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Sony PXW-Z280 & PXW-Z190 4K cams

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    #61
    Originally posted by Run&Gun View Post
    A 5.6mm lens on 1/2" is the same FoV as 18mm on s35 which is ~64 degrees.

    Which is exactly what I said, so this camera does meet Sam's criteria.
    In fact, the 17x zoom range on the Z280 beats the pants off the Sony 18-105 or 18-110 or 28-135 lenses that are often used on the FS5. Oh, did I mention the Z280's lens is f/1.9 (vs. f/4 on those other lenses) and comes free with the camera?
    Doug Jensen, Sony camcorder instructor
    HOW TO MAKE MONEY SHOOTING STOCK
    http://www.dougjensen.com/

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      #62
      Originally posted by Doug Jensen View Post
      What the hell is 27-8?
      27mm - 28mm FF FOV equivalent

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        #63
        Originally posted by Doug Jensen View Post
        I agree. That was the main feature that I, and many people visiting the Sony booth, felt was missing from the camera. I was lobbying very hard with the engineers to fix this oversight and I think they recognize that it is much more important than they had anticipated. I went through this same scenario last year when the Z450 didn't have S-LOG3 because they didn't think that Z450 customers cared about S-LOG. But after pushing hard for it, the Z450 got S-LOG later in the summer. I'll be really surprised if the Z280 and maybe even the Z190 don't get 120 fps HD. Maybe even before they actually start shipping, but if not by then, hopefully in a firmware udpate soon after. Even emails I've gotten from the engineers after NAB shows it is on their minds.
        Thanks for the info.

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          #64
          Originally posted by Run&Gun View Post
          According to Abel Cine's original FoV Calculator(their new one does not appear to have "ENG" formats like 1/2" and 2/3"):
          A 5.6mm lens on 1/2" is the same FoV as 18mm on s35 which is ~64 degrees. And going on to "FF", a ~29mm(28.7) lens on FF is the same FoV as 18mm on s35.
          Agreed

          It's fairly easy to work out the comparative values of lenses vis-a-vis sensor size.

          A Super 35 film frame diagonal is 28.5mm. Divide this by the 1/2" chip diagonal of 8mm. The resultant crop factor is just on 3.56. Multiply this crop of 3.56 by the 5.6mm wide end of the Z280 lens and the result is a 19.95mm wide lens in S35 terms.

          In the case of the Sony S35 sensor in the FS7 that has a diagonal of 27.1. Doing the same exercise as above 27.1 / 8 = 3.38 x 5.6 = 18.97mm within a few fractions of a mm.

          As an exercise take a FF diagonal of 43.3 / 8 = 5.41 x 5.6 = 30.29 wide on full frame. Again within a few fractions of a mm.

          That's the way I have always worked for lens comparisons and it's not failed me yet.

          Chris Young

          S35mm_Digital_Sensors.jpg

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            #65
            Greetings from sunny Zambia

            It's good to talk on degrees not ff, s35 or whatever - does anyone know the degrees of a 4.7 2/3 lens? I think it's about 75.

            I like 75 degrees - 65 probably won't get u fired but will never be fun.

            Doug - Give a 65 degree to a network eng guy and he won't be happy - that seems simple.

            --
            Oddly I'm here with some lenses - not mine - boosted 15-30 24-70 nifty50 and 70-200 - I want to ditch one to save weight - humming on "can I get by with 75 degrees?"
            Last edited by morgan_moore; 04-15-2018, 08:55 PM.
            http://www.sammorganmoore.com View my feature Film

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              #66
              Doug
              1.8 vs 4 - that stat is not so clear - I think the transmission of ff35t4 is about the same as 1.8-2/3 when accounting for the smaller chip
              Again the 4.7 2/3 lens or 24ff seem about the same - and good.
              http://www.sammorganmoore.com View my feature Film

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                #67
                Originally posted by TheDingo View Post
                27mm - 28mm FF FOV equivalent
                I'm glad you got this
                http://www.sammorganmoore.com View my feature Film

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                  #68
                  Originally posted by morgan_moore View Post
                  Doug
                  1.8 vs 4 - that stat is not so clear - I think the transmission of ff35t4 is about the same as 1.8-2/3 when accounting for the smaller chip
                  Again the 4.7 2/3 lens or 24ff seem about the same - and good.
                  First you say that you'd be interested in the Z280 if it had a lens that was as wide as an 18mm on a super35. I show you that that is exactly what it has, but then you say that isn't good enough. And now you are trying to tell me that the lens isn't really f/1.9 because of the sensor size? That's ridiculous. Fortunately I have better things to do with my time today that listen to this kind of nonsense and chase someone around in circles who apparently just wants to debate for the fun of it.
                  Last edited by Doug Jensen; 04-16-2018, 07:13 AM.
                  Doug Jensen, Sony camcorder instructor
                  HOW TO MAKE MONEY SHOOTING STOCK
                  http://www.dougjensen.com/

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                    #69
                    Yours and Sony specs were diffenert - it's great if it is as wide as an 18
                    http://www.sammorganmoore.com View my feature Film

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                      #70
                      Originally posted by Doug Jensen View Post
                      Fortunately I have better things to do with my time today that listen to this kind of nonsense and chase someone around in circles who apparently just wants to debate for the fun of it.
                      "Forget him, Jake...it's Chin---umm---the internet."

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                        #71
                        Originally posted by Doug Jensen View Post
                        The cameras are not aimed at you. IMO.

                        There's a lot of people fumbling around with big sensor cameras who really need to take a look at 4K cameras like these. They don't need shallow DoF -- but they do need decent zoom lenses with fast apertures and lots of other great features (such as 10-bit 4:2:2 4K) that cannot even be found on NXCAM-based cameras like the FS5. These are the right tools for the right people . . . but not for everyone.

                        1/2? The z150 was 1'. How does this stack up in low light performace? I need a solid ENG/Corp event cam.
                        Foundation Digital Media
                        foundationdigitalmedia.com

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                          #72
                          Originally posted by John Foundas View Post
                          1/2? The z150 was 1'. How does this stack up in low light performace? I need a solid ENG/Corp event cam.
                          The Z190 and Z280 are aimed squarely at the ENG/Corp event cam markets.

                          In my casual observations, both of the new cameras have much better low-light capability and lower overall noise than the 1" Z150 and Z90 cameras. Don't let the smaller sensors fool you into thinking a bigger sensor would be better for low light. Maybe if all other things were equal, but they are not. For one thing, the signal processing is much better on the new cameras and they have faster lenses. I look forward do doing a comparison between my Z90 and the Z280 when mine (hopefully) arrives in July.
                          Doug Jensen, Sony camcorder instructor
                          HOW TO MAKE MONEY SHOOTING STOCK
                          http://www.dougjensen.com/

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                            #73
                            Originally posted by Doug Jensen View Post
                            Don't let the smaller sensors fool you into thinking a bigger sensor would be better for low light.
                            Also, these are 3 chip RGB cameras instead of a single 1 inch sensor, so the color should be better with no debayering.

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                              #74
                              I'll make my last comment on the lens - basically a 4.7 2/3 zoom is still basically King of the hill - anything else is a downgrade - I'd love that capability to come to a camera that had a smaller form - full eng cams are just too much for me to schlep about.

                              That capability would seem possible to deliver by Sony with digitally controlled element positioning digital correction and digital zoom at the long end.
                              Last edited by morgan_moore; 04-17-2018, 12:07 PM.
                              http://www.sammorganmoore.com View my feature Film

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                                #75
                                Does anyone know if the Z280 has a WFM? I can't find that info on the Sony website.

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