Second defective jog dial in one year!

[Design Media Consultants]

Well we get a lot of people on this forum that blame the camera, when it is operating error. One of my friends has a production company and his equipment always fails. One day I was assisting in a shoot and at the end of the day, I saw him take his camera and just drop it into a 5 gallon bucket. Duh, little wonder it always fails. I think it would be good to get some stats on the failure rate. Some people lack tactile dexterity. Some people abuse their gear. Does anyone have any news from Pani or another source as to the failure rate? Maybe Berry Green should chime in on this.

[Marshwader]

I can assure you that I treat all my equipment with kid gloves and as I mentioned above after the first repair I actually attempted to use it as little as possible using the touch screen whenever possible. And still it failed again. Panasonic need to look at this componenet and maybe they already have and are now supplying better replacement parts. My hope!

[pancam]

I also have taken great care of my equipment.....already for 30 years.
Simple!
The Panasonic can not afford this
Marshwader! "What is the warranty in Hungary? What has their response been?"
Delivered to England
And what's up during this time?

I use a lot of jog dial,Because I paid for it too
for example: WB variable, gain control, area control etc
Because they can not be otherwise

The AC 160 camera Never had a repair shop under 4 years

[Jason R. Johnston]

Yea. It sucks the jog dial has failed for some people. I use mine a lot and everything's fine. Had the camera for a year now and have used it in places where it needed to be severely cleaned afterward (beaches) several times and in heat conditions approaching 100°F with strong salty wind and extremely tenacious brides! Thankfully, the DVX200 has been a solid tool.

[Design Media Consultants]

Yea. It sucks the jog dial has failed for some people. I use mine a lot and everything's fine. Had the camera for a year now and have used it in places where it needed to be severely cleaned afterward (beaches) several times and in heat conditions approaching 100°F with strong salty wind and extremely tenacious brides! Thankfully, the DVX200 has been a solid tool.

It does suck. But there is no product on earth that does not have some failure rate. Would like to get to the bottom of this issue and find out how many are actually failing, and if there is a solution in the form of a quick fix. Very bizarre that a second dial would fail. I would like a Panasonic rep or Barry to weigh in. I have shot in cold, heat, humidity, etc. no problems. And thankfully, my DVX has been very reliable and solid too.

[Marshwader]

After an astonishingly quick turn around ( I send it in on Friday and it's back with me today) my camera has been repaired with an "... improved jog dial unit" and the firmware has been updated to 1.82 (no idea what the differnce to 1.81 is). Thank heaven anyway for the incredibly efficient Panasonic service here in the UK!

[Vaughan Wood]

I too am now having problems with my jog wheel for the 2nd time (replaced last November).

On the job yesterday it would only move to next item in menu every 2nd time you wound it.

Why do these things happen when you are in a busy time (midyear dance concerts), and not when you're slack!!!!! (grumble grumble).

Next phone call, Panasonic repair man!

Cheers,

Vaughan

[Larry Chapman]

I too am now having problems with my jog wheel for the 2nd time (replaced last November).

On the job yesterday it would only move to next item in menu every 2nd time you wound it.

Why do these things happen when you are in a busy time (midyear dance concerts), and not when you're slack!!!!! (grumble grumble).

Next phone call, Panasonic repair man!

Cheers,

Vaughan

Scary. I sure wish Panasonic had a way to get these proactively replaced.

[Design Media Consultants]

Scary. I sure wish Panasonic had a way to get these proactively replaced.

I think the only way to get something done proactively is to organize and send in documented requests as a group demanding some form of action. Also note, out of the thousands of cameras sold, is the problem statistically valid and significant to require a group action? I do not use the job dial as much as some people, and have not had any issues. But I am concerned about it. How many people are actually having problems, versus people who are not having problems?

Also note that those having problems, have had the dial replaced twice, with upgraded dials. Is there something in the way they are operating the camera? Or is the upgraded dial also defective? This could be a serious issue or it could be nothing, but I believe Panasonic needs to clarify if there is a problem and to offer a solution. I do not need a camera breaking during a shoot. Also what happens when it is out of warranty? If nothing else, Panasonic needs to cover this items, even when the warranty expires. We need answers.

[Jason R. Johnston]

It could be operator error or it could be the jog wheel is so defective, that defect occurs in replacement parts because it is an inherent design flaw. Personally, my experience leads me to believe it's operator error, esp if it occurs more than once. But, you never know. I treat my DVX200 pretty well and the menu jog wheel is fine. I alternate between the dial and the lcd, so who knows what the problem is.

[Vaughan Wood]

JRJ Photo, it may be that it affects us guys who do long format shooting more than the set-up and shoot each shot type, as once the camera is rolling for two hours or so, you really tend to use the menu jog switch to scroll between gain, var WB and even Headphone volume sort of all the time, esp. for dance concert stuff, when digital lights are changing colours all over the place, and those lovely pink tu-tus are turning mauve or orange as the lighting changes, and you are ultra quick at catching the change with a fast WB change.

...well, you get the idea!
Cheers,

Vaughan

[Design Media Consultants]

It could be operator error or it could be the jog wheel is so defective, that defect occurs in replacement parts because it is an inherent design flaw. Personally, my experience leads me to believe it's operator error, esp if it occurs more than once. But, you never know. I treat my DVX200 pretty well and the menu jog wheel is fine. I alternate between the dial and the lcd, so who knows what the problem is.

The jog dial is very sensitive. Some of these shooters have described their shooting scenario as being very hectic, "dance concert stuff," "digital lights are changing colors," etc. As a firearm instructor I understand what a stressful or dynamic environment does to someone's body. They tend to react. When moving fast, under a dynamic situation, it is easy to apply undue pressure to the jog wheel.

As I stated, it is a sensitive device and does not need a lot of pressure to make it work. So we do have to explore operator error, and not discount it. Since only a few people have been experiencing this, and they have experienced it twice, the stats point to operator error. If a guy applies a gorilla grip to the jog dial if will probably fail. Even though they may believe they are treating their equipment well, they may not be cognizant of their mishandling when they are concentrating on a shoot and attempting to make fast changes.

Of course, there is a possibility that there is a defect in the design. Unless we are able to get a detailed analysis of the repair data from Panasonic, we will only be speculating. I was hoping Barry Green, because of his knowledge and association with Panasonic, would be able to address this issue. We need facts, not complaints. I have now become apprehensive about using the jog dial. That should not be. We need input from Panasonic.

[Vaughan Wood]

Here is the reply I received this morning from our Melbourne technician.

"There is an updated switch block for your camera. It was released shortly after your last repair. From what I can see the original part was replaced last time, hence the reason it has failed again.
ETA on part arrival is 3 weeks. I have asked Panasonic to supply faster than this."

Not sure how you can mistreat a built in rolling switch. I'm 67 and have been handling cameras in my own business for over twenty years without any previous dramas.

Yesterday I got the chance to play with my mate's brand new HC-X1. The first thing I noticed was how much more secure the menu switch felt, with much more friction in the roller. True!

Cheers,

Vaughan

[Jason R. Johnston]

JRJ Photo, it may be that it affects us guys who do long format shooting more than the set-up and shoot each shot type, as once the camera is rolling for two hours or so, you really tend to use the menu jog switch to scroll between gain, var WB and even Headphone volume sort of all the time, esp. for dance concert stuff, when digital lights are changing colours all over the place, and those lovely pink tu-tus are turning mauve or orange as the lighting changes, and you are ultra quick at catching the change with a fast WB change.

...well, you get the idea!
Cheers,

Vaughan

Yup, I didn't think of that. I do long shoots, too, but those aren't usually so dramatic: dudes standing behind podiums. It's rare that i cover a live stage performance with conditions changing so much so quickly. But, I'll say this: I shoot beach weddings a lot. Lots of sand and salt air...fingers crossed nothing happens with those little exposed areas where jog dials and other things sit in.

[Jason R. Johnston]

The jog dial is very sensitive. Some of these shooters have described their shooting scenario as being very hectic, "dance concert stuff," "digital lights are changing colors," etc. As a firearm instructor I understand what a stressful or dynamic environment does to someone's body. They tend to react. When moving fast, under a dynamic situation, it is easy to apply undue pressure to the jog wheel.

As I stated, it is a sensitive device and does not need a lot of pressure to make it work. So we do have to explore operator error, and not discount it. Since only a few people have been experiencing this, and they have experienced it twice, the stats point to operator error. If a guy applies a gorilla grip to the jog dial if will probably fail. Even though they may believe they are treating their equipment well, they may not be cognizant of their mishandling when they are concentrating on a shoot and attempting to make fast changes.

Of course, there is a possibility that there is a defect in the design. Unless we are able to get a detailed analysis of the repair data from Panasonic, we will only be speculating. I was hoping Barry Green, because of his knowledge and association with Panasonic, would be able to address this issue. We need facts, not complaints. I have now become apprehensive about using the jog dial. That should not be. We need input from Panasonic.

Yeah I'm not saying you guys suck and don't know what you're doing. Or, you're mistreating your camera. I am saying usually, things are operator error. So, I don't rule it out. I'm guilty of doing stupid things, too. That's why I know it's usually operator error. So, that's the first place I look. But, that doesn't mean the manufacturer didnt screw the pooch somewhere. That just might be the case here. This could very well have been a bad batch, but the replacement parts also breaking in the same way? That doesn't sound like operator error to me either.