Lighting a hairdresser

G

Garinion

Active member
Hello I'm going to shoot my first with movie with an HVX200 and this lighting kit with extra Chimera Softboxes

red-head-1.jpg


Type: Kit with 3x800W Soft lights and tripods
Power Consumption: 800W/220V
Color temperature: 3200K
Weight: 2kg each
Features: Focusing features
Includes: 3 Lights with Power Cable (switch ON/OFF) and 4-leaf Barndoors, 3 tripods 2.4m each, Carrying Bag

Accessories: Lamp Oshram 800W

My problem is how to set the lights (probalbly with the 3 point system) becouse I'm a newbie and also a hairdresser has mirrors that make it difficultier
So I was watching a movie with a hairdresser to find tips: Look the photos






I think that in the first two pictures the Key light is from the right side of the camera .. but I'm not so expert to find other stuff .. can you help me please ?

Thanks !!
 
Three point lighting does not occur in nature. Might look terrific for interviews, but lighting a scene that way looks forced and un-natural. At least to me.

Walk into a few hairdresser shops, and see what's there. It's already lit like a REAL hairdresser shop. That is REAL lighting. You job is to augment that lighting to make sure the actors look as good as possible.

The above scenes look unnatural, because I've NEVER seen a hairdresser shop that light solely by sunlight. There is usually VERY strong overhead lighting, lights near the mirrors, etc.

But find something that works for you.
 
I forgot to say that I'm going to shoot in night ..

PerroneFord said:
Three point lighting does not occur in nature. Might look terrific for interviews, but lighting a scene that way looks forced and un-natural. At least to me.
.
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Not a good way?? Then how to set the lamps? Can you explain me?

The above scenes look unnatural, because I've NEVER seen a hairdresser shop that light solely by sunlight. There is usually VERY strong overhead lighting, lights near the mirrors, etc.
Click to expand...
Yes but it's a movie .. not a documentary .. the lighting has to be "beautiful" not "real"
 
Again, I said it was merely my opinion. And yes, I realize it is not a documentary, but one of the things I've been absolutely fascinated by as I learn how top cinemaphotographers work, is their desire to present a beautiful sense of the real.

Just because something is realistic, doesn't mean it can't be beautiful. Look at Deakins. His lighting is increbile, BUT, primarily uses motivated sources and very natural looking light.

Just because you have overhead lighting, doesn't mean it has to be bad. If you don't show the ceiling, you could silk it and get a very beautiful, flattering, soft overhead light. You could replace the rather hard mirror lights with CFLs or flourescent type globes to get more flattering light.

However, my thoughts mean little. And I am merely sharing with you what I have tried to learn over the past couple of years by studying the current masters of the craft. Do what works best for you. If that is 3-point lighting, then so be it.
 
My friend...You have experience .. I don't have.. that's why I ask your advice :)
I've read that HVX200 have noise if the lighting conditions are bad .. so I'm trying to find some ways for good lighting ..
 
I guess that depends on what "bad" lighting means. Noise comes from gain and low lighting levels. How you shape the light has nothing to do with the brightness of it.
 
Garinion said:
I forgot to say that I'm going to shoot in night ..
Yes but it's a movie .. not a documentary .. the lighting has to be "beautiful" not "real"
Click to expand...

It doesn't have to be beautiful, it just has to convey the sense of the scene. I think one thing that would be helpful for us to know is what's going on in this movie, what's the genre and what's the jist of the scene?

If you told me you wanted to light a hair salon in a horror movie, then you told me you wanted to light a hair salon in a romantic comedy, my answers would be exactly the opposite. Not only that, but it's also sort of difficult to light it without seeing the location. I see lighting as just beefing up the light that's already present in a room, then gently shaping it to focus your eyes on the subject. A little bit of an oversimplification, but it tends to work alright.
 
RyanT said:
It doesn't have to be beautiful, it just has to convey the sense of the scene. I think one thing that would be helpful for us to know is what's going on in this movie, what's the genre and what's the jist of the scene?

If you told me you wanted to light a hair salon in a horror movie, then you told me you wanted to light a hair salon in a romantic comedy, my answers would be exactly the opposite. Not only that, but it's also sort of difficult to light it without seeing the location. I see lighting as just beefing up the light that's already present in a room, then gently shaping it to focus your eyes on the subject. A little bit of an oversimplification, but it tends to work alright.
Click to expand...

It's a drama ... so it needs a "classic" lighting not something extra ordinary ...

I guess that depends on what "bad" lighting means. Noise comes from gain and low lighting levels. How you shape the light has nothing to do with the brightness of it.
Click to expand...

Well the hairdresser is full of fluorescent lamps ... it has a great volume of brightness
I hope in some days to have some photos from it to post it here

Thanks again for your advices :)
 
I shot in a hair dressers a couple of months back, the place was covered with mirrors and we were getting crazy mirror in mirror action, which made it tough for hiding the camera and lighting equipment. If this is your situation I suggest using some scissor clamps (w/ safety wires) to hide lights on the ceiling. It worked great for us.

That's more the "how" as opposed to the "why", but hopefully still helpful.
 
Garinion said:
Well the hairdresser is full of fluorescent lamps ... it has a great volume of brightness
I hope in some days to have some photos from it to post it here
:)
Click to expand...

You're doing it at night so that eliminates daylight coming in through windows and having to fight that.

I would say this could be challenging though mixing your chosen light kit with the overhead flos. You showed a redhead kit with tungsten lighting which will be in the range of 2900K to 3200K. The overhead fluorescent lights will most likely be something in a different range like from 4000K to 6500K. That mixing of color temperatures will be awkward and yield results you won't like.

You'll probably end up either gelling the redheads with CTB (color temperature blue) gels to match the fluorescents or changing the overhead bulbs to something like 3000K or even 3500K might be OK but obviously much more expensive.
 
Cool Lights said:
You're doing it at night so that eliminates daylight coming in through windows and having to fight that.

I would say this could be challenging though mixing your chosen light kit with the overhead flos. You showed a redhead kit with tungsten lighting which will be in the range of 2900K to 3200K. The overhead fluorescent lights will most likely be something in a different range like from 4000K to 6500K. That mixing of color temperatures will be awkward and yield results you won't like.

You'll probably end up either gelling the redheads with CTB (color temperature blue) gels to match the fluorescents or changing the overhead bulbs to something like 3000K or even 3500K might be OK but obviously much more expensive.
Click to expand...

Yes I know about that, and of course you are much more experienced than me, but I have read that I have to gel the redheads with a green gel to achieves fluorescent temperatures which are about 4500 ...

Blue is for sun light about 5600 ..
Are you sure that it's not too much ??
 
No actually not a green gel, a minus green gel is used sometimes but thats for something else and not your main issue at the moment. There are different grades of CTB like 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and full to take a tungsten light to higher color temperatures, but not just daylight--anything in between.

To do a match of 4300K from 3200K for instance you would use a 1/2 CTB gel. A 1/4 CTB would change 3200K to 3600K. A 3/4 CTB goes from 3200K to 5000K. Full CTB goes to about 5600K or the official standard for daylight.
 
Well I took some shots with my SONY DCR-TRV 16E ... it has 4 whitebalance modes: AUTO,HOLD,OUTDOOR,INDOOR .. I have it on AUTO

Here is the lighting set: 2 (or 3 .. can't remember) fluorescent lamps and 3 spotlights, but maybe for exposure problem I will have the spotlights off.


Here is a general shot with only the fluorescents on


And this is the mirror


anf finally I have a still with fluorescents and spotlights on



I forgot to have a person in the photos to check shadows but accidentally I shot the owner !!

I hope these stills will help
Thank you for another time !!
 
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seunosewa said:
Not bad, but don't shoot with auto white balance. I like the last pic best.
Click to expand...

in AUTO mode the camera just select on of the three other modes...there it preferred HOLD .. I also checked OUTDOOR and INDOOR and it was terrible ..

Yes I also like the last pic !!!!
 
Cool Lights said:
Last pic is a winner because of the colors. The one without the spotlight was too bluish and cold.
Click to expand...

You are right. But I think that the amount of the lights is too little for a good shot without gain with HVX200 ..
So the problem now is how to setup the Quartz...can you help me a little ..

Thanks again !!!
 
Cool Lights said:
No actually not a green gel, a minus green gel is used sometimes but thats for something else and not your main issue at the moment. There are different grades of CTB like 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, 3/4 and full to take a tungsten light to higher color temperatures, but not just daylight--anything in between.

To do a match of 4300K from 3200K for instance you would use a 1/2 CTB gel. A 1/4 CTB would change 3200K to 3600K. A 3/4 CTB goes from 3200K to 5000K. Full CTB goes to about 5600K or the official standard for daylight.
Click to expand...

I checked rosco's site but their temperatures are a little different
http://www.rosco.com/uk/filters/roscolux.asp

Roscolux #3216: Eighth Blue
Boosts 3200K to 3300K

Roscolux #3208: Quarter Blue
Boosts 3200K to 3500K

Roscolux #3206: Third Blue
Boosts 3200K to 3800K

Roscolux #3204: Half Blue
Boosts 3200K to 4100K

Roscolux #3203: Three Quarter Blue
(Transmission = 41%).

Roscolux #3202: Full Blue
Boosts 3200K to 5500K

I'm thinking to buy a variety of them to make a good mix ...
what do you think ??
 
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