Who Owns The Rights To My Film? Help.

W

wmiller@csulb.edu

Well-known member
First off understand that no contracts were signed at all.

The producer paid the majority of the production of the film and thats it.

But as far as the original film stock and orginal digital media, that was all purchased by the director of photography.

As far as i understand whoever physically paid for the "negative" owns that piece of property right? Regardless of production costs and the absence of any sort of contract giving the investor (producer) rights. It seems that on such a small scale as this (under $10,000) it would come down to who actually paid for the original capture medium. Contracts are important in film making.

Please help me out on this one guys. Thanks a lot.
 
I don't know if it's going to be that simple.
For instance think about if you had a 10,000 dollar movie and it was shot on Mini-DV and the DP paid for the HD's and Tape then the producer paid for the rest. That would mean that the DP would have paid around 400-500 dollars and the producer paid 9,500 but the DP gets to keep it because he paid for the tape.

Did you all talk about it before hand ?
Who came up with the story and who came up with the Screenplay ?
I think that's going to weigh heavy on who owns the right to the film. Now he may own the physical shot footage but whoever wrote it pretty much owns the rights to the story
 
That depends . . . the producer, who put up most of the money, has a strong case for work-for-hire -- meaning, he owns the story.

You guys really should have figured this out before dime 1 was spent.
 
The answer is: it's whoever a judge decides. And as David says, one factor will be the intent of those involved; if the investor paid someone for the screenplay and hired a director to shoot it, then obviously the intent was that it is his property, he made a work for hire.

But if nobody paid the screenwriter anything, then it gets squirrely, because copyright vests with the original author until that author sells/transfers that right to someone else. So the movie could perhaps be viewed as a "derivative work" under the copyright law (understanding that I am *not* a lawyer) and therefore you're not entitled to appropriate it from the author without his/her consent.

For example: let's say that you decide that you really want to do the movie version of Dave Barry's book "Dave Barry Hits Inside The Beltway". So you write a screenplay, and your friend buys the film stock, and you get an investor who pays for your screenplay and for the production costs -- so who owns the picture? Dave Barry does, of course, because you guys stole his material without consent or compensation! He owns copyright to his work and all derivative works, and you made a derivative work. So what about all your time and investment? Well, that falls under the "too bad, so sad, you should have asked first" category.

So it comes back to -- where did the original story come from? People's contributions to the pic may or may not be a factor, it depends on the chain of rights throughout. If it's a collaborative story and the investor put up the dough to have you write it, then that investor could very well be found to be the owner of all the elements under the aforementioned work-for-hire precept.

Let's put it in simpler terms: in a proper motion picture production with proper contracts all around, the production company owns the film. The producer typically forms the production company and buys the rights to the script and hires the director and all other workers. It is the producer's film. Which is why the producer wins the "best picture" oscar.
 
The first step should have been an entertainment attorney,. He is there to make sure all the i's are dotted, and that you don't lose your @$$. It's just a shame you can't afford them.
 
You clearly have a chain of custody problem here and even if you can come to an understanding between most of the parties, I think you will have great difficulty providing a clear title to this work. E&O insurance may be nearly impossible to obtain based upon the lack of contracts and the dispute that has arisen.

Were there postings for jobs for hire for any of the crew positions? If so, who made these postings, the producer?

Who hired the talent? Were there contracts with the talent or talent releases signed. The individual making these contracts with talent can provide evidence of being the employer on this project and despite the lack of crew contracts, would have a strong claim to being the employer of hire.

As Barry has pointed out, the screenplay writer has a claim to their original work. You may find that some aspect (screenplay) are owned by one entity, while others (physical media) are owned by another.

Get everyone involved to agree to arbitration or look forward to expensive attorney and court costs.
 
Noone was hired on the crew, it was a first time film for the director and by no means was it a work for hire situation. Except for the fact that two actors were paid a very small fee, but they still never signed contracts or anything. Not even releases!

The story was not sold or paid to write and nobody was paid to write anything. (the director wrote it)

Do production costs really mean anything?

I may be using the term producer very loosely here. I would actually call him an executive producer. He had no creative control in the whole process and is someone who is relatively unfamiliar with filmmaking. He basically just paid for almost everything.

So as far as the director/writer having rights to the story, i.e. that screenplay could never be made into a movie again without his consent, that is completely fair.

But as far as the actual footage. It seems to come to a technicality because the "negative" is so powerful and the DP bought those materials. If he was ever compensated by the producer than that would have been a dfferent story. The excec producer didnt "buy" the movie soley by paying the production costs... right?
 
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This same thing happened to me. I wanted something really bad, but didn't want to take the time to c my a. I felt I could trust this guy, even though we had never done business before, but he was willing to give me what I wanted now, and we'd "work out" the payment later. It was a sweet plan... until I found out that payment means eternity in hell. Don't make deals with the devil, kids.

But seriously, I am starting an animated pilot with a couple of other talented artists. You had better believe we had everyone sign non-disclosures and so forth. I don't care if he's my best friend, -

IF SOMEONE WON'T PUT THEIR WORD ON PAPER, THEIR WORD AIN'T WORTH CRAP.

By the way, hell is not as hot as you would think, it's just humid.:evil:
 
Sounds like a normal movie. Just kidding in some ways and other ways I'm not.

Here's the best way to do it.

Figure out a budget again if you didn't in the first place.

Determine how much you would have paid for the director, writer, editor, dp so on.

If the lighting guy for example let you use all his gear. Then determine how much you would have paid him to rent it. Same thing for other talent and equipment.

Add all those numbers together plus what the money guy put in and you have your final budget and for example your budget is $50,000 in deferments and money spent. Then the guy who put in $10,000 owns 20% of the film. If the writer/director fees would have been $5,000 then he owns 10% of the film.

Just keep breaking it down like that and then hopefully you guys can work it out. But if you keep saying or someone keeps saying I own the movie because I wrote it. You won't get anywhere.

In reality you all own the movie. It should have been setup as a joint venture in the first place. Hopefully you can all work it out.
 
I'm not entirely clear why you're worrying about who owns the negative when it sounds like neither he nor you own the movie printed on that negative (i.e., the writer, actors, composer, cinematographer, production designer and director all contributed creative material to the film...and without any paper from anyone, nobody owns the film...neither you nor he can do anything with it...it might as well be unexposed film stock without everyone's agreement).
 
GaryinCalifornia said:
But if you keep saying or someone keeps saying I own the movie because I wrote it. You won't get anywhere.
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haha, i am no writerl But....
The writer doesnt think he owns it anyways. Sure he owns the script but thats all. Writers get screwed all the time because they just want thier movie made at any cost.


I think this example will better explain the situation.

If the producer didnt like the first cut and wanted to completely re do the film. Then he would ask the DP for the tapes that he had and give them to an editor to be recut. If the DP is the owner of the tapes because they were paid for by him, doesnt he own that material. Wouldnt he be able to say "no, these belong to me". Or is the producer entitled to them soley because of production costs.
 
I'm not trying to be hard on you here.

But how did you get someone to give you $10,000 to put into a movie and you guys never discussed how the profits if any where going to be shared?
 
wmiller@csulb.edu said:
haha, i am no writerl But....
The writer doesnt think he owns it anyways. Sure he owns the script but thats all.
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Okay, let me try this again...

If the writer owns the script, and nobody bought the rights off him, then the project is dead in the water. Dead. Nobody owns anything of any value.

If the writer still holds the copyright to the script's movie rights, then you had no rights to make a movie off of it. That's just about all there is to that. I don't care if you're Warner Brothers and you spent $100 million dollars on it, if you don't have the rights you don't have anything. All you've got is a very expensive excercise in frustration.

Now, that's not to say that the writer can demand all the tapes and the negative, but it is to say that you have nothing that you can sell, nothing you can distribute, nothing you can profit by, nothing you can exhibit -- without the writer granting the producer the rights.

If the producer didnt like the first cut and wanted to completely re do the film. Then he would ask the DP for the tapes that he had and give them to an editor to be recut. If the DP is the owner of the tapes because they were paid for by him, doesnt he own that material. Wouldnt he be able to say "no, these belong to me". Or is the producer entitled to them soley because of production costs.
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Again -- the producer owns everything. Doesn't matter who did the paying for the actual materials. All the DP could do in that case is submit a bill to the producer for the cost of the materials that the DP bought *on behalf of the production*.

The producer owns everything. The director is hired by the producer. The writer sells his screenplay rights to the producer. The producer hires all crew members. The producer owns everyone's contributions to the picture as a "work for hire".
 
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Thanks barry! Good information.

I think what needs to happen is a DBA needs to be set up between everyone. Then a production company can be set up and then we all can find out how much each person owns.

If the writer/director wants to charge for the rights he should be able to apply that towards his investment in the picture.. yes or no?

The DP can also charge (or apply the value) the production company for the rental of his camera, Lighting, And all other equipment...yes or no?

(just like how some actors rent thier own trailers to production companies when they shoot)
 
who owns the rights ??

well that will be determined by a court or agreement between party's ...
and final will come down to if owner can enforce their ownership...

i know of 2 films that have been hijacked .. one by editor ..other cameraperson
.. they were HIRED ( no written agreement) to edit/shoot documentarys ..paid cash under table .. ... both projects were suppose to be 20-23 min ... both made 60+ min project... at the end both decided that they had change the project from the orginal "idea" that it became their work.. ( camera person had made copy's of all tapes - decided to edit their own version)
at the end they put their name on projects "a film by X " and didn't give any credit to orginal person that hired them , both put their name as copyright owner on projects ... they both gave a DVD to person that hired them ... one was paid 7K other 4k cash ....
both are judgement proof ( they own nothing) .. they do not have releases etc .. both received letters from lawyers to stop and cease ...
one entered Doc into festivals - got honable mention at hawaii film fest ...
so far the real owners have NOT taken court action ...

if you can't come to an agreement - then ownership will fall to whoever finishes the film 1st and files for copyright - then it will be up to others to prove ownership doesn't belong to that person ... and that will take some $$$$$
 
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