AF-100 vs NEX VG-20

[Jade Lane]

Well, a little early maybe but someone needed to start this off as it is a discussion forum.

If rumors are right (and it looks like they might be ?) what are you're thoughts on the NEX VG-20 due for announcement on the 24th Aug.

The VG-10 with all the problems fixed, Manual control with no jello effect/rolling shutter, no aliasing ?

1080 60P and 24p ?

possible E-Mount lens commitment in the future from Zeiss and Voigtlander ?

Contender to the Af-100, what do you think ?

SONY NEX VG-20
16 MPX Exmor sensor
1920×1080 60p/60i/24p AVCHD 2.0 Video Recording
Can record stills in RAW
3 inch touchscreen
Audio level control
IR AVR remote

[xenogears]

No way you can make a direct comparative here, totally different camera for different purposes, a Pro camera vs a consumer one, the VG-20 will be a NEX5N in a video body.

[Ptchaw]

No way you can make a direct comparative here, totally different camera for different purposes, a Pro camera vs a consumer one, the VG-20 will be a NEX5N in a video body.

And the AF100 is what, a GH1 in a pro body? (IQ is better from the GH2).

[Andrew J. Allsbury]

The AF100 shares zero technology with the GH1, maybe you should have done some research before making your first post. The GH2 makes a great picture, but for real video production the AF100 wins every time.

[Barry_Green]

And the AF100 is what, a GH1 in a pro body? (IQ is better from the GH2).

This is a profoundly uninformed statement.

[Alpha Beta Omega]

I have a GH1 and the AF is in another league.

[simonpwood]

AF100 has SDI out, HDMI out, ND Filters, Full Manual Controls, Waveform & Vectorscope monitor, XLR inputs etc.

VG20 cant be considered in the same league surely - the only real edge it has is the large sensor. The VG20 would be a good 'b' cam to the FS100, much as the GH2 is a good 'b' cam to the Af100.

[evanrm]

No way you can make a direct comparative here, totally different camera for different purposes, a Pro camera vs a consumer one, the VG-20 will be a NEX5N in a video body.

Pardon me for being a dork, but how (in simple terms) does the AF100 beat out a consumer camera? Based on the specs that Jade Lane posted, in what ways does the AF102 deliver a better picture? Accessories (waveform etc), picture quality, codec etc? I have an AF102, and I think it's great, but just wondering. Lately I have been filming some roller derby, and the slow-mo is good. Now, if I could just get my focus pulls to, well, pull, it's all be sweet.

[Andrew J. Allsbury]

Can't speak for the VG20, but the VG10 had horrible aliasing and moire. Which even when discounting all of the other features it lacks makes the picture from the VG useless for professional work IMHO. Before the release of the AF100, FS100 and F3 some of these sensor/compression artifacts were begrudgingly acceptable in professional work because of the "DSLR revolution", but not any more.

[dustylense]

I have an idea.... Why don't we wait until the VG20 is out before making judgement on what it will do in terms of image? Plus, they are 2 different cameras for 2 different markets. It's always "what is the better camera"? Silly. There is no perfect camera, ever. I have all sorts of cameras. Not one of them is perfect. I love my af100. I love my HVX200. I love my 5dmk2 and my hacked gh2. I have the vg10, not the best picture, but I love it's ergonomics. It's apples and oranges to compare any of them against each other.

I will say this though. If you find the need for a sub $10,000 large chip camera that needs to do what it takes with a client on set, there are 2 cameras that will do that, The AF100, and the FS100. I had the opportunity to shoot at a promo shoot for the upcoming season of Dexter against green screen. No way would I have shown up with a Gh2 or a VG-10 or 20 or even the 5dmk2. The client wanted to monitor and they asked for 24p. So I kitted out my AF100 and had HD/DSI running into a Ki Pro Mini that looped into a client monitor. (by the way, the ki pro mini is for sale if anyone wants it. PM me). You just can't do that with a Gh2 or VG20. They inquired about the 5dmk2 because of it's coolness (lame hollywood folk that heard about the House episode). But I talked them out of it. I slapped a Cooke 20-250 on the af100 with mattebox just to make it seem cinema for talent and clinet(wow factor). So my point is, what camera will give you options for the job that is sub $10,000? Well, the Af100 is sub $5000 and takes a $20,000 picture. So out of all these cameras, the AF100 is just a fine choice.

HD/SDI, waveform and verctorscopes, 24psf, zebra and peaking, bulit in ND, lens adaptability (flange distance), XLR, and a non aliasing/morie image. Thats the AF100. Even the competitor fs100 does not have waveform or HD/sdi. For sub $10,000 the AF100 is too me, the best choice for variable situations.

If the VG20 however solved the moire/aliasing issue, it will be a great little guerilla cam. Not a production cam though. But if you want to steal shots (where cops or security won't bother you) the "handycam" VG20 would work great. I can't count the times I've been hassled with the AF100 on a set of sticks trying to shoot some stock. But with my VG10, I've never been asked to stop filming. I just play the "I'm on vacation" card.

So what is it? Are ya looking for a production camera with large chip? Only 2 choices for the $5000 mark.

And NO, the af100 is NOT the gh1 packed into a video camera body. THat's just ridiculous !!!!

[videohead]

I'm planning to be shooting several projects with both the AF100 and NEX VG20 an it will be very interesting to compare them almost side by side. I don't like the display on the AF100 at all, I haven't seen it resolve well and the color balance seems off, and so I usually want to use an external monitor with it, but the Sony on-camera monitor and viewfinder are great.
HD-SDI is irrelevant to me. I'm doing either AVCHD capture in the field or uncompressed HDMI capture in the studio/greenscreen. It works fine.
Waveform monitor is essentially useless for me in HD/SVCHD space, as is vectorscope. Great for post work, but I already have them in my NLE. I'm much more comfortable with a
VG20 definitely does 24P, not that I shoot it a lot.
Two levels of Zebra and a focus peaking mode in the VG20.
The NEX is great for lens adaption. I have EF, Nikon, Sony A mount, and Minolta MD glass working beautifully. I don't generally shoot PL because my clients cannot afford it. A mount with autofocus and full auto exposure is a plus for events (weddings, etc.), run and gun and hopefully some more action sports this year.
I guess that I've been lucky with moire . . . I see this very frequently with Canon's compression on the 5DmkII (which I shoot regularly for clients), less so on the T2i and T1i, and very rarely on the Sony SLT-A55. I'm expecting the same moire behavior on the NEX - a rare problem that I have to work around in post.
For me, same experience with rolling shutter. Not a major problem. The NEX VG20 seems to do better than the DSLRs, and Sony in general seems to do better - probably due to the scanning and capturing capabilities of the EXMOR sensor.
For me, all cameras are a tool to acquire the best results within the budget and timeline restrictions of the shoot. If I have to shot with a Flip or GoPro, then so be it.
I want some flexibility with the tools - easy adjustment of iris, gain, and boy does it help to adjust and monitor audio levels!
At this point, I want to pay less for the camera, since it is the most disposable/most quickly obsolete production asset. My mics, Steadicam, tripods, lenses, lights might be 20 years old and noone says boo, but I've been through five cameras in five years due to obsolescence and the pace of improvement. Some collorary of Moore's law seems to say throw your camera body in the trash every 2 years and get ready for the next big thing.

[Letzring]

Waveform monitor is essentially useless for me in HD/SVCHD space, as is vectorscope.

. . .hmm, interesting perspective.