PappasArts
Veteran
I read that this past weekend that Dennis was going to be shooting with the Brevis Flip. Is there any footage yet from this?
Pappas
Pappas
Is there Breivs Flip footage yet???
- Thread starter PappasArts
- Start date
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
Yep...in a day or so.
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
Actually we're putting a Brevis35 package with the flip and a full rails system together so that folks can purchase the "kit", receive the Brevis and rails within 2 days, and then have the flip module shipped later when they're done. It'll be available to order by this weekend 
PappasArts
Veteran
marketmd
Well-known member
I am chilling out and waiting for the "Flip Wars" to shake out over the next 2 months, and suggest others do the same if they lack a pressing shoot schedule. After Jan 1 a clear leader should have emerged...price/performace/footage/vignette/bokeh/softness/weight/build/options.
Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
The footage has been posted (on our private forum) however due to a mistake on my part during shooting, it's not as good as it should have been...which is why it's not posted here. The stinker is that over the last two days we've had flood warnings and serious rain/wind in Thunder Bay, so I've been unable to get out for a reshoot. The good news is that I've been doing extensive testing with vectorscope/wf monitor and can confirm a few things.
1. The Brevis (non-flipped) with a 50mm f1.4 lens mounted loses less than 1 stop on the camera (about .7 as we've posted before). In other words, less light is lost by affixing the Brevis35 + 50mm f1.4 mm lens than dialing the camera in from f2.8 to f4.0.
2. The Brevis + flip module with a 50mm f1.4 lens mounted loses less light than dialing the camera from f2.8 to f4.0. It's in the .8 stop range.
This test series took an HV20 in front of an evenly lit whiteboard, and tested the baseline light loss when going from f2.8 to f4.0 (shutter locked at 1/250s). At f4 we had 52 IRE, and at f2.8, about 72 IRE....so this 1 stop increment resulted in a 20 IRE change. Leaving the camera locked off, we affixed the two configurations of the Brevis (flipped and non-flipped) to compare. We visually checked to make sure the HV20 ND filters were not engaged, and that each toggle of the aperture resulted in physical movement of the aperture blades themselves on the HV20.
It was also clear that stopping the 50mm lens down maintained far better light efficiency than expected. You can see evidence of this in Phil Bloom' review on page 4.
1. The Brevis (non-flipped) with a 50mm f1.4 lens mounted loses less than 1 stop on the camera (about .7 as we've posted before). In other words, less light is lost by affixing the Brevis35 + 50mm f1.4 mm lens than dialing the camera in from f2.8 to f4.0.
2. The Brevis + flip module with a 50mm f1.4 lens mounted loses less light than dialing the camera from f2.8 to f4.0. It's in the .8 stop range.
This test series took an HV20 in front of an evenly lit whiteboard, and tested the baseline light loss when going from f2.8 to f4.0 (shutter locked at 1/250s). At f4 we had 52 IRE, and at f2.8, about 72 IRE....so this 1 stop increment resulted in a 20 IRE change. Leaving the camera locked off, we affixed the two configurations of the Brevis (flipped and non-flipped) to compare. We visually checked to make sure the HV20 ND filters were not engaged, and that each toggle of the aperture resulted in physical movement of the aperture blades themselves on the HV20.
It was also clear that stopping the 50mm lens down maintained far better light efficiency than expected. You can see evidence of this in Phil Bloom' review on page 4.
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Christopher Barry
Veteran
I think Dennis is referring to the Cinevate Customer (Owner's) Private Forum, however, I can not find any footage in there...
edit: I found something posted on 16 Oct, perhaps this is it.
edit: I found something posted on 16 Oct, perhaps this is it.
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Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
We long ago learned that releasing compromised footage causes more problems than it solves. In other words, there's no excuse for posting crappy footage...particularly with everyone analysing the pixels out of the rushes On the private forum I can explain exactly what the situation was, and not worry about incorrect conclusions being drawn.
From the looks of our forecast, I'll have great footage Saturday of flooded rivers and a very soggy NW Ontario.
Chris, the Oct 16 post is indeed the one you're looking for.
On the private forum I can explain exactly what the situation was, and not worry about incorrect conclusions being drawn.From the looks of our forecast, I'll have great footage Saturday of flooded rivers and a very soggy NW Ontario.
Chris, the Oct 16 post is indeed the one you're looking for.
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PappasArts
Veteran
Dennis,
Im curious what was the issue or issues that happen?
Were you doing the test shoot?
So all the footage had this issue?
How did the Canon fair with the flip?
Why is there no need for the achromat with the flip?
<<n the private forum I can explain exactly what the situation was, and not worry about incorrect conclusions being drawn.>>>>
I would like to believe that most of us that are experienced for many years here would listen to your explanation to what went wrong and not make erroneous conclusions.
Im curious what was the issue or issues that happen?
Were you doing the test shoot?
So all the footage had this issue?
How did the Canon fair with the flip?
Why is there no need for the achromat with the flip?
<<n the private forum I can explain exactly what the situation was, and not worry about incorrect conclusions being drawn.>>>>
I would like to believe that most of us that are experienced for many years here would listen to your explanation to what went wrong and not make erroneous conclusions.
We long ago learned that releasing compromised footage causes more problems than it solves. In other words, there's no excuse for posting crappy footage...particularly with everyone analysing the pixels out of the rushes
From the looks of our forecast, I'll have great footage Saturday of flooded rivers and a very soggy NW Ontario.
Chris, the Oct 16 post is indeed the one you're looking for.
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Dennis Wood
DVXuser Sponsor
Actually it was quite simple. One of the optical surfaces was hazed over due to a lot of handling followed by inadequate cleaning. The end result was what looked like a complete lack of contrast as every shot had white haze overlaid. Two days worth of flip footage was affected :-( We're expecting good weather tomorrow, so I'll be out again without the crew. The good news is that the first day of shooting included test shots for a local film-maker who typically shoots on film. Their footage was perfect ... but on a non-flipped Brevis.
The last few days were not wasted as we did extensive work using a waveform monitor and vector scope on both the XH-A1 and HV20. Light loss from the adapter+flip itself is about 1/5 stop on both cameras, much less than we had modeled. Our 72mm HD achromat is not used on the flip module because it was not designed for that purpose. In order to get sharp corner to corner focus on the full 35mm SLR field of view with the flip array, there are specific optical design issues. Our optical engineer has therefore purpose-designed the optics to ensure unsurpassed image quality. We could just use a generic achromat and start shipping them, but it needs to be perfect at this stage in the game. Once folks start comparing edge sharpness amongst the adapters, the difference will be apparent.
The last few days were not wasted as we did extensive work using a waveform monitor and vector scope on both the XH-A1 and HV20. Light loss from the adapter+flip itself is about 1/5 stop on both cameras, much less than we had modeled. Our 72mm HD achromat is not used on the flip module because it was not designed for that purpose. In order to get sharp corner to corner focus on the full 35mm SLR field of view with the flip array, there are specific optical design issues. Our optical engineer has therefore purpose-designed the optics to ensure unsurpassed image quality. We could just use a generic achromat and start shipping them, but it needs to be perfect at this stage in the game. Once folks start comparing edge sharpness amongst the adapters, the difference will be apparent.
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PappasArts
Veteran
<<< We could just use a generic achromat and start shipping them, but it needs to be perfect at this stage in the game. Once folks start comparing edge sharpness amongst the adapters, the difference will be apparent.>>>>>
Thats music to my ears Dennis. I Like the passion im seeing that Cinvate has to getting optimum image quality. Im looking forward to the footage............
Pappas
Thats music to my ears Dennis. I Like the passion im seeing that Cinvate has to getting optimum image quality. Im looking forward to the footage............
Pappas