My outrageous hospital bill - faint with me

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Not having insurance sucks. I haven't had it for about 6 months and I'd be just as screwed if I had to go to the hospital, but that's the risk we take when we don't pay for insurance. The high prices do seem like a rip (and there very well may be something crooked going on), but at the same time the medical industry is like any other industry, even the film/video industry. If a client comes to you in desperation to video their event immediately you're going to give them your day rate or even higher because of the late notice whereas if someone wants to hire you for a 30 day shoot a few months away and guarantee you more work you'd probably be willing to cut them a deal and charge them a lower day rate (like hospitals and insurance companies).

The ER prices would probably go down if 28973489 people didn't go there every time they got a cold or the flu. Waiting so long in the EMERGENCY ROOM is ridiculous, but I think it's because so many people abuse the ER. It should only be used in cases like yours where something seems terribly wrong.
 
Man, that sucks. Fight it, especially for those absurd fees.

Why so many cat scans and tests?

Gotta love Canada. We may have to wait for some of our services, but it doesn't cost us.
 
Jon Starr said:
Man, that sucks. Fight it, especially for those absurd fees.

Why so many cat scans and tests?

Gotta love Canada. We may have to wait for some of our services, but it doesn't cost us.
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if you go to the er, about how long would you have to wait on average?
 
You think thats expensive??!?!! try the medical bill from when Skywalker chopped my hand off!! ... (okay my low brow humor is done with)
 
ugafan said:
if you go to the er, about how long would you have to wait on average?
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Depends.

If you are having a heart attack... no wait time... if you have a dog bite... you're most likely in for a good 6 hours.. unless you have profuse bleeding...

really it depends on the severity of the circumstances..

The system in canada is very good.. it has its problems like any other.. but I'd never want to live in the states.. mainly because of the lack of health care system.

though.. despite my praise.. I am diabetic.. and the insulin I need to live... like.. I will be UN-alive without it... another adjective would be 'dead'. None of my supplies are covered by OHIP (Ontario Health Insurance Plan). I have upwards of $400-500 a month in supplies.. thats like an entire separate rent cheque.

Yet.. if you smoke... and get lung cancer... you're kemo is covered.. but hey.. who's comparing right?

what was I saying?

sigh...
 
I'm very sorry, Charli. This kind of stuff just makes me sick. Fortunately not literally "sick" because I also can't afford health care in the US.

Honestly I don't understand how companies (insurance and pharmaceutical) can become rich from other people's pain and suffering. Break even, sure. But to profit?!?! Very sad.

Last month I went to a hospital here in Thailand and was treated like a superstar. The hospital looked like a 5 star hotel inside and while we filled out the forms the nurses brought us hot tea and snacks. After the nurses did some tests (including blood) we were able to see the doctor immediately. No wait, at all. We were then prescribed some medications and paid the bill. Total: $35. And that's the regular price. Thai people only have to pay $3 because they have Universal Health Care here.

An American friend of mine is having a baby and the ultrasound sessions she has are only $12, regular price.

Charli - Do everything you can to fight it but don't let the fight make you stressed or sick. The health care "industry" might not be on your side but your friends and family here at DVXuser have got your back!

:)
 
It's like this:

You visit the doctor / go to the hospital.

You then get a large number of separate bills in the mail.

A good percentage of them are WRONG. Wrong fee schedule, wrong co-pay... sometimes wrong procedure!

If you want to spend a LOT of time dealing with it, you can correct some of them. If your time is valuable or short, they get away with it.

If you don't pay (and they don't accept credit cards!) within a week, you're already reported to a collection agency.

After a while, your insurance company will complain to the hospital that some of thefees are too high, and will pay only part of them.

Sometimes the hospital will go after you for the balance, sometimes they'll lower the rate to match the insurance "standard".

If you don't have time to deal with the MULTIPLE WAVES of numerous bills, you lose.

I think it's their game plan... 'cause noone I know has time to fight the mistakes.

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Or try this one, which happened to my wife:

Had a severe stomach pain; called insurance, asked where to go on a non-emergency basis. Was referred to a clinic by the insurance company. Went to the clinic, asked if it was covered by the insurance company. They said yes. Asked if the specific doctor was a member of the insurance group (had been burned by that one before). They said yes.

Seven bills from the clinic, including $700 for blood work, a few hundred for the clinic fee, and a very large "OUTSIDE DOCTOR" fee. Spent two days on the phone investigating why... as it was the insurance's recommended clinic, and the doctor was in-group.

The explanation: doctor who is "in-group" is not "in group" all the time. During certain days or hours, he may be working as a non-group doctor.

So: you can't just ask "is this doctor covered by my insurance"? You have to ask "is this doctor covered fully by my insurance right now, for the precise service I'm requesting?" And, even at the place the insurance co. told you to go, the answer may be "no, and there's noone else here."

Waah!
 
Hope you're all good Charli.:) I too want to move to the States and I will absolutely have insurance - first thing I do. I hear way too many of these bad situation stories.
 
In Spain this type of thing is "free". You have a tax you have to pay monthly that gives you the right to free treatment no matter what you have. My girlfriend had a gastritis problem and her treatment didn't cost a dime.
 
We had premature twins - three months one week in the NICU. Total billing was $1,150,000... each. Our co-pay was about $500.

Get health insurance or major medical at minimum. Pay through the nose for it and write your representatives regarding healthcare reform. Those that complain should complain to someone who can do something about it.

Everybody complains about the idea of "socialized" (bulls*** wording to scare people off of talking about the issue seriously) medicine until they have to pay a bill.

You get what you pay for and pay for what you don't. I'll post the Alta Bates bill if I can find one of them. It is truly a document to behold!

e
 
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I didnt read the thread where you said you had to go to the ER, but I'm gonna go find it now and read it. However, (and lots of good all our comments are doing you now, huh?) for myself, I avoid the ER as much as possible and opt for Acute Care Centers if and when conditions are appropriate. If I think I am having a heart attack, the ER is where I want to be. Almost everything that I've had come up (no pun intended there) I taken to an ACC.

If you have no insurance (and I'm betting the hospital knew that one before they even asked your name) you can file a hardship case thru the billing department for drastically reduced charges or even a complete write-off in some cases. You can even request this bill reduction/hardship if you DO have insurance and can't reasonably afford the remaining co-insurance.

As for the tests themselves, they all sound pretty much standard for someone presenting with acute gastritis symptoms and no known history of the condition. The symptoms of severe gastritis can seem to indicate other WAY more serious events. The medical team has to sometimes make a diagnosis thru a process of elimination of other more serious conditions. So in your case, they had to check things like your liver and pancreas functions, your heart, bloodwork to check for a certain kind of anemia that can cause similar symptoms, the list is long, but you know that from the looks of your bill.

Yes, the costs are outrageous. Yes, the system is corrupt.

You could always explore the "Hook a Canuck" suggestion from Sicko.
 
Erik Olson said:
We had premature twins - three months one week in the NICU. Total billing was $1,150,000... each. Our co-pay was about $500.
e
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Holy cow! Not that I doubt that figure -- our twins were in for three weeks and five days and the bill was $55k for each and they didn't have any health issues at aside from being early. Not sure what we're paying of that, although our max out-of-pocket for everything is four grand.

Yes, our health care system has major, major issues. But, speaking as a new father and 15-year diabetic, I'll still take it over anything else out there.

Sorry, Charli, about your bill. Definitely fight it. They'll probably drop a bunch of charges or greatly reduce them. They'd rather have some cash than none.
 
I guess I'm not too sure how the medical care system works over there.

Jason: You mentioned that for your twins, it was $55k each? $110k total? What do you mean that your max out-of-pocket is only four grand? Is that the maximum you have to pay because of insurance, or how does it work?

I find it hard to believe that these insurance companies make much of anything with all these charges being so high.

Thanks,

Kegan
 
Blaine said:
Do you have some kind of link for that?
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Blaine...Wild Imagination Films is totally correct. Having been employed by the Health Care industry I have seen first hand the evils that they do.

The system, as is, is fault of the Insurance companies PERIOD. It has NOTHING to do with the physicians. Sure, they need to be kept in check; just like any one in any industry. The Insurance companies are run by GREED, the BOTTOM LINE, and the CULT-LIKE MANTRA "we need to keep the stockholders happy".

Physicians, by and large, know that a pregnancy test does not cost $85 dollars. But years of playing a cat and mouse game with the insurance companies who only pay a teeny tiny fraction of what is being billed the Health Care providers have had to bloat charges to get a more normal percent of the billed charge.

Granted, you have some squirrelly hospitals who are ALL business and some individual doctors who tread the line of ethics. But, by and large it is the Insurance companies who have pulled their pants down and sh*t on the system. I cannot begin to tell you the horror stories of necessary procedures or how life saving drugs have been denied because they were deemed "experimental", "untested" or "unproven effective" all in the name of greed. They don't, do not, will not, hate, refuse to pay $ for medicine and/or services things unless they ABSOLUTELY cannot find the legalese in the fine print to prevent them from doing so. Insurance companies do not look for ways to help pay for your health care claims. They look for ways to deny them. And what is an insurance company doing making final health care decisions anyway!? That should be strictly between the patient and the doctor.

And if you think the doctor could just "have a heart" and do it anyway...there is more red-tape for the doctor than you know. The Insurance companies can actually "flag" providers...meaning they give them a record and penalize them if the doctor gives out anything for free or does things for free or waives copays etc. A doctor cannot have a heart without worrying about the wrath of the insurance company. A doctor cannot say “don’t worry. I’ll accept just what the insurance company gives me. You don’t have to pay the remaining balance because I know that you cannot afford it” otherwise the Insurance company can drop them, "flag" them and prevent them from getting contracts with other insurance companies. Its a friggin' mess.

I am ALL for free market, capitalism and people turning a good buck but this ideology has no place in Healthcare. People shouldn't have to worry about buying life saving drugs or getting life saving treatment without incurring un-recoverable debt. Real people and regular joes are losing everything they own and literally dying while CEOs of Insurance companies are lining their pockets with blood money.

And that my friends, is the sad but true tale…

Charli…I really hope you are feeling better. I’d say “I hope you have insurance” but I know that might lessen the pain only a little.
 
Kegan Sant said:
I find it hard to believe that these insurance companies make much of anything with all these charges being so high.
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Part 2 of my rant:

Oh, that statement couldn’t be more wrong. I will try to keep this brief. If you have insurance you have deductibles, copays as well as maximum out of pocket expenses. These are the bread and butter of the insurance industry.

Each procedure, whether it be an office visit or a removal of a mole or an appendectomy, has an individual code or 5-7 digit number attached to it. Each number has a monetary value. If the doctor charges $12,000 for a surgical procedure the doctor knows that he/she has already agreed to accept a MUCH lesser amount from the Insurance Company for the code assigned to it. Every couple of years the Insurance Company and the Doctor agree to an official contract that lists that amount the Insurance Company will pay for each and every single procedure or drug you can possibly imagine. The insurance company will only pay a VERY small amount of the billed charge. Period. It works this way for every code and every service.

If a surgery is performed on you and the bill is $12,000 dollars the contract between the doctor and the Insurance Company might say the Insurance Company is only responsible for $2,000 dollars. It can actually even be much lower. Well, if you have a 4,000 out of pocket expense or deductible YOU have to pay the first $4,000 dollars or in this case the $2,000 dollar bill. The insurance company in this scenario has effectively passed the buck and bill down to you. They have paid $0. Nothing. Nadda. You have another procedure…whatever the cost…you are STILL obligated to pay the remaining $2,000 dollars left from your annual ‘out of pocket’ expense.

Many people go throughout the year with many nicks, scrapes and bruises and the Insurance company can actually earn money because the cost of your ailments have been much lower than the price of the policy. And this is very common. If you have 10,000 insured people, 1 might be very sick and the other 50-100 might only come close to submitting a small claim in any given year. This leaves 9,000 plus of people who are paying for Insurance but never submitting a claim. We pay for when someone gets really sick. Our policy fees pay for heart transplants and births and cancer, etc.

Going back to the $12,000 dollar surgery example, what happens if your first surgery was performed December 29th but an additional procedure was needed? Well, should you wait until January or the following calendar year your annual $4,000 dollar obligation is refreshed. You have to pay the first $4,000 dollars of anything that occurs within the New Year. This goes on and on and on. Yes, Insurance Companies do pay out some big bugs when out of pocket is met but that is only after the little guy has shelled out thousands of his or her hard earned cash. To the insurance company that sick person is a drop in the financial bucket. They have MILLIONS of customers from millions of jobs all over the country who are paying into their system.

It’s ironic and at the risk of sounding hokey, the Health care system is sicker than the people it tries to heal.

So much for keeping it brief....
 
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