Advise on buying light kit

MikeQuill

MikeQuill

Well-known member
Hi,

I'm looking to buy my first light kit for my short films. As I understand it, Arris make top notch lights, but are rather expensive. It seems that Lowels (with barn doors, etc.) are much cheaper and are a good starter kit. I found this kit on Ebay: "Lowel - DVcreator Kit 44 Light Kit":


http://cgi.ebay.com/Lowel-DVcreator-Kit-44-Light-Kit-Top-selling-Kit_W0QQitemZ190003684976QQihZ009QQcategoryZ3860QQssPageNameZWD1VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Can someone tell me whether this is a good price/whether this would be a good kit to buy?

Any other advice would be great too.

Mike
 
Hi Mike:

Lowel lights are okay but are open face lights, other than their "FrenL 650". This means, as a newbie, you will have a much harder time controlling their lights than you would fresenel lights. Also, IMHO, the Lowel hardware in their kits is largely lower end and kind of cheap. For instance, the Lowel lightstands in their kits are close to useless and even dangerous since video lights get so hot.

I would resist the siren pull of buying a kit. Most newbies think that if they buy a kit, they are set and will not need anything else. Wrong. You need to budget probably almost as much for grip gear as you do for lighting gear. Without effective grip gear like C-stands, flags, sandbags, gels, scrims, boom arms, clips, clamps, etc. you will quickly realize that you cannot control the light, making effective lighting impossible.

You don't say what kinds of subjects you will be shooting, crew size, making narrative films versus docs, etc. Give us more information about yourr camera, knowledge, experience and what your intentions are and perhaps we can offer you more specific gear recommendations. Do you want to key witth softlight or are you making film noirs? Shooting mostly interiors or do you need to light exteriors as well? See what I am getting at? There are hundreds of different pieces of gear and you want to buy what will suit your needs, not just because you need to buy a light kit.

I own about 20 Arri lights, they are very good as are Mole Richardson, DeSisti, Kino Flo but that does not neccessarily mean that you should buy Arris. What I have learned most in my years of lighting is that each project requires different lights and grip gear so it is best to begin to assemble your own kit, based upon your needs. Pre-packaged kits are okay but do not usually contain everything you will need by any means.

Best,

Dan
 
Arri lights rock, but if you need to go a little bit cheaper, you can get Altman fresnels. They're almost identical to Arris in build quality (built like tanks) and they'll save you a few bucks.
 
Puredrifting: I have owned the dvx100a for about 1 1/2 years and am looking to learn more sophisticated lighting techniques. I mostly do narrative films with with small casts of no more than 5 people. I need lighting for darker films -- horror shorts, film noir type stories, etc. This is why I thought it would be wiser to get lights with barn doors, flags, scrims, etc, to control my light -- in other words, I'm not really looking to light for interviews. I guess this means I don't need a softbox as much.

I have both interior and exterior scenes in my upcoming horror short. I know lighting at night outside is much more complicated -- the need for 2k lights and up, etc. But I can probably borrow lights of that magnitude.

Hopefully this will give you a better idea of what my needs are in a light kit.

Thanks a lot,

Mike
 
Hi Mike:

Well, softboxes are used for a lot more than interviews, I own four of them and have used all of them at once to light up entire rooms so that talent walks and tracks from "setup" to "setup" when using dollies and Steadicams, but I think I understand your needs a bit better.

The DVX-100A is a GREAT low light camera, that's one thing I miss since switching to Hi-Def and the HVX, the low light capability. You are on the right track with wanting to make sure that you get barndoors, flags and scrims. I would also recommend snoots and some cinefoil, invaluable when working with small lights especially. My only prejudice against this kit is against the flimsy Lowel stands, they really suck. Also, no real flags, sandbags, arms with this kit. How will you arm in a rim light behind your leading lady in that glamourous CU? Have you ever used Lowel kits? While the lights are okay, all of the gear overall has a flimsy feel to it. The Tota your kit has is very difficult to control because it's a powerful broad source 750 watt light. The Omni is better and the Prolight is fine, I own two of them myself. The Rifa is smaller than you think and is only a so-so key source, I dragged one up to Seattle for a shoot myself a few years ago.

If you can spring for more, I would buy an Arri DV kit and supplement it with a few used C-stands, some sandbags and flags/scrims/silks/nets. If not, this kit is okay for your needs but you will outgrow it quickly and will then have to buy some more serious lights.

Best,

Dan
 
I use the lowel lights because I do a lot of Corporate work and it's great for what I need. I do agree in that the construction isn't a strong as Arris or Moles Etc but they aren't cheap pieces of construction either. The lights stands are **** and I would trust anything on them. The first thing I bought was some Bogen 3086 stands and stacker stands. These are much better and I am happy with them. If you have the money I would buy the arris and rent whatever else you need but if you don't have the money I still think you would be happy with the lowels
 
Thanks for the detailed responses. As I think about the matter, I am definitely more inclined to buy higher end lights such as arris. Great lights are not something you grow out of, as you might a camera.

Khmuse: The arri kit on ebay seems like a good kit. I know I would be able to decrease the amount of light in a 650, but could I really use one as a back light, for instance? Would I be better off getting a kit that has a variety of wattage lights? Such as an Arri Softbank IV kit? Also, the current bid on those arris is $1000 and it's got 4 more days of bidding. How high could it go with it still being a good deal to buy? $1500?

Thanks guys,

Mike
 
Scrimming down a 650 for a back light is kinda of a waste of a bigger instrument. Why not get a 150 to add to the kit. 650s are a great size for a lot of situations, but certainly not for everything.

As for how high this auction might go, who knows? You will have to watch it and see where it ends up. I have seen some real bargains on eBay and I have seen people pay too much. $1500 would be a little more than I would go, but thats your call.
 
I'd be cautious about that auction. The description does not match the photos. The auction describes Arrilites while the photos are Arri fresnels. Also a flat fee of $100 seems high to me. That always sets off red flags to me. It might be that the seller doesn't know what he/she has but be sure you know what you're bidding on.
Good luck,
Dan
 
thanks for the info guys; i sent him a message asking if the lights are fresnels. He hasn't got back to me yet.

Mike
 
I think for your needs, buying three 650 Fresnels isn't going to help you very much. You'd be much better off with one 650, 2 300's and 2 150's (that you can lamp to 200). You'd have much more flexibilty with a kit that has these various wattages and instrument size. It's good for small locations and setups only however. But as has been mentioned before, the lights (and stands) are really only the beginning. It's all about control, and that means a lot of grip gear. Buying into lighting can become very expensive so make sure you budget for it.
 
If you live and work in the US, I would get the 120V version....I don't really see any good reason to get the 220, unless you live in Europe....
As far as the light kit, I believe it to be an excellent choice. Buy some extras bulbs, a couple of dimmers, some diffusion like OPAL and some colored gels. You should buy some full and half CTB, 1/4 and half CTO, 215,opal, and an assortment of what most people call "Party Gels". Good luck, an excellent choice.
You'll really love the softbox....
 
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I have a Softbank I kit. The place I shoot for has two of the Softbank IV kits. Get the Softbank IV kit, you will want the 150s. Other than the size and weight of the case, I think it is the ideal lighting kit, very versatile.

You will not regret owning Arris, they are great lights. I like the Moles too but Mole doesn't make kits that are as practical as the Arri kits.

BTW, to answer your earlier question, an Arri 650 would make a really large and heavy hairlight or rim light. I usuall float the hairlight out on a 40" grip arm on a C-stand or on a 9' matte boom pole and doing this with a 150 is easy, 300 is a bit tougher because it is larger and heavier. Doing it with a 650 would require a really sturdy boompole, steel light stand and lots of sandbags to counterweight it. Not very practical for most shoots.

Best,

Dan
 
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Thanks for the great info guys. It looks like if I want to go with arris, I should get the Softbank IV kit.

Mike
 
Bang for buck the Lowel kit offers a pretty complete package. You'll always want to add more stuff later, but from the get go it is a complete set for most anyone. If you're shooting horror, I would add an Egg Crate to your softbox for more control and add one more Pro light to the kit. The Lowel DVcreator Kit 44 with the softbox gives you a lot of options for $1287. For that same amount you could not get 4 lights of equal wattage with the Arri line. Look at most any rental facility and you will see the same names, mostly Arri and Lowel - both the names are trusted and industry standard. I agree that the Lowel Uni-stands are not as durable as the Avenger and Matthews line, but have you seen how small this kit folds up into? It's really amazing.

Also, look what most news crews are using - the DVcreator Kit is the number 1 selling light kit by the world leader in location lighting. http://lowel.com/popular_kits.html

If you have a sec, take a look at this video I shot last Friday for an introduction of what the base kit can do http://dvgeartalk.com/




Cheers,

Guy Cochran

BTW, that's one of our auctions on eBay for the Lowel kit. :)
 
Thanks for the great responses.

Guy: you reccommed the lowel dvcreator kit 44. But what about lowel dvcreator kit 55?

With the 44 kit you get:
Rifa-Lite 44, Pro-Light: 250 Watts
Omni-Light: 500 Watts
Tota-Light: 750 Watts

And with the 55 kit you get:
Rifa-Lite 55, Omni-Light: 500 Watts
Tota-Light: 750 Watts
Pro-Light: 250 Watts

What combo is better do you think for what I'm doing?: horror and noir.

Thanks,

Mike
 
The main difference between the 44 and 55 kits is the size of the Rifa light. The larger the Rifa fixture, the softer the light you're going to get from it (a good thing).

I own the DV creator 55 kit and like it a lot, but then I'm mostly shooting interviews, though I have also lit entire rooms with it.

If you do go with the Lowell kit, or any kit for that matter, I would definitely suggest going through B&H or another reputable dealer. The DV creator 44 kit on eBay was considerably more expensive than listed on B&H. $1,287.50 vs. $ 1,084.50.
 
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