20min Short Film Structure Q's

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Panamaniac
I am trying to polish and clean a 20 1/2 pages script. And I will ask a few questions here as I go on my way trying to finish it in time before out first production date on the 14th. I hope you guys will give me a helping hand.

First a little about the project which I bet will help set the situation. I am co-writing it with a friend and unfortunately we started a bit to late. This will be my first script that I have to finish since it will get produced. Needles to say I am green, but I have always enjoyed writing. It is a Drama with lots and lots of absurd comedy. We have a message that we want to convey but it is balanced with the goal to entertain. We have the characters IMHO very well developed, and we have the story line. The message is basically to be positive and go for it when you have a dream, big or small, this will also inspire those who witness it and hopefully start a chain reaction, which is admirable no matter how small this effect on others may be. Also I just started looking at the structure diagram in this Pdf that someone here suggested: http://files.filefront.com/Story+Structurepdf/;9929065;/fileinfo.html

Also, as you might have noticed, my punctuation and/or grammar, and/or spelling may be disastrous... the upside is that I am producing and directing, not selling, not even paying the actors, only doing this for everyones reel... so I can get away with murder (of the English tongue)
:D


Ok, so here goes the first question:
For this 20min short... is it OK to have one climax at about the 25% mark and one at the 95% mark but no climax at the 75% mark? the main climax is in the 20th page out of 21 total...
I don't know what's permitted, convention or forgiven in shorts...
 
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For the most part, with shorts, i would say break a leg and stretch your creative muscles. If you are writing it and filming it, may be wise to follow some of the rules.

Quick overview. Split into three acts - beginning, middle and end. Introduce everyone early, no main characters past act two.

rather than me waffle and repeat: look here. Breaks it down nicely:http://www.cod.edu/people/faculty/pruter/film/threeact.htm

But if I was doing it all myself I would be concerned with telling my story and shooting it well. Make it mine and show from I can do from every angle.

But guess you have to follow basic rules of story telling too...
 
Well Sean, you are just making my ears happy today (or I should say eyes) cause you are laying things down honest and true, and what's better, just like I thought they'd be ;)

So I guess even though it is not too short at 20min. you just have to try to make things work in the short time we have... I do have an incident early on, but I can only get it as early as say 30%... I do however start building towards it from the get go, the lead starts getting fed up and building towards his fit where he blows up on his friend... then I have a mid point where he realizes he should change, but past the 50% mark... more like 60%, perhaps a bit more... and then at 95% I have the climax, and within the last 5% the outcome...

I was looking at an other formula where the 95% and the last 5% were dead on how i had them... but everything else was off like it is on this formula you passed on to me...
 
Ok... I think I am DONE... and it turned out to be one page longer coming in at 20 pages and 7/8's... so I did the math and my first climax... a fight that creates the conflict that needs to be resolved right at about 42%... then the climax of the third act at like 90-95%... also the begining isn't so slow... but I let it be slower than everything else, because he is waking up and because I wanted to buid and build constantly thought the whole script... it sure ends with a bang....
(or should I say a punch! :D)


what do ya say?
does it sound like an ok structure for the short? it goes up in intensity... that's gotta be good... and we have a big thing not too late... at 42%... and everything up until then builds the tension that breaks with him blowing up... then at the end at 95% they get even...
 
So I guess we have the conflict that justifies the existence of the script at the 42% instead of at 50% but i also have no 1's act climax. But having something further up than 25% is ok in a 20min short since there not much time will have passed before we give you something. 8 min. to be exact. And still, the climax of the whole thing happens suddenly and in the very end... surprise!
 
I think (and this is MY OPINION) that shorts can play around a bit with structure. As long as it flows and makes sense, I wouldn't really worry too much. Our short "The Bet" did not follow a three-act structure, pretty much skipped right into act 2 from the beginning and there were basically two climaxes, one that tied up the story and one that almost open-endedly tied up who these people were. I only heard one comment about not following a three-act structure, but the majority of the responses focused on the story and what was said, rather than HOW it was said. ours was 19 minutes long. the first 13 (or so) minutes were "2nd act" and then about 3 minutes of resolution and the final scene was about a minute (and then about 2 minutes of credits).

if it feels like it flows and it has a good pace, i'd worry more about making sure the characters get their tasks done (arcs, etc).
 
Honestly, 20 pages is a very bad length to be. Getting movies of that length into film festivals can be hard. I'd strongly recommend getting it to 15 min total, closer to 10 preferable.
 
Thanks for the posts guys.

Shawneous, yea... I know... I am also worried about the 22min. running time. My problem is that I have too much for a 15min let alone 10min. running time, and I want it to have a fast feature pace too... I am going to shop it for budget to complete it as a feature and in that case this would be a great 1st act for a 1hs 30min film, or 1hs 46min to do it mathematically, and also a bit better running (imo) time for a movie with good content...

Still... my goal right now is to get it into a festival.... well, to be completely honest my goal is not to F@#% it up! :D but getting it into a festival is the best goal to have for a short and it sure is mine.
I also swear by 10min. as being the best, or 15min. as the best long one... but I am scared of the prospect of trying to condense it any more than I already am... I am hoping to hit the 20min. mark once I cut it... and the shortest I can se it getting to is about 18min. I am rewriting to hopefully hit about 20-21 pages, and then we'll see what I will do in post...

I guess we can all agree that 18min would be best out of my options... right?
 
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