Barry_Green
Moderator
Yep. Very different, the Vocas filter holders are way thicker than the CAVision and Chrosziel ones.rcapra said:
None that I know of. Hopefully other Vocas owners will write in and tell us of something!
Official Mattebox / Matte Box F.A.Q.
- Thread starter lpcvideo1
- Start date
Rhydon
Well-known member
I have the Chrosziel HVX setup with rods and use it with the Century .7x wide angle, no vignetting what-so-ever, lens fits perfectly in the mattebox with the appropriate step down ring. You do have to take the 16x9 flag out tho, but thats an obvious.
Absolutly love the Chrosziel. Never liked the look of the Vocas.
Absolutly love the Chrosziel. Never liked the look of the Vocas.
Christopher Barry
Veteran
Cynic821
Carbonite Member
will that hyson work with the M2 adapter on the HVX with the rail system? how does the mattebox meet up with the 35mm lenses and deal with its focusing? Id like to know if the follow focus on it will work with the lenses as well.
thanks alot, but i dont expect an answer, going on 2 weeks now.
thanks alot, but i dont expect an answer, going on 2 weeks now.
Cynic821
Carbonite Member
I just ordered an HD Mattebox and Follow focus system from Joel (hysonfilms.com) this after noon at work, and hes giving me great service, i mean AMAZING! We are going to setup on monday and hes going to get me the ring for my lenses using my M2 and Nikon Primes. Anyways, i should have it by the end of next week ready to use and dialed in, so i will give a review of it when its done. Under 500 for a Matte Box and a Follow Focus combo couldnt be beat. Its his bundle on his website. Check it out for sure!
Jarek Zabczynski
Veteran
Cynic821 said:
Hmmm...I emailed him asking about compatability with the Redrock gear system and he said it doesn't work with it yet. He said they will update that though.
Christopher Barry
Veteran
cinebuddy said:
Nice to know. I have the Hyson MB & FF 'Combo' on the way, and I will also order a Brevis35. I am hoping to setup the Brevis with the Hyson FF (soon to be released). The Hyson FF 'hard stops' should be awesome. Thanks for the feedback on the MB compatability cinebuddy. :thumbsup:
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Dahopafilms
Well-known member
ruester said:
Here is what I am using on my system:
Cavision 4"x4" bellows matte box
Cavision rods and support system
RR M2 adapter (Canon mount)
RR Follow Focus
You can rig the system to use them all together, but you need to do some modifying. In my case, I needed to raise both the M2 and the Follow Focus in order to get the right alignment on the Cavision rails. You need to raise the M2 and FF because the Cavision Matte Box needs greater distance between the rails and the lens alignment.
Raising the M2 isn't much of a problem. I purchased the M2 shim kit from RR and mounted all of the spacers to the bottom of the M2 to get about another 7/8" of height. This requires opening up the M2, removing the two existing machine screws and replacing them with longer ones (Home Depot). No big deal.
A different mod to the follow focus. Still need the longer screws (two for mounting and one carriage bolt for the adjustment and locking of the FF gear to the lens gear) but had to lose the nice tightening knob at the bottom due to an inability to find the right thread in the longer screw (needed a 2-1/2" long machine carriage bolt in the same thread - not stocked at Home Depot). So I replaced RR's nice knob with a simple but effective washer and wing nut matching the thread of the 2-1/2" carriage bolt I used. But as I didn't have an extra shim kit from Redrock, I simply precision cut a small piece of wood on the table saw to the required dimensions, precision drilled three holes in it, sanded it smooth and painted it black for effect - and it works fine.
So, I can now attach the M2 (hard mount to the front of the lens - forget the stock rubber hood setup), the follow focus and throw the matte box on the end. And yes, my rods are Cavision and are 19-1/2" long.
Insofar as the RR products are concerned I am very pleased. I did need to drop the motor mount down in the M2 in order to remove it from the frame when shooting with the M2, but the instructions from Redrock and the actual steps needed to do that are very straightforward. The follow focus is, in my view, a great unit for the price.
The jury is out for me on the Cavision equipment. So far, I have cracked one of the side flap mounts (could have been user error in over-tightening, but I am very fastidious about the handling of my equipment), which I subsequently fixed and then reinforced. I have also partially stripped out the threads on one of the tightening knobs on the rails mount which I do not believe was due to any misuse on my part. I'll fix that myself, but I honestly don't believe that either of these events should have happened in equipment after only about four or five months of use.
In speaking with a local supplier about two weeks ago, he thought that Cavision had modified their matte box system since the time I bought it. Whether this is true or not I do not know. If true, whether this is an improvement or not I do not know. All I can say is that perhaps you get what you pay for.
Given my experience, if I could do it all again and didn't mind a wait, I think I might wait for the Redrock matte box and buy a complete RR system. But waiting is the main factor. At least in the case of the M2 and the Follow Focus, from the time you order and pay for your stuff, it takes over a month to delivery - but in my view it's worth it.
Hope that helps.
Cynic821
Carbonite Member
Hyson mattebox just came in, Joel just left about 2 hours ago, ive been playing with it and doing some work as well. It was hand delivered here at my office since im stuck at work all day. Also delivered was the Hyson Follow Focus. I have terrible pics right now since i forgot to take my camera with me to work today, only brought the HVX200, M2, Rails, etc etc. Nikon Lenses.
All i can say is i love it , love it, love it! Best dollars spent so far, it is totally kick ass! Id pay double the cost of the matte box for it. its simply amazing! Very high quality and looks super slick!
Follow Focus: It is also as much kick ass as the matte box. it fits perfectly on the rails with the M2, he cut me custom rings for my 3 lenses. The teeth meet perfectly , and there is ZERO PLAY in the Follow Focus dial. NO PLAY AT ALL! Highly recommended, a NECCESSATY for all! Im going to give a full review with pictures soon in the hardware boards.
All i can say is i love it , love it, love it! Best dollars spent so far, it is totally kick ass! Id pay double the cost of the matte box for it. its simply amazing! Very high quality and looks super slick!
Follow Focus: It is also as much kick ass as the matte box. it fits perfectly on the rails with the M2, he cut me custom rings for my 3 lenses. The teeth meet perfectly , and there is ZERO PLAY in the Follow Focus dial. NO PLAY AT ALL! Highly recommended, a NECCESSATY for all! Im going to give a full review with pictures soon in the hardware boards.
robot909
Well-known member
In case anyone is shopping for a follow focus, stay away from the JBK units, they are garbage...
http://www.jbkcine.com/index.htm
http://www.jbkcine.com/index.htm
Barry_Green
Moderator
Matteboxes
Matteboxes
I've been through the ringer on matteboxes for the HVX, finally settling on one, so if anyone's in a similar position here's what I went through:
I originally bought the CAVision, but I thought it was ... well, let's just say "delicate" and so I sold that off. It was cheap, sure. But then again, it was "cheap". If the almighty dollar was your only concern, the CAVision was far and away less expensive than the others. But I didn't like it enough to keep it.
Then I bought the Chrosziel -- they have a great name, everyone seems to love 'em, so I ordered one. And it was much better than the CAVision, that's for sure! But there were a few things about it that bugged me, and frankly it didn't work as well with the HVX as the Vocas and that annoyed me to no end. I hate stupid design decisions, so when I shell out $1500 or so and have some dumb niggling thing that constantly annoys me... well... life's too short and there were other choices. I have both the Century wide-angle and telephoto adapters and the Chrosziel didn't work quite right with either of them. The Vocas does, it integrates perfectly (as it should; Century rebadges the Vocas and sells it as their own so you know it's designed to work together).
If you just want a cheap shade, and cheap filter holders, it's hard to beat the CAVision price. If you want a great mattebox and don't intend to ever use lens adapters, the Chrosziel does fine -- and I did like its filter holder better than Vocas', in that it's compatible with the CAVision $59 filter holders (they're $250 from Chrosziel!) But if you want to use the wide-angle or teleconverters, the Vocas is just better for those. It is smaller though; the Chrosziel is a bigger box and will shield more light. But the Chrosziel's french flag won't lay flat against the front (sort of a makeshift "lens cap") and the Vocas will. Lots of things about the Chrosziel that I just found annoying -- the setup was annoying, there were all sorts of little screws and adjustments here and there you have to make in order to get the thing even properly aligned; the french flag not covering the front of the lens when closed was annoying (I mean, Vocas does it, so how hard can it be?) and as for the lens adapter it vignetted on the .6x, and wouldn't quite fit around the full diameter of the 1.6x... well, those things all added up to getting rid of it.
So I went with the Vocas MB-250 (which is also sold by Century Optics, I think they call it something like the Century 4x4 Wide Angle MatteBox Mark II), and I'm content. The Vocas may not be perfect, but I do think it's a better match for the HVX than the Chrosziel is, and it's a bit less expensive too. Especially when used with the Century lenses. Vocas uses its own filter holders that aren't compatible with the Chrosziel or CAVision, which is a point against it.
Also, my Vocas has the rails with the goofy flip-out shoulder thing. I puzzled over that one, as it seems to present itself as a ghetto "shoulder mount", but it's not at all, if you tried to put that extended portion over your shoulder you'd accomplish nothing more than to make yourself look goofy. But what it does do is let you jam the shoulder thing into your shoulder, and that helps stability enormously. If you just butt the thing up against your shoulder you can handhold so much more efficiently; it removes your wrist from the equation entirely (instead of three axes of rotation around your wrist, you now have a solid non-moving surface). So it looks a little silly, but I think it's darn handy for handheld work. It's not comfortable, of course, but it is stable. I still prefer using the Steadi-Stick to stabilize because it takes the weight off your back and arm entirely, but if you don't have something like that, the flip-out shoulder brace thing does work surprisingly well. It's not a "shoulder mount", it's a brace you brace the camera against, and in that context it does what it should and makes handheld shots much more stable.
This is the Vocas/Century that I got:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=425668&is=REG&addedTroughType=search
This is the Chrosziel that I had:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=300596&is=REG&addedTroughType=search
This is the CAVision that I had:
http://www.cavision.com/matteboxes/4x5hs/4x5hs.htm
Matteboxes
I've been through the ringer on matteboxes for the HVX, finally settling on one, so if anyone's in a similar position here's what I went through:
I originally bought the CAVision, but I thought it was ... well, let's just say "delicate" and so I sold that off. It was cheap, sure. But then again, it was "cheap". If the almighty dollar was your only concern, the CAVision was far and away less expensive than the others. But I didn't like it enough to keep it.
Then I bought the Chrosziel -- they have a great name, everyone seems to love 'em, so I ordered one. And it was much better than the CAVision, that's for sure! But there were a few things about it that bugged me, and frankly it didn't work as well with the HVX as the Vocas and that annoyed me to no end. I hate stupid design decisions, so when I shell out $1500 or so and have some dumb niggling thing that constantly annoys me... well... life's too short and there were other choices. I have both the Century wide-angle and telephoto adapters and the Chrosziel didn't work quite right with either of them. The Vocas does, it integrates perfectly (as it should; Century rebadges the Vocas and sells it as their own so you know it's designed to work together).
If you just want a cheap shade, and cheap filter holders, it's hard to beat the CAVision price. If you want a great mattebox and don't intend to ever use lens adapters, the Chrosziel does fine -- and I did like its filter holder better than Vocas', in that it's compatible with the CAVision $59 filter holders (they're $250 from Chrosziel!) But if you want to use the wide-angle or teleconverters, the Vocas is just better for those. It is smaller though; the Chrosziel is a bigger box and will shield more light. But the Chrosziel's french flag won't lay flat against the front (sort of a makeshift "lens cap") and the Vocas will. Lots of things about the Chrosziel that I just found annoying -- the setup was annoying, there were all sorts of little screws and adjustments here and there you have to make in order to get the thing even properly aligned; the french flag not covering the front of the lens when closed was annoying (I mean, Vocas does it, so how hard can it be?) and as for the lens adapter it vignetted on the .6x, and wouldn't quite fit around the full diameter of the 1.6x... well, those things all added up to getting rid of it.
So I went with the Vocas MB-250 (which is also sold by Century Optics, I think they call it something like the Century 4x4 Wide Angle MatteBox Mark II), and I'm content. The Vocas may not be perfect, but I do think it's a better match for the HVX than the Chrosziel is, and it's a bit less expensive too. Especially when used with the Century lenses. Vocas uses its own filter holders that aren't compatible with the Chrosziel or CAVision, which is a point against it.
Also, my Vocas has the rails with the goofy flip-out shoulder thing. I puzzled over that one, as it seems to present itself as a ghetto "shoulder mount", but it's not at all, if you tried to put that extended portion over your shoulder you'd accomplish nothing more than to make yourself look goofy. But what it does do is let you jam the shoulder thing into your shoulder, and that helps stability enormously. If you just butt the thing up against your shoulder you can handhold so much more efficiently; it removes your wrist from the equation entirely (instead of three axes of rotation around your wrist, you now have a solid non-moving surface). So it looks a little silly, but I think it's darn handy for handheld work. It's not comfortable, of course, but it is stable. I still prefer using the Steadi-Stick to stabilize because it takes the weight off your back and arm entirely, but if you don't have something like that, the flip-out shoulder brace thing does work surprisingly well. It's not a "shoulder mount", it's a brace you brace the camera against, and in that context it does what it should and makes handheld shots much more stable.
This is the Vocas/Century that I got:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=425668&is=REG&addedTroughType=search
This is the Chrosziel that I had:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=productlist&A=details&Q=&sku=300596&is=REG&addedTroughType=search
This is the CAVision that I had:
http://www.cavision.com/matteboxes/4x5hs/4x5hs.htm
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Cynic821
Carbonite Member
Any shots of your setup personally barry while using the shoulder brace thing?
As far as the indy made Matteboxes, like the Indie Snap, Hyson Films HD mattebox..etc...any experience for us working on smaller budgets , im not small budget, but 1500 dollars for matteboxes , even though affordable, but more like money better spent elsewhere, you know what i mean?
As far as the indy made Matteboxes, like the Indie Snap, Hyson Films HD mattebox..etc...any experience for us working on smaller budgets , im not small budget, but 1500 dollars for matteboxes , even though affordable, but more like money better spent elsewhere, you know what i mean?
Panther
Member
My frustration Barry is the support for 4x5.65 filters. I own about a dozen 4x5.65 filters and want to use them with my HVX200. Currently, I got a Formatt box, but my circular polarizer not very functional with it. So, I really don't want to go out and buy a bunch of 4X4 filters just to work with my mattebox. I have considered the Petroff 4X5 mattebox system as my future choice, do to its flexibility with my requirements.