Starter Kit with the Redrock Micro SD Indie Package
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Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
In my opinion the 35mm adapter is a great piece of equipment well worth the price. Nikon lenses are much better then Sigma in my experience.
As far as lenses, look into great condition manual lenses. You may have to go used, but you'll find the focus ring is much more forgiving on manual lenses. I bought mine used and they looked good as new! I saved some money as well. I would personally recommend looking into KEH.COM . They are amazing. I have bought seven nikon manual focus prime lenses from them and every one has been better then I was expecting.
Also, I don't know what kind of filming you are doing, but if that sigma is for a film photography camera (most digital cameras have ccd chips smaller than a 35mm size frame which causes the focal length numbers to be inaccurate. If working with a film camera the sigma 20mm will show edge distortion from being that wide angle. When talking about conventional 35mm (photography) film lenses the range considered "normal" perspective falls around 50mm. People say wide angle is 12mm-35mm, Normal falls between 35mm- 50- 85mm, and telephoto begins around 85 and up. This scale is arguable and based off of opinion, but I think I was general enough to get the picture across.
Just know that when you put a 35mm photography film lens on a nikon f mount digital body it will most likely inaccurately represent the focal length due to the ccd not being the same size as 35mm film plane.
Also know that 35mm motion picture film is not the same as 35mm photography film. The frame size of 35mm photography film is larger then the sideways 35mm motion picture film frame. So you can translate 35mm photo lenses over to the world of motion picture film cameras (arri, panavision, and so on) but there is always a margin of error due to the slightly different film plane sizes.
As far as lenses, look into great condition manual lenses. You may have to go used, but you'll find the focus ring is much more forgiving on manual lenses. I bought mine used and they looked good as new! I saved some money as well. I would personally recommend looking into KEH.COM . They are amazing. I have bought seven nikon manual focus prime lenses from them and every one has been better then I was expecting.
Also, I don't know what kind of filming you are doing, but if that sigma is for a film photography camera (most digital cameras have ccd chips smaller than a 35mm size frame which causes the focal length numbers to be inaccurate. If working with a film camera the sigma 20mm will show edge distortion from being that wide angle. When talking about conventional 35mm (photography) film lenses the range considered "normal" perspective falls around 50mm. People say wide angle is 12mm-35mm, Normal falls between 35mm- 50- 85mm, and telephoto begins around 85 and up. This scale is arguable and based off of opinion, but I think I was general enough to get the picture across.
Just know that when you put a 35mm photography film lens on a nikon f mount digital body it will most likely inaccurately represent the focal length due to the ccd not being the same size as 35mm film plane.
Also know that 35mm motion picture film is not the same as 35mm photography film. The frame size of 35mm photography film is larger then the sideways 35mm motion picture film frame. So you can translate 35mm photo lenses over to the world of motion picture film cameras (arri, panavision, and so on) but there is always a margin of error due to the slightly different film plane sizes.
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Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
Yeah... I tend to get carried away.I probably went way to far.
Feel free to ask specific questions and I'll try to stick to topic.
Feel free to ask specific questions and I'll try to stick to topic.
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
These lenses should work (but check with Red Rock on the 20mm) as they're both full format, fast lenses with manual aperture and focus rings. I wouldn't mind checking out that 20mm myself.
You should consider an 85 or 135mm lens to add to your collection. A fast 135mm is a perfect choice for close up work with faces etc. and can deliver beautiful bokeh (the look of the out of focus areas) too.
You should consider an 85 or 135mm lens to add to your collection. A fast 135mm is a perfect choice for close up work with faces etc. and can deliver beautiful bokeh (the look of the out of focus areas) too.
Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
It's still autofocus lenses which 'usually' have much shorter focus throws then their manual brothers.
Cine lenses usually have longer throws to help those poor 1st AC's. That is why I go manual.
Yes those lenses will work. They are new and such, but I still prefer the manual lenses.
Cine lenses usually have longer throws to help those poor 1st AC's. That is why I go manual.
Yes those lenses will work. They are new and such, but I still prefer the manual lenses.
I'm looking at this kit and I'm hoping to find it used:
Nikon Mount
Would you recommend Nikon over the others?
I'm open to manual lenses. I just listed those lenses because they were offered in a used package.
I'd like some manual lens recommendations if you'd like to share some of the products you've had good experiences with.
Also, what does hard-mount mean? Does that mean less vignetting at the cost of a camera setup that's more difficult to transport?
Nikon Mount
Would you recommend Nikon over the others?
I'm open to manual lenses. I just listed those lenses because they were offered in a used package.
I'd like some manual lens recommendations if you'd like to share some of the products you've had good experiences with.
Also, what does hard-mount mean? Does that mean less vignetting at the cost of a camera setup that's more difficult to transport?
Charlie Anderson
Not so clever
I have the indie package from RR and I use nikon/vivitar lenses. I have a few 1.4 - 2.8 lenses depending on what I want.
As for the hardmount kit, I would assume that the M2 lens adapter would connect directly to the stepdown ring instead of using the rubber hood that comes standard with the M2...I personally haven't used it so I'm not sure if it cuts down on vignetting, although I don't think it would, but it's something to try out once I get paid next week.
Also I would invest in a case for the M2. I bought one with my setup and it's invaluable, you definitely need one (and if you order it with your M2 they'll custom cut the case to fit everything in there for you!)
As for the hardmount kit, I would assume that the M2 lens adapter would connect directly to the stepdown ring instead of using the rubber hood that comes standard with the M2...I personally haven't used it so I'm not sure if it cuts down on vignetting, although I don't think it would, but it's something to try out once I get paid next week.
Also I would invest in a case for the M2. I bought one with my setup and it's invaluable, you definitely need one (and if you order it with your M2 they'll custom cut the case to fit everything in there for you!)
Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
Would I recommend Nikon over others? Well when talking about the quality of the glass, there are many out there who are staunch Canon fans. Indeed Canon makes some great lenses. Minolta, Olympus and Pentax lenses are not garbage either.
But the reason you see Nikon being a popular choice is not only because they make very nice lenses, but because of the vast amount of lens choices.
Nikon has been making 'F-mount' lenses since the 1950's and only f-mount lenses. (With the exception of the incompatible Rangefinder series). Even the Nikonos lens series (made for underwater photography) are f-mount.
This means EVERY lens Nikon ever made since the 1950's will fit onto the Redrock M2 (except the short-lived rangefinder). This opens up lens selection and choices. Not to mention nikon has always been one of the leading lens manufacturers in the world, so the market is rich in used and new lenses. Meanwhile Cannon had the 'R-mount' in the late 1950's-1960, then the 'FL-mount' in the 60's, over to what was the lasting 'FD-mount' which lasted a long life of 20 years until around the late 80's-1990 when the Canon EF mount (eos) was introduced and has remained with the exception of the EF-S which is a digital thing I know nothing about.
So to make a short question long (Like I always do) Canon glass has been argued to be better, worse, and the same as Nikon. It's a bitter feud like Pepsi and Coca Cola. But in the end it's up to you. I went with Nikon due to it's wide variety and universal f-mount. But I just found a bunch of my grandfathers old (and well maintained) canon lenses, so I think I'm going to make a call to redrock soon.
So if you have access to a nice collection of fast canon prime lenses which all have the same mount design, go Canon. If you have access to a collection of fast Nikon primes, go Nikon. The choice is yours.
Cool. That helps a lot!
Will the image be upside down when I use the M2? I can flip the image with the ScopeBox monitoring program...
For a novice, is the Letus Extreme worth around $400 more? Or would I be splitting hairs?
Prime lenses... doesn't that mean you can't zoom through, but you can manipulate the focus ring to vary DOF? In other words, a zoom and focus isn't possible?
I'm leaning towards the Nikons, but I'm seeing Zeiss lenses in a lot of the demo footage available, why is that? What mount do Zeiss lenses correspond with?
Will the image be upside down when I use the M2? I can flip the image with the ScopeBox monitoring program...
For a novice, is the Letus Extreme worth around $400 more? Or would I be splitting hairs?
Prime lenses... doesn't that mean you can't zoom through, but you can manipulate the focus ring to vary DOF? In other words, a zoom and focus isn't possible?
I'm leaning towards the Nikons, but I'm seeing Zeiss lenses in a lot of the demo footage available, why is that? What mount do Zeiss lenses correspond with?
Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
Yes, the image is upside down for all adapters except if you have a flip option. You can flip the image with many monitoring programs when using a laptop, and I have never used scopebox but I am almost certain that is a major point of using it.
I don't know if the Letus Extreme is worth it or not. I have never tested it or have used it. I hear good things. I use my adapter (which does not have a flip option) just fine. It's again up to you. Some people including myself do not like adding more glass between the subject and CCD, but that is probably hypocritical considering I've already added the adapter and a lens with 5-8 elements
Yes prime lenses have fixed focal lengths. They cannot zoom. In the past fixed lenses (primes) have been proven to be more sharp then zoom lenses. This is most likely because zoom lenses are comprised of many more elements (pieces of glass that make up the lens). But speaking to modern day cinematographers, and photographers, many say that the technology has really equaled out the playing field.
The depth of field does not have to do with the focus ring. DoF is controlled by three things. First is the aperture. The second is the distance the camera is from the subject. The third is the focal length of the lens.
The next paragraph is another one of my ramblings... skip if you want:
Of course these things all rely on the size of the CCD or Film plane. For instance 35mm film has the potential to have less depth of field because it is (about) twice as large as the 16mm film plane. Take into account Digital cameras without adapters. 2/3" Video cameras (SDX, HPX, Varicam,) have the ability to have less depth of field then the 1/3" video cameras (HVX, DVX, so on) because it's CCD is larger.
Back to basics:
Using the previous three parameters one can manipulate the depth of field.
I am not sure what you mean by "A zoom and focus isn't possible?"
Zoom lenses can zoom and focus. They can sometimes focus easier then a prime lens, because you can get critical focus. Critical focus is when you zoom all the way into your subject focus and then pull back out to the desired more wide composition. This allows very accurate and simpler focusing.
Last of all Zeiss lenses are highly regarded in the film community. Zeiss does make lenses for many different companies and mounts.
Among those are lenses for Nikon and are identified by ZF (Zeiss F-mount).
They make PL-mount lenses which are for cinema cameras, and the PL mount is also available for most 35mm adapters.
Check here for more info: http://www.zeiss.com/photo
I don't know if the Letus Extreme is worth it or not. I have never tested it or have used it. I hear good things. I use my adapter (which does not have a flip option) just fine. It's again up to you. Some people including myself do not like adding more glass between the subject and CCD, but that is probably hypocritical considering I've already added the adapter and a lens with 5-8 elements
Yes prime lenses have fixed focal lengths. They cannot zoom. In the past fixed lenses (primes) have been proven to be more sharp then zoom lenses. This is most likely because zoom lenses are comprised of many more elements (pieces of glass that make up the lens). But speaking to modern day cinematographers, and photographers, many say that the technology has really equaled out the playing field.
The depth of field does not have to do with the focus ring. DoF is controlled by three things. First is the aperture. The second is the distance the camera is from the subject. The third is the focal length of the lens.
The next paragraph is another one of my ramblings... skip if you want:
Of course these things all rely on the size of the CCD or Film plane. For instance 35mm film has the potential to have less depth of field because it is (about) twice as large as the 16mm film plane. Take into account Digital cameras without adapters. 2/3" Video cameras (SDX, HPX, Varicam,) have the ability to have less depth of field then the 1/3" video cameras (HVX, DVX, so on) because it's CCD is larger.
Back to basics:
Using the previous three parameters one can manipulate the depth of field.
I am not sure what you mean by "A zoom and focus isn't possible?"
Zoom lenses can zoom and focus. They can sometimes focus easier then a prime lens, because you can get critical focus. Critical focus is when you zoom all the way into your subject focus and then pull back out to the desired more wide composition. This allows very accurate and simpler focusing.
Last of all Zeiss lenses are highly regarded in the film community. Zeiss does make lenses for many different companies and mounts.
Among those are lenses for Nikon and are identified by ZF (Zeiss F-mount).
They make PL-mount lenses which are for cinema cameras, and the PL mount is also available for most 35mm adapters.
Check here for more info: http://www.zeiss.com/photo
Ryan Patrick O'Hara
Veteran
Well... The stock lens of the DVX, in my experience will only inter cut successfully for wide shots. Of course you can get away with some other inter cutting but it's a tricky beast.
As far as depth of field I am guessing you want to play with shallow depth of field, yes? Well first of all, longer lenses create more shallow depth of field. But then again you are working inside, so you wont have the room.
My best suggestion for you is to start with a good 3 lens assortment. I would suggest a lens in the 35mm, 50mm, and 85mm range.
Why? 50mm is usually considered 'normal' meaning it's close to the normal perception of the human eye. Some say it's more like 40mm but it doesn't matter. Next 35mm is a good lens which falls on the normal/wide angle gray area. It's much more wide then the 50mm but it won't show slight distortion like a 24mm lens does. Last, the 85mm is the gray area of normal and telephoto. It is usually considered telephoto but is not extreme.
The best part about these lenses is that the offer a good range without being extreme. They are also available in faster speeds. You will find as you travel away from the standard 50mm lens in both directions the lenses become slower or just more expensive. You can find and buy f/1.4 35, 50 and 85mm. The f/1.4 nikon 85mm is kind of rare and expensive and many just settle for the f/1.8
I wouldn't worry about which lenses you get as far as dof is concerned. You'll soon see that shooting wide open with just about any lens will yield obnoxiously shallow dof.
EDIT: My discussion is based off of my experience with Nikon manual focus primes. I am not familiar with other brands, and their f-stop speeds. Research is key.
As far as depth of field I am guessing you want to play with shallow depth of field, yes? Well first of all, longer lenses create more shallow depth of field. But then again you are working inside, so you wont have the room.
My best suggestion for you is to start with a good 3 lens assortment. I would suggest a lens in the 35mm, 50mm, and 85mm range.
Why? 50mm is usually considered 'normal' meaning it's close to the normal perception of the human eye. Some say it's more like 40mm but it doesn't matter. Next 35mm is a good lens which falls on the normal/wide angle gray area. It's much more wide then the 50mm but it won't show slight distortion like a 24mm lens does. Last, the 85mm is the gray area of normal and telephoto. It is usually considered telephoto but is not extreme.
The best part about these lenses is that the offer a good range without being extreme. They are also available in faster speeds. You will find as you travel away from the standard 50mm lens in both directions the lenses become slower or just more expensive. You can find and buy f/1.4 35, 50 and 85mm. The f/1.4 nikon 85mm is kind of rare and expensive and many just settle for the f/1.8
I wouldn't worry about which lenses you get as far as dof is concerned. You'll soon see that shooting wide open with just about any lens will yield obnoxiously shallow dof.
EDIT: My discussion is based off of my experience with Nikon manual focus primes. I am not familiar with other brands, and their f-stop speeds. Research is key.
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