrespect to ANY department you should be working WITH, including your actors. And as a real leader, you would know this instinctually in a heartbeat. But you have yet to understand this and, yes, really experience the end results of being disrespectful of your "shipmates". Then again, maybe you have experienced this and this thread is the result.

Do you want me on your side, or do you want me just to phone it in? Don't need you to kiss my butt, but give me the same respect I give you on set. I earned my degree and level of experience. If you are new to this, and treat me like some 15 y.o kid...you will get the same respect. I think that will go for any experienced crew/cast member in your retinue.

You will get the exact level of respect you give in return. And disrespect has diminishing returns.

Believe it or not, I like to work with inexperienced directors. I look at it as a chance to help someone who is starting out. If they ask my opinion or ask me to give qualified advice, I give it freely and discreetly. It's about helping the craft of film-making. It's not about me, and it is not about you. It's about the project and knowing what you know and accepting that others could know more than you in areas. You can incorporate their knowledge and experience, or you can ignore it. As the "DIRECTOR", yep that's your choice. And it's your risk if you treat others around you with disrespect and ignore their advice. Because, even if you don't acknowledge that they tried to give the advice, you better believe they will speak up about how you ignored the advice, if you fail.

Heck if a PA asks for assistance, and I can give it, I do so gladly. That PA may be the next Scorsese. That's the way this business works.

But the opposite is also true and more prevalent: How many "directors" are out there that were full of their own ideals, thought they knew everything, ignored the advice of the experience they brought in on the project, and was full of themselves........and......... we will never know their names nor ever see their work?

How is this any less of a totalitarian attitude?
This is scary.
There is no limit to the authority I have over what I am good at so respect me or I'll use that authority to "sink your ship?!?!?"
Try that with Michael Bay.

Nobody is advocating disrespecting the crew or the cast!
Read the posts.
Emotional responses aside, this is a contentious thread for exactly the same reason on each side... every one is holding fast to their definition of a director, of totalitarian, and disrespect. I know this is a conversation, but the irony is rich. There is no talk of balance, just black and white.
You know why some directors can control every aspect of the set? They have earned it. They have done the work and don't have to pontificate about paying their dues or the need for teamwork on set because they have worked and studied and have proven that their way works, so the team rallies around that! Also, the director is the only person who has the map, why would anyone have a problem following them? They have the g@dd#mned map!

The problem with new directors is that they are so afraid of attitudes like the ones above that they go into battle half cocked and strutting like peacocks fulfilling their own prophecies of failure and realizing their own fears. They feel like they have to be in control of everything so that they can deal with rogue elements in a decisive way and show people that they may be young but they are ready, green but not inept, and it usually backfires. The best new directors have experience managing people and attitudes and use those interpersonal skills to bring the project together; they usually miss other things and the movie suffers, but the people are excited to work with them again because they had a good experience on set. The failure, the director wears that, the producers wear that, the gaffer doesn't, so with responsibility comes control and the need to wield it with intelligence and penache. Plus, best picture Oscars go to the producer, not the director... Never forget who you work for in bringing a film together.

This is the problem with using a political term to define a creative endeavor, it ends up very much like politics. Frankly, I wouldn't work with anyone who can't understand the gray of teamwork, the need for a single vision, the value of council, or weight of responsibility; or anyone for that matter who seems like they have a chip on their shoulder.
Who needs you (me), there are thousands of you (me) on every continent in this world, many of whom have never heard of you (me), so how would you (I) black ball them, and who cares if you (I) won't work with them?
This is film, we all are a dime a dozen.
The ones who make it though, the best, have balance.

PS- Eli Roth? Really?

 

[Seven8 Media]

Being an actor, you have to realise that you are only a small part of a greater vision. It's the actors job to know the character and to ask questions and know their role before they even step on the set for shooting. Some directors have different ways of conveying things to their actors, and actors need to be able to respond to a whole range of communication. If the director ends up disliking the actor(s) for their constant needy 'me me me' attitude, then that's going to come through in directorial and acting performances as well. Actors are only a piece of the puzzle. I wish more realised this. We have worked with a wide range of actors, and some have just been absolute fools, but you won't change anything by posting on here...just a question of can you deal with it, and why did you cast such a person? Personally, I love it when a director is happy and engaging in excited conversation about where he wants characters to go and what place the scene will take the story. Idiots on either side of the camera can ruin that if they have the wrong attitude.

 

[Doc Bernard]

How is this any less of a totalitarian attitude?
This is scary.
There is no limit to the authority I have over what I am good at so respect me or I'll use that authority to "sink your ship?!?!?"
Try that with Michael Bay.

It is not a totalitarian attitude to expect people to be respectful of others. It's basic Human Psychology 101. Same with interpersonal relationships.

I give you the same level of respect I expect to be treated with, until you prove you are not worthy of that respect. Treat me poorly, and I will return the favor.

There is nothing totalitiarian in that. And no mention of "authority" in my post. It's about collaboration. You want the benefit of my skills.........treat me with the same level of respect I show you. There is nothing confusing, demeaning or abasing in that at all for anyone.

And just so you know, if Michael Bay treated me disrespectfully on set, you better believe I would call him out on it. Just because someone has some level of "fame", does not mean they can be disrespectful to me. I put my pants on the same way he does in the morning. And that's because I DO work with "A-list" people, and they are normal people just like everyone else. I won't demean myself and be a "fan-boy" of anyone. I just treat everyone with the same level of respect.

I have my job, he has his. But somehow I doubt I would give him reason to be disrespectful, because I treat everyone respectfully, until.....well, like I said.

 

[Melvin Harris]

This conversation has become decidedly one note.

Doc Bernard, I absolutely do believe that you work with A-list people in Los Angeles on nearly a daily basis. I can see where my appeal for a balanced take on the conversation could be construed for being a self deprecating fanboy. I can see how your estimation of respect could link its self to the worth of an individual measured by the way they treat you.
I agree that all people, all members of a team should be respected.

Moving on.

Respect is subjective as well as objective. Sure there is a basic "human" rights level of respecting all people and professionals, but there is also a subjective component that apparently is not on the table although it is a screamingly large part of your position. There has been not a single word spoken about the need to disrespect anyone. I implore anyone who reads this to go back and read the first page of the thread.
If your talent has a lack of trust in what you are doing, and you are doing what you are supposed to do and are not getting results, change.
If you have not done your job and have mis-cast, change.
Anything outside of this in this thread has been threats, sentimentality, ego, and posturing.
People hooked on to a single fringe idea and became insulted and responded in kind to a tangent thought and not the original point.

With gusto...
You will NEVER win a best picture Oscar if you are not the producer of the film.
You will NEVER win a best director Oscar for giving your advice to the director.
You will NEVER win a best actor/actress Oscar for respecting a crew member.

The ultimate responsibility for projects rest on the few and not the many. If you are not above the line, nobody has to care what you think. Period. It makes the experience richer, however, when they do.

That being said, intelligent casting give the director choices and the editor options. We should cast more intelligently, fellow directors, and enjoy an experience that allows for a greater and deeper communal filmmaking experience rather than just cajoling and wrangling a single unruly, mis-cast talent.