Surprising Lens Options!!

Gibby

Gibby

Red Savant
Though most of us felt that existing 1/2" SD lenses were not an option to use with the HD100, and wondered why there was a 1/2" to 1/3" step down converter the official HD100 equipment diagram just released by JVC contains some surprises!

The diagram (link below), shows that the ACM-12 step down converter is intended to allow use of the following 1/2" SD on the HD-100: Fujinon S14x7.3, Fujinon S17x6.6, Fujinon S20x6.4, Canon YH16x7, Canon YH19x6.7.

Most of us felt that 1/2" SD lenses would not provide the necessary resolution for HD, and that there would be aliasing problems in using them. Tomorrow at NAB I will ask the JVC reps and reps at the Fujinon booth for a clarification on if these lenses will work adequately on the HD100. I own the Fujinon S20x6.4 and the Fujinon S14x7.3, so I am naturally very curious about this! I'll report my finding here tomorrow.

Link to JVC HD100 equipment diagram: http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english...-hd100/sys.html

Gibby
www.cut4.tv
 
I don't think you would get aliasing problems with the SD lenses, but I'm sure the image will not be up to the full resolution capable by the camera.
 
my concern has more to do with useful focal lengths with JVC HD100. appears the only useful lens is the 13x (don't know the number) the others are simple converted half-inch lenses with inadequate field of view at full wide. i'm gonna check it out tomorrow as well.

brian wells
 
redindian--

you could easily find that information on the manufactures website, any dealer who prints
prices online (eg: bhphotovideo.com) or a multitude of ways. but here goes for everyone else:

Fujinon S14x7.3 $999
Fujinon S17x6.6 $1699
Fujinon S20x6.4 $2999 (industrial quality) to $8,549 (broadcast quality with 2x extender)

Canon YH16x7 $1,575.95 to $4,099.95, various options
Canon YH19x6.7 $2,999.95 (industrial) to $6,761.95 (ENG/EFP quality with 2x extender)

The pricing has not yet been released for the Fujinon 13x3.5, the 13x zoom made for HD100.
They have announced it will be more than $6,000.00.

brian wells
 
The new 13x is : Fujinon T13x3.5BRMU. The images I saw from it were excellent. The other nomencaltures are:

16X: T16x5.5BRMU, .8 Wide Converter: WCV-82SC, 1/2" to 1/3" step down converter: ACM-12

As per the street cost on the Fujinon 1/2" SD lenses: S20x6.4 = Approximately $3,100 shipped (B &H). S14x7.3 = Approximately $1,000 shipped (both prices in USD)

Gibby
www.cut4.tv
 
scharky said:
I don't think you would get aliasing problems with the SD lenses, but I'm sure the image will not be up to the full resolution capable by the camera.
Click to expand...

A friend of mine owns and shoots with a pretty nice Aaton A-Minima film camera using a
fifteen years old zoom lens that was only 700$ when new. Yikes.

That camera creates pictures that feel so visceral despite the considerably cheap lens.
Sometimes great photography comes from more than just resolving power.

brian wells
 
thisiswells said:
my concern has more to do with useful focal lengths with JVC HD100. appears the only useful lens is the 13x (don't know the number) the others are simple converted half-inch lenses with inadequate field of view at full wide. i'm gonna check it out tomorrow as well.

brian wells
Click to expand...

After seeing the JVC press release mention of the 1/2" to 1/3" step down for the HD100 last week, I asked the question directly to a reputable lens service company in L.A. (Focus Optics). They work extensively on SD and HD lenses. Their response: they felt the 1/2" SD lenses may not give adequate resolution to justify the HD camera. They said the field of view on the back end would be even wider than when using the lens on a 1/2" camera, and the lens would be a little faster. A recent article in Millimeter Magazine also stated that SD glass would probably not be adequate for use on HD cameras. But, I guess the proof will be to find the step down adaptor, hook up a 1/2" lens to the canera, and do some testing.

My Fujinon rep, when I bought the S20x6.4RM lens stated that it uses the same glass as the S20x6.4ERM lens (2x lens). They are both listed on the Fujinon site as Professional ENG/EFP lenses. On the B&H site the lens you saw for $8,499 is the S20x6.4BEMD special use lens. The S20x6.4 ERM lens sells on the B&H site for $6,499. I've used the S20x6.4RM lens on a JVC DV500 for three years and broadcast the footage from it regularly on several networks. It is definately a "broadcast" lens...

Gibby
www.cut4.tv
 
Info I found at NAB today:

ACM-12 Ѕ” to 1/3” Step Down – ACM-12 will reportedly be made by Fujinon. I asked the engineer at JVC and an engineer at the Fujinon booth about the JVC-published diagram that shows three Fujinon Ѕ” SD lenses (S20x6.4, S17x6.6, S14x7.3) as usable on the HD100. They both concurred that those lenses (and two Canon lenses listed) should be usable on the HD100. The echoed the assessment of Focus Optics on the situation: the Ѕ” lenses should have adequate resolution capability, and when used, they will have narrower depth of field, narrower degree of coverage, and be slightly more sensitive to light (faster). When I specifically asked about using the S20x6.4, a lens I own, the Fujinon engineer commented that the 20x uses comparable glass to the new Fujinon 16x that comes stock on the HD100. The 20x image might be slightly softer, but if you were shooting 24p, that might not be a bad thing. Bottom line: legacy Ѕ” SD lenses can be used effectively on the HD100. Link: http://www.jvc-victor.co.jp/english/pro/prohd/gy-hd100/sys.html

Third Party Accessories for the HD100 – An engineer at Century Precision Optics stated that Century would be making a wide-angle converter for the new Fujinon 16x. He also agreed with me that a 1/3” 2x extender should be produced by Century.

Gibby
www.cut4.tv
 
Thisiswells
Shooting on an A minima and film with a cheap lens is diffent than shooting HD with an SD lens. I have no doubt that the footage will look good, but if you shoot HD with an SD lens, why shoot HD at all? Why not stick with SD footage as the resolving powever will not be much different. It might be slightly better, but it defeats the purpose of shooting HD.
 
Scharky-

As I mentioned in my previous post, the Fujinon engineer stated that the glass and components in the new Fujinon T16x5.5 HD lens for the HD100 is comparable to my Fujinon S20x6.4 SD lens. The 16x is a $1,400 HD lens, and the 20x is a $3,200 SD lens. Somehow everyone automatically assumes that because there is an "HD" designation on a lens that it automatically resolves better than all SD lenses. Not necessarily so. The Fujinon engineer felt the resolution of the two lenses in use on the HD100 would be roughly equal. In this case I would use the 20x sometimes, with a 2x extender for wildlife shooting. The 16x just isn't long enough. I shoot regularly with the F900 and Varicam, so I'm well aware of what HD resolution looks like. The images from the $1,400 16x patched via analog component out, on their good monitor, looked stunning.

Bottom line: a good SD lense will quite often resolve as well as a low level HD lense - according to Fujinon. An SD lens on a F900 or Varicam? No. On an HD100? Sometimes...

Gibby
www.cut4.tv
 
The Varicam is 3ccd 960x720 and the jvc is 3ccd 1280x720...the jvc has MORE resolution then Varicam...

I would use an HD lens on the JVC before the VariCam
 
hell, why not just take the lens off, and glue a magnifying glass focused on the CCD, you could get a great image with that, but I'm sure I'd strap that onto the JVC before the VariCam as well.
 
Keep in mind that professional SD lenses are capable of resolving much higher resolutions than any SD camera head.
 
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