good ways to prevent mic noise from clothes

N

nogwiat

Member
Hi, Did a few interview rigs and find that quite often, I have problems with noise picked up by the wireless mic from talent's clothes so much so that i have to resort to booming them. But I am still very much disturbed by the problem. Besides, not everyday is a Sunday.

This is esp so for ladies who wear silky and lacy clothes that is loose (ironically, tight clothes didn't pose more problems that loose ones). On good days, I might be able to solve the issue if I plant the mic in between the clevage, but this does not always work, esp with cooking demo that involves big movement of the hands

Anyone have experience with this and found a way to solve it?

Another one I have is guys in biz suit with a tie, with many hand movements.

Sorry that it might sound like a newbie question to some of the better pros here.
 
Depends on the kind of mic you use. I have the same problem with my AT lav mic. But I borrowed a very expensive and way out of my price range Countryman and that thing had zero noise. I am pretty much a noob as well and booming everything does is a pain.
 
Yes hiding mics under clothes is generally seen as a pain for all sound guys. But it is something that gets much easier with practise.

I use Tram TR-50s and I used to get so so nervous when it came to hiding them that i tried to avoid it at all costs, even when it was clearly the most sensible option. Therefore for a long time I didn't get better at using them. One day in the not so distant past i made an effort to deal with my fear and slowly I became more adept at using them. Though I still would rather use the boom for everything, mainly now because it sounds so much better.

Have you tried hiding the mic in the knot of a man's tie. I often achieve good results like this with very little rustle. The downside being that the mic is a bit higher than i would actually want it.

This is a good thread btw and I'd be very interested to hear other techniques.

Also I'm sure there are easier mics than the Trams to hide so what other mics do you guys recommend?
 
Women... when possible (like with a small lav, say, Countryman B6) over the ear, just poking out at the top of the ear but still hidden in the hair (but NOT IN the hair or the hair will make noise on the mic. I've been using moleskin to secure the mic in this position. There is a more gentle tape that Phil Ptalsky recommended to me, but I don't remember what it was... and for most of the gigs I work on I don't want to give people a more gentle choice... even as it is people pull the mics loose! They can deal with some sticky on the ear at the end of the day! We even used the moleskin technique on Heidi Klum... so if she can handle it I would hope it's not too much to ask of regular ladies ;-)

Men... if they wear glasses the mic can be hidden on the arm of the glasses (like back close to the ear where it won't be noticed). I also look for other options on the person. I ran sound on a cop/security officer and he had a corded cb type thing... I ran the lav up through the coiled cord and mounted it on the cb thing that was hanging on his chest.

Rycote STICKIES and under/overcovers. This helps. It's become one of my favorite lav mounting methods. Still... you don't want clothing to rub the overcover if possible. (there are also some techniques with moleskin and toupe' tape (sp?) but that gets more into regular mounting methods and not fighting clothing noise)

The BEST thing you can do is have some control over the wardrobe... some clothing is definitely worse then others... multiple layers of clothing equals BAD. Like jackets over other clothing... hence the news person's lav mounted right ON their tie and out of the way of everything.

Finally... just gotta' say... this is why generally I don't like lavs. When possible I prefer boom.
 
nogwiat said:
Hi, Did a few interview rigs and find that quite often, I have problems with noise picked up by the wireless mic from talent's clothes so much so that i have to resort to booming them.
Click to expand...
Yep. Welcome to lavaliere hell. Actually, with lavs, everywhere is hell. I hate 'em. There's a reason the vast majority of hollywood shooting is done with a boom!

This is esp so for ladies who wear silky and lacy clothes
Click to expand...
Yep. Silk is the worst.

but this does not always work, esp with cooking demo that involves big movement of the hands
Click to expand...
Correct, because it's not just the clothes moving against the lav that cause the problem, but it's also clothes rubbing against the cable, and clothes rubbing against themselves.

Anyone have experience with this and found a way to solve it?
Click to expand...
Yes -- DON'T USE LAVALIERES. Whenever possible, a boom is just always going to sound better and avoid all these problems.

If you absolutely have to use a lavaliere, the best way to go is to leave the mic head sticking out somewhere (under a collar maybe). Hiding the mic under the clothes is going to aggravate the clothing noise issues. If it's obvious that they're "on TV", it shouldn't be objectionable to see a small mic head somewhere. If you need to minimize the presence of the mic, try a Countryman B6; it's incredibly tiny and really nearly invisible.

Lavalieres are the devil of audio. Wireless lavalieres are doubly so, because you compound the rustling noises with the potential for radio hits and low-battery problems. Major news programs will frequently use two lavalieres on their reporters so they have redundancy in case one goes bad.

A boom stand and an overhead boom solve so many problems... if you're doing a sit-down interview, the boom is going to be the better choice 99% of the time.

As other posters have said, sometimes you gotta deal with the devil, but whenever you can avoid it you're better off to avoid it. And if you HAVE to use a lavaliere, avoid trying to hide it under clothes, that's just asking for trouble -- the glasses, the brim of a baseball cap, hair, or sticking out of their clothes somewhere (tie, jacket pocket, etc) are all better than trying to hide it under clothes.
 
Last edited:
Most everyone covered what I would say above - but one question for you is this: Is the noise you're hearing the clothing rubbing the mic and/or cable, or is it just the clothing itself.

If it's the clothing rubbing the mic/cable, then try some of the stuff above. The tape I use is called Hypafix (used in the medical world to tape down IV lines). It's very pourous so I can tape right over the mic head without and problems. I also use corn pads over the mic head (Target sells a generic brand that is much cheaper). Also, use the body's natural contours to help protect the cable. Use the cleavage area for both men and women - and run the cable under the pec/breast and around the back to use that as a "shadow" (if you catch what I mean).

If what you're hearing is just simply the clothing itself, you're pretty much at the mercy of the wardrobe department - talk to the wardrobe people and see if there is anything to be done (be sure to let the director/1st AD know that there is wardrobe noise that will render lavs useless - both to protect yourself and to see if a little extra pressure can be exerted on the wardrobe dept.)

I worked on one project recently where wardrobe (and the director) insisted that the lead character be in a brand new leather jacket - and all you heard was the creaking of new leather - in this case both in the lavs and the boom. Oh well, lots of ADR. :) Fortunately, I don't do post.

Phil
 
thats why you hire soundma n:)
i usially lieave he work to my booman and only wire super models my self :)
 
Also... forgot to mention... that little rubber thingy that comes with a Sanken COS11 works great. It would be worthwhile to imitate that thing for any omni mic that has a top diaphragm (like mke2, or even crappy me2).

What that rubber thing does is create a pocket for the lav to sit in, so that nothing is touching the diaphragm area of the lav... and on the outside the rubber is fairly inert, so that clothing rubbing against it doesn't translate to much noise at the mic.

They sell a little 6" square red, rubber material for making custom plumbing gaskets... it's less then 1/8" thick. If you have a lav like a COS11, mke2, etc. then that might be worth trying. A 1.25" square with a smaller square glued or stapled over it might work really well to simulate Sanken's tape down rubber thing. Something to consider if you're just playing around with G2 and me3 caliber stuff.
 
I think one important thing to understand is that one solution does not fit all situations...you have to be adaptable...you have to think ahead...on the tie, on the bra, under the collar, moleskin...if someones wearing black you may be able to simply clip it outside the clothes and it will get lost in the black of the outfit(also, lavs don't just come in black).

Most directors I work with will cut you some slack if you are fighting with a hidden lav. But don't count on it.

I remember putting a lav on a guy for an interview...every word the guy would say would end in a little click...drove me nuts...tried different positions, different ways of securing the mic, new batts...finally I just clipped it on the outside of his jacket and it still did it... so I went with a boom...and still with the clicking...checked cables...mixer...headphones...then I started listening to the guy talking without my headphones...turned out it was his dentures...every word he said would be followed by a little click...

RJS
 
ha ha ouch...

one thing i will say is that although everyone says lavs are horrible, they still have a crucial role to play in our craft. personally, i'd rather have a well lav'ed actor than a boom that is 400 miles from its sweet spot because of some idiot DP/director. of course, what id REALLY like is the boom in the sweet spot. but hey, we dont always get what we want.

i've taken to wiring talent AS OFTEN AS POSSIBLE. most times i dont even use that channel - i just listen to it to see how the mic placement is working out. but practice makes perfect, and its really improved my lav hiding ability.

another thing is that some mics just really arent all that great for being hidden - the lectro m152 is a prime example - i really struggle to hide it effectively. however, the sanken cos11 is a dream, and so is the b6. and ironically, the crappy g2 stock lav me2, although its HUGE, is also quite nice for hiding (although you may not enjoy the sound it gives you!)

practice practice practice...
 
For those who have used both the COS11 and Countryman B6 - which mic was better at isolating these clothing influences?

Assuming the mic head is unobstructed, do either of these mics do a better job of isolating "cable rub" (clothing rubbing on the mic cable)?
 
i'd say only use the lavs when you absolutely have to, for example, long shots that start from wide then comes in close to camera where boom cannot reach. Or even wide shots in generally where one does not want to see the boom. and can get away with having the lav more visible without being seen?
 
both mics are quite resilient to cable rub.. the sanken in particular has a kevlar cable.... the b6 has such a tiny cable, that i really cant imagine there being enough surface area for it to rub much! both great mics - my two favourites.
 
The Countryman cable is also made using Kevlar. I'm not sure that that helps with the noise, but it certainly makes it durable.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top