New Canon consumer camcorders HV40 24p like the A1

N

Nik Manning

Well-known member
http://gizmodo.com/5123482/canon-dr...imaging-and-storage-upgrades-across-the-board

Canon's new HD camcorder lineup includes five new models, serving up a variety of processing, lens and storage improvements to the well-reviewed Vixia line of HD cams. The new HV40 (successor to the well-reviewed HV20 and HV30) can now shoot 24 progressive frames per second (like the HV20 and HV30 before it, thanks guys, stupid Canon), a framerate used by top-end DV cams and the film editors who love them for professional moviemaking. It records to DV tape.
 
Looks like they're probably using the "24F" recording mode (which is 24 frames only, no fields) on the "24p" footage, so finally merging the best of both worlds. The prior cameras used 24P imaging and 60i recording; the XHA1/XLH1 used 24F imaging with 24P recording, so now it looks like they've merged 24P imaging and 24P recording.
 
You are correct, they do shoot 24p, but they don't record it "natively", they record it in a 60i stream with 2:3 pulldown. The difference with the new HV40 appears to be that they record the 24p "natively" using Canon's 24F mode, so no 60i wrapper and no field hassles.
 
they didn't do what?.. what/how any panny has done 24p?.. into 60i :D

seems that.. what serves to me it doesn't serve for you.. c'mon.. where's the hassle?.. :huh: "field hassles"?.. lol
 
they didn't do what?..
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They didn't add the pulldown flags.

what/how any panny has done 24p?..
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They added the pulldown flags in their other formats, and on AVCHD they just record 24p natively. Canon has always added the flags in the XL2, XLH1, XHA1, XHA1S, and other "prosumer" models, but they don't add them in the little consumer cameras.
 
Barry_Green said:
They didn't add the pulldown flags.


They added the pulldown flags in their other formats, and on AVCHD they just record 24p natively. Canon has always added the flags in the XL2, XLH1, XHA1, XHA1S, and other "prosumer" models, but they don't add them in the little consumer cameras.
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Flags? What is this?
What for do we need to know them?
 
Caesar said:
Flags? What is this?
What for do we need to know them?
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They allow an NLE to automatically remove the pulldown and retrieve the original 24p frames for native 24p editing. Without them, it's a manual process which is a pain if it can be done at all.

This is the one of the chief drawbacks of the HV20 and HV30. Everyone blames the software, but that's not the problem.
 
filmmaker's gang said:
barry.. still waiting for your entry on that "field hassles".. :)
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chromainterlaced_interlaced.jpg
 
Exactly. You guys over in Europe pretty much never have to deal with this, but it's a pain in the patoot if you don't have the flags in the data stream. All professional and prosumer cameras put the flags in, so nonlinear editors can automatically and instantly strip out the unnecessary fields and restore the data to its pure original 24P form. Canon didn't put the flags in the HV20/30 data streams, so you're stuck with hassle if you want to try to extract the 24p frames. It's not automatic, you can't just tell FCP or Vegas to "remove pulldown" because they don't know how to.

People have come up with virtualdub workarounds, but it'd be so infinitely easier if the flags were just put in the data stream where they belong.
 
Barry_Green said:
People have come up with virtualdub workarounds, but it'd be so infinitely easier if the flags were just put in the data stream where they belong.
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This is why I try not to use my HV20 when shooting tons of 24p stuff. My A1 is so much easier to use manually and infinitely better in low light.

I wish they would have made the HV40 basically the same as these other new ones, the Hs100 and Hs10, but with the tape drive instead of AVC-HD. These newer ones have manual control and sound like they'll have better image quality but they don't have easy 24p.

The HV20 and HV30 should've had two 24p options in the first place, embedded in 60i and this new native one.

Well, my dad needs a small camera for his business travels, and has had to borrow my HV20 a couple times. Looks like he can just use that and I'll get the HV40 to go with my A1. I hope it is not a grand right out of the gate for the minimal improvements.
 
Barry_Green said:
Exactly. You guys over in Europe pretty much never have to deal with this, but it's a pain in the patoot if you don't have the flags in the data stream. All professional and prosumer cameras put the flags in, so nonlinear editors can automatically and instantly strip out the unnecessary fields and restore the data to its pure original 24P form. Canon didn't put the flags in the HV20/30 data streams, so you're stuck with hassle if you want to try to extract the 24p frames. It's not automatic, you can't just tell FCP or Vegas to "remove pulldown" because they don't know how to.

People have come up with virtualdub workarounds
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Virtualdub workarounds? As for example?
 
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