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    Originally posted by editman View Post
    If the sensor is cropped to a smaller size could we just use a smaller sensor to begin with? The whole idea is to have a sensor as close to 35mm as possible.
    You could, but no camera exists that I see that shoots that size sensor with a m4/3 lens mount. That's why I am curious how mixing crop-mode looks, which is operating at the proper OLPF for the sensor, so that the aliasing and moire should be comparable to the AF100, with the AF100. I think a lot of people are curious about this.
    formerly know as grimepoch.

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      Im still waiting for a ultra wide fast lens for this cam...
      like the 7-14 but ... not at f4
      Sorry im not really good in english

      Comment


        It is informative to look at the production numbers of lenses made in the past for popular SLRs. The seventies were glory days for 35mm photography, with scores of 'camera shops' in any mid-sized city, photo kiosks in parking lots, shopping malls & grocery stores. A trip to the zoo revealed hundreds of weekend shooters with 'high-end' cameras and often a kit bag full of lenses. Fold out pages of ads for Canon, Nikon, Minolta, Pentax, Olympus, Konica, Contax -- likely others I've forgotten. Half a dozen monthly photo mags -- in the UK, that many weekly photo mags. I worked in a camera store to pay my way through college -- on a typical weekend I'd sell half a dozen SLRs, and so too would four or five others in our shop alone.

        My point? Despite all that enthusiasm, and all those sales, and all that advertising ... some of the very lenses we covet today, those 'big glass' fast lenses -- the Nikon 105, the Canon 85, not to mention the sub-20mm category of super wides -- sold only hundreds of units, around the world, over a decade of production.

        You may want a super-fast super-wide zoom (and so do I) but the development costs alone will push the price into the thousands I'd guess. It's one thing to repackage a design developed years ago and still sitting in a drawer some where -- another thing entirely to work up from scratch for a market that -- frankly -- is a niche market in a field that is itself a niche market.

        Just my humble opinion.

        Cheers,
        GB

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          We send people to space, i think we can figure out a super-fast super-wide zoom ...
          Its the only thing im complaning about, i have all the others lens that i need, but whit the *&?*@ crop factor i just need a super-fast super-wide lens to complete my kit.

          Like i said they made a 7-14 at f4 ... just made a f1,4 or f2 version ...
          Im ready to pay, i think a lot of people are ready to pay.
          Last edited by Julienmassie; 11-11-2010, 05:37 PM.
          Sorry im not really good in english

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            Originally posted by Julienmassie View Post
            Like i said they made a 7-14 at f4 ... just made a f1,4 or f2 version ...
            Im ready to pay, i think a lot of people are ready to pay.
            I believe so few people are willing to pay the thousands of dollars such a lens would cost that it will never be built. Just my opinion ... but what you ask for would be a huge step up from lenses that already cost thousands. Nikon makes a zoom with similar range (though not as wide) in full-frame though two stops slower ... and it sells for $2,000. Add two stops and you will double the price. So I suspect you are asking for a $4,000 lens, and that is IF it can be done and still deliver enough sharpness and rectilinearity that you'd be happy at any price.

            Don't hold your breath!

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              Originally posted by Julienmassie View Post
              Im still waiting for a ultra wide fast lens for this cam...
              like the 7-14 but ... not at f4
              Is there any comparable lens for any other cam you can point to?
              ..
              The AU-EVA1 Book - The DVX200 Book - The UX180 & UX90 Book - Lighting For Film & TV - Sound For Film & TV

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                Originally posted by Julienmassie View Post
                We send people to space, i think we can figure out a super-fast super-wide zoom ...
                Its the only thing im complaning about, i have all the others lens that i need, but whit the *&?*@ crop factor i just need a super-fast super-wide lens to complete my kit.

                Like i said they made a 7-14 at f4 ... just made a f1,4 or f2 version ...
                Im ready to pay, i think a lot of people are ready to pay.
                What does the crop factor have to do with it? I repeat -- can you find a super-fast, super-wide zoom on ANY format? ANY sensor? Find a 14-28 f/1.4 zoom out there for a full-frame camera. It doesn't exist. And if it did, it'd cost thousands of dollars, probably tens of thousands of dollars.

                The 7-14 f/4 gives you the same field of view as a 14-28 f/4 on a full-frame camera.
                ..
                The AU-EVA1 Book - The DVX200 Book - The UX180 & UX90 Book - Lighting For Film & TV - Sound For Film & TV

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                  Originally posted by Barry_Green View Post
                  What does the crop factor have to do with it? I repeat -- can you find a super-fast, super-wide zoom on ANY format? ANY sensor? Find a 14-28 f/1.4 zoom out there for a full-frame camera. It doesn't exist. And if it did, it'd cost thousands of dollars, probably tens of thousands of dollars.

                  The 7-14 f/4 gives you the same field of view as a 14-28 f/4 on a full-frame camera.
                  Yup.

                  F/4 is standard, F/2.8 is a luxury, and F/2 is top shelf but even more rare.

                  The fastest wide-zoom lens I know of is a 15-40 T/2 by Cooke. It's on Ebay for $38,000. Any wider or any faster is almost unthinkable.

                  Sensors are getting cleaner and faster. F/4 is nothing to shake a stick at.


                  What I find really amusing, are the few people who want a faster super-wide angle zoom not for exposure but because they want shallow DoF. Little do they realize how hard that is going to be at such wide angles. Almost impossible!
                  Last edited by Ryan Patrick O'Hara; 11-13-2010, 12:07 AM.

                  If cinematography wasn't infinite, I'm sure I would have found the end by now.

                  Comment


                    Check out Emmanuel's Osaka Japan video, he used a Lumix 8mm Fisheye (he called it 2.8, but isn't it 3.5?) in available low light.
                    A little extreme, but definitely W I D E...
                    He also used an Olympus 14- 35 f2.

                    http://vimeo.com/16791885

                    Comment


                      bang for buck nikon mount tokina 11-16mm f2.8 for $600
                      http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread...=1#post2139762
                      http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread...=1#post2139869
                      Last edited by J Davis; 11-13-2010, 12:33 PM.
                      J.Davis
                      jdMAX.com

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                        Originally posted by tipota View Post
                        Really waited until somebody would finally mention what you wrote. A 14 mm is really good enough for most wide-angle shots. Thank you.

                        But: Would a 7-500 Zoom with constant f 1.4 make people stop complaining? Naaaah.... because it would not be a macro, probably..... ;-)
                        That lens would not only be amazing, but weigh about 350 lbs.... maybe more.
                        Cinematographer
                        Sigma Pro

                        www.timurcivan.com 917-589-4424

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                          Yeah, why settle for f1.4? Why not f0.0? They could do it if they really wanted to. (sigh)
                          ..
                          The AU-EVA1 Book - The DVX200 Book - The UX180 & UX90 Book - Lighting For Film & TV - Sound For Film & TV

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                            Originally posted by Julienmassie View Post
                            Rap star like it wide YO!
                            Yes im looking for something like this but this is a f4 lens, im just waiting for a better option. I already have all the others lens that i need, i just dont have my wider than the widest of the widest wide lenses at the moment because there is this crop factor, but im full equip and good from 40 to 200mm.
                            Just so you know, this is a lens, thats not only one of the widest FOV lenses ive ever seen thats rectilinear, but the fact that it isnt 35,000$ alone is astounding. You probbal arent gonna get too much better than this. Plus an F4 isnt that slow. I have a F4 24-105 on my 5D and i hardly feel it as slow. If youre shooting Rap videos youre gonna be using lights anyway. A ringlite would be bitchin on this lens... give it a try.
                            Cinematographer
                            Sigma Pro

                            www.timurcivan.com 917-589-4424

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                              Originally posted by Barry_Green View Post
                              Yeah, why settle for f1.4? Why not f0.0? They could do it if they really wanted to. (sigh)
                              It seams like if it was posable then someone in the last 170 years of photography would have done it.

                              Correct me if I'm wrong but when you look at those side view diagrams of lenses (like here http://www.four-thirds.org/en/microf...40-056_olympus ) it appears that the individual lenses/groups are extremely tightly packed. Is it this that complicates maters? simply that the elements can't get any closer before they start to intersect one another. Further complicated by the necessity of wide angle lenses to have a shorter focal length (less space to put the elements)

                              It seams like the electronics of high ISO sensors will outpace the science of optics and make tomorrows f/4 yesterdays f/.95

                              Comment


                                This review is a little wonky but I still think it is worth looking over before buying a Panasonic 7-14mm:
                                http://www.h2hreviews.com/article/He...e-Matchup.html

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