Selling to distributors for lump sum?

[David W. Richardson]

It can be done. It involves too many factors to do justice to it with short answers. But people have done it, and people continue to do it. There are a lot of people out there doing it half-assed, using their VHS-C camcorder and their buddies out in the back yard, on a budget measured not in dollars but in cases of beer. These people skew the statistics a bit.

If you do it RIGHT -- get the great script, get the money, get the right people in front of and behind the camera, handle all the paperwork, and make no serious mistakes -- then you can sell your movie and make a profit. Are the odds against you? Sure. But you can't win if you don't play.

Good luck!

 

[jls4]

Really? I think a great many people would disagree with you.

Even "Evil Dead", a massive cult classic, didn't make enough to pay back its producers. Sam/Ted/Bruce all said that the main reason they took on the "Evil Dead 2" project was so that they could take their advance fees and use that to pay back their "Evil Dead" investors.

At Cannes and Mifed, nobody was buying *anything*. The phrase that was reportedly used more often than any other was "worst. market. ever."

The O.P. was asking basically how guaranteed it is that if he sinks $250k into a film, that a distributor will write him a check for at least $250k, up front, to buy it. My response was "extremely unlikely" and I stand by that.

Chapel does a good job of explaining this right after your thread. BUT I think everything has to be examined, not just one or two things. And you have to, have make a movie with an awesome market. I would belive the reason no one was buying was 2 fold: movies that cost too much, and the wrong type of movie.

I don't know enough about the "Evil Dead", but I've read a few articles in the last few years that really push the whole easy to sell thing, especially in specific markets. For instance, "No Greater Love" on this board, already has distribution according to their website. Very specific and targeted market. But if you try to make your subject too broad, you're throwing yourself at the mercy of distributors. When you want to make a coming of age drama, there's no short supply of those. That what everyone makes. What you have to figure out is, what is no one making?

I think "No greater Love" followed the nobody is making good Christian Movies concept. Over 50% of America claims Christianity, yet no one makes good Christian movies.

The thread
http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=125886

The distribution deal
http://www.nogreaterlovethemovie.com/press_2.html

 

[ChipG]

Hey guys I have been shooting a doc about the making of a movie. It is a low budget PG rated romantic comedy shot on two RED Ones that will taylor to the Christian market. The movie just wrapped and now I'm shooting post production then marketing, festivals and distribution.

I wish it were done now so I could send you a dvd.

There does seem to be a demand right now for what is refered to as "Faith Based Movies"...

Facing the Giants is a good example of a movie marketed to Christians, it was made for $100,000 and has grossed over $10 Million.

 

[David W. Richardson]

Facing the Giants is a good example of a movie marketed to Christians, it was made for $100,000 and has grossed over $10 Million.

Even more impressive when you realize that $10 million gross was ONLY from the theatrical release. The domestic theatrical release. It doesn't include sales/rentals of DVDs, pay cable, pay-per-view, or any of that. I suspect gross receipts from DVD sales and rentals probably far surpassed the $10 million made at the box office.

Definitely a profitable niche market, in my opinion.

 

[dougspice]

I'm an aspiring D.P, but I will need one for this production
I have fun writting, but I'm buing a screenplay for this production
I don't like directing, so I need the credit, so I will direct. Anyone who wants to A.D. who has experience and wants to have a great time in Chicago is welcome.

I'd love to hear about some of your experiences in making features (i.e how much it was for, what genre, who was in it, how much did it sell for etc)

Thank you guys for your support.

Charlie Garcia.

Charlie, in case you didn't see my advice in the Corrado thread, I'll repost it here. PLEASE go out and find a skilled producer who will help you through this process. Otherwise you will be putting all of your investor's money at great risk.

Can I ask why you plan to direct, if you don't like it? That's got me baffled.

 

[ChipG]

Even more impressive when you realize that $10 million gross was ONLY from the theatrical release. The domestic theatrical release. It doesn't include sales/rentals of DVDs, pay cable, pay-per-view, or any of that. I suspect gross receipts from DVD sales and rentals probably far surpassed the $10 million made at the box office.

Definitely a profitable niche market, in my opinion.

I'll try to find out the total amount Facing the Giants has made. My sisters husband was the associate producer for it. Every now and then if he likes a script and market he'll get involved with low budget movies.

 

[jls4]

I'll try to find out the total amount Facing the Giants has made. My sisters husband was the associate producer for it. Every now and then if he likes a script he'll get involved with low budget movies.

tell him to come out here. I'm sure he'll get swamped with scripts. Not sure he'll like mine though. Even though I'm proud to be Christian, I'm not into the faith based movies at least not on a small budget. There are 2 I'd love to do, but both are pretty impossible for under 20 mill each.

 

[jls4]

Definitely a profitable niche market, in my opinion.

All the niche markets are the best way to go, but no one wants to "go there". People say they want to be filmmakers, but really they just want to tell their stories and you have to be more flexable than that.

 

[Charlie06]

Charlie, in case you didn't see my advice in the Corrado thread, I'll repost it here. PLEASE go out and find a skilled producer who will help you through this process. Otherwise you will be putting all of your investor's money at great risk.

Can I ask why you plan to direct, if you don't like it? That's got me baffled.

I suppose the last little short that directed was annoying since It was basically a 2 crew shoot the entire time, making me the director and cinematographer.
I only want to focus on one. Being an aspiring D.P, I'm more inclined to the visual aspectto the movie, instead of performances.

But being a D.P won't give me a good start right now, so directing it will have to be my job. Someone suggested that I A.D. the film, which is not a bad idea either.

 

[ChipG]

tell him to come out here. I'm sure he'll get swamped with scripts. Not sure he'll like mine though. Even though I'm proud to be Christian, I'm not into the faith based movies at least not on a small budget. There are 2 I'd love to do, but both are pretty impossible for under 20 mill each.

I have, he is so busy he won't have time to read through another 100+ scripts a month.

Although if anyone here has a movie at the Telluride film fest tonight in Colorado there is a good chance he will see it.

 

[dougspice]

But being a D.P won't give me a good start right now, so directing it will have to be my job.

"A good start"? What is your ultimate goal?

If you don't like directing, don't direct! Especially on a low-budget film, by the end of it you're going to be exhausted if it's not something you're passionate about. This applies to everything, by the way: the role you're taking, the script, the people you're working with. If you can't control the money, you have to find ways of controlling these other things. Otherwise you're just never going to want to do this again.

I'd also like to caution everyone who point to the Corrado and Lonely Place threads as proof of "Here's how it's done!" It hasn't been done yet. All signs point to those films selling and being successful, but no one can say how successful. Like Barry says, there are absolutely no guarantees in this business.

 

[jls4]

I'd also like to caution everyone who point to the Corrado and Lonely Place threads as proof of "Here's how it's done!" It hasn't been done yet. All signs point to those films selling and being successful, but no one can say how successful. Like Barry says, there are absolutely no guarantees in this business.

True, but I was using "No Greater Love" as an example. My advice is basically if everyone is selling apples - you need to sell oranges. If not, then you need to find out what the market is, because you don't want to sell peaches when everyone wants apples or oranges. I think many writer/directors and even actors like to make peaches - but people buy a peach for every 3 apples and 2 oranges.

Weird anaology, but I hope everyone gets it. As for Corrado and Lonely Place - I hope and wish them the best, but you're right they are to be looked at for inspiration, but their deal is yet to be done.

 

[dougspice]

I wasn't referring specifically to you. I've seen a lot of other people saying the same thing.

It's cool to say "check out this thread, it has all the answers", just keep in mind that the test hasn't been graded yet!

 

[GRENCH]

What is wrong with getting your feature distributed and walking that hill. That's the most realistic path I believe. If you luck up and someone wants to buy it right out, then that's good too. Make it a goal to get it to market, and not just a dream. Dreams end when the sun comes up, but goals come true little by little with each passing day.

 

[Charlie06]

Heya Doug

It's true
And Adam has mentioned it before
Threading the Corrado thread, as interesting, inspiring, and informative as it is, has not been sold, so it can not be treated as the IndieFilmSelling Bible
He himself also said though,
That it is only his confidence and convincing abilities that has everyone else thinking that he will come out on top
Which to me appears to be a very important quality that will help him succeed.

I love doing camera more than directing, but It would be an incredible experience to direct one, so that when working with other directors in the future, I know what they go through, creating better rapport between the two.

I can't let other's insecurities ruin my descision to make this film, but I truly welcome everyone's support as much as possible to make this happen

Adam mentioned that there are hundreds of Corrado being made out there. And he is right, it's just that a lot of them don't hang around dvxuser forums, but they are there.

 

[jls4]

What is wrong with getting your feature distributed and walking that hill. That's the most realistic path I believe. If you luck up and someone want to buy it right out, then that's good too. Make it a goal, and not just a dream. Dreams end when the sun comes up, but goals come true little by little with each day passing day.

I agree, but on the path take the most realistic approach. The hill is okay as long as you know how to handle it and what tools to bring along. My fear i sthat most people don't bring the right tools, then get mad at the outcome and begin to discourage others.

If somebody today promised me $250K (without me having a script) there's no way in the world I would do a drama, a romance, documentary, etc. While you can have great movies of all of these, don't get me wrong. My budget is too low to take that type of hit and too much (like my career) is riding on this movie. I need worse case scenario, I sell the DVD rights for $150K and then get a couple of TV spots to recoup the rest over 1 or 2 years. I mean even the crappiest action movie or off-beat comedy can make it to HBO. Once I saw a piece of a spin off Skin type flick of "Lord of the Rings" can't remember exactly what it was called and I only watched 10 minutes of it. But it was crazy. Here on Showtime at 10PM is something that was definately shot on an XL1 with no lighting, bad audio, bad acting - in fact no acting, bad costumes, no script and it's on TV. It's on the blasted Television!

What did they do right? They understood the market - crazy spin off, a little T and A and before you know it they are on Showtime. But don't you guys do the T&A

 

[GaryinCalifornia]

At Cannes and Mifed, nobody was buying *anything*. The phrase that was reportedly used more often than any other was "worst. market. ever."

I've heard the same thing at last years AFM... but its funny some sellers were saying it was their best year....

 

[GaryinCalifornia]

I'd also like to caution everyone who point to the Corrado and Lonely Place threads as proof of "Here's how it's done!" It hasn't been done yet. All signs point to those films selling and being successful, but no one can say how successful. Like Barry says, there are absolutely no guarantees in this business.

Yes and no... they're following a model that has been done many times before... pick your market...

And its like Chapel says... don't expect to sell a movie shot in your backyard on a VHS camera with no lighting... actors who can't act and story that makes you fall a sleep in five minutes...

Those films are where you start learning the craft of making films... I guess what am I saying or thinking is some times you have to pay your dues... and once you learn the craft then you can think about a film that can sell...

Then of course you have to have known talent that will sell the film... I mean when your non film making friends pick a movie to go see, watch or buy... its 8 out of 10 times whos in and then whats its about...

 

[Charlie06]

++ on Gary

Selling rights for 150k and then on T.V does not sound like a bad idea
I'm leaning more towards thriller, but not the someone killed another but did not know because he has psychological problems thriller, something a bit more interesting.

So I've been shopping for screenplays, So far one has caught my eye.

 

[GaryinCalifornia]

When I was growing up… I was taught you never ask a woman her age... its not considered polite.

How does that apply to selling your film?

When you have a screening of your film and all the buyers are there… they all know each other and they all know how much each other buys films for… so why tell them your secrets…

You got a known actor to do it for $10k a day instead of their normal $50k a day… don’t let that known to the world… same thing you didn’t get paid for writing, directing and editing… why let them know that… let them assume you got paid…

In other words if they think you spent $750k to make your film and you only spent $250k they’ll offer you an amount closer to the higher number… if they learn you only spent the lower they’ll offer you lower… they’re kind like us in a way when we’re selling a house we want top dollar and when we’re buying we want to buy it for less than top dollar…