How interested are you in a GH6 anymore?

[hotchkiss]

this makes sense & I hope the GH6 is a S35 sensor that can do 2K/4K S8/S16. Even better Panny ditch the mount altogether and make it L-mount + adaptor (maybe not possible)

That would be very unfortunate and short sighted on Panasonics part. M43 is one of their hallmarks, and in a unique market segment. The effort and investment of the last what, 11-12 years would be destroyed for another me-too product. Why not just use a FF camera and shoot in APSC mode with FF glass? You're already dealing with bigger and heavier glass, why not at least have the option of shooting S35 and FF?

IMO, Panasonics biggest error has been their timidity with M43 motion cameras and their lens lineup. How long did it take them to release the 10-25 1.7...? Ditch the GH5 hybrid approach, and make a new and improved AF100, or at least a BGH1 that is not so blatantly gimped... LCD, built in XLR's and IBIS. I still scratch my head at what the BGH1 could have been. Sad. Maybe Panasonic has a surprise up the proverbial sleeve. I can only hope.

[Ron Evans]

this makes sense & I hope the GH6 is a S35 sensor that can do 2K/4K S8/S16. Even better Panny ditch the mount altogether and make it L-mount + adaptor (maybe not possible)

If they did that may as well buy a BM Pocket 6K Pro

[filmguy123]

Panny has already explicitly said they aren't doing S35, as they think there isn't enough differentiation. They are staying m43 sensor/mount and FF L mount.

Further evidence of this is in their investment into m43 specific lenses: the 10-25 and the new upcoming zoom. And it makes sense, because the reason you choose m43 has a lot to do with lens size more so than body size. The biggest advantage of m43 is the smaller sensor and smaller lenses. The smaller sensor means you can get plenty wide enough for most use cases, but can get very far reaching zoom lenses in a very small form factor. This arguably has more use to travel videographers/photographers.

I just hope that the GH6 isn't focused on more resolution, or at least, that there is a GH6s.

[NorBro]

They should definitely keep the MFT size.

I doubt Blackmagic will do anything else with it besides maybe a Pocket 2 - and possibly Z CAM although I don't think they will - so it's really only Panasonic who's left who could make an appealing MFT camera.

They have a lot of features they can focus on if not auto-focus.

[DLD]

You can't really blame Panasonic for thinking long and hard about the role of the MFT in the modern photo-video landscape. GH-5 was $1,800 upon its release. Today, one can buy a 42 MPX full frame A7RII for $1,300 (and it was $3,200 back in 2015). And you get a pretty decent photo AF with both phase and contrast detect points.

MFT does indeed have size advantage, especially in the telephotos, but Sony managed to shrink a full frame A7c to below the APS-C size. And, if the MFT role is to be a budget alternative to APS-C and full frame, then it needs to have a very limited feature set. Which won't satisfy the GH-4 and GH-5 owners.

And that's a "damned if you do and damned if you don't" situation. Add the slumping market in the equation, the demise of Olympus and and one can't really fault Panasonic if it decides to bail out on the MFT.

[jdv]

Literally no one wants a GH5 II. That's doubly true when rumor of a GH6 exists. The name of this very popular thread is "GH6" not "GH5 II".

Announcing both cameras would have to be right up there with dumbest corporate mind think seen in a long while. Other than blowing out leftover parts and for tax benefits, it's staggeringly goofy idea.

To recap, in a down economy in a market segment that has suffered massive reduction in sales, Panasonic - while still maintaining a poor selling full frame lineup - has leaked a wildly undewhelming followup to the GH5, but then undercuts even that with yet more "the best is yet to come!" vaporware promises of a GH6?

For the sake of whoever is running the show there, I hope these rumors are false, because if true this has debacle written all over it.

[filmguy123]

Yeah, I really am extremely curious to see what they do with the GH6. How do you differentiate m43 today in the cheap mirrorless FF landscape? Price is getting hard and harder, so it's going to have to be feature set.

Organic sensor tech is one possibility (which has a host of advantages outside just a nice sensor).

Built in NDs and MiniXLRs and internal RAW is another.

But really, who knows what we will see. The less optimistic side of me thinks we'll just see it as 8k 30p 10-bit internal, false color software display, and a few other things... which would be underwhelming to me. The last thing we need, for video at least, is a tiny sensor pushing more resolution... just, why? I guess they would market it for wildlife and sports photographers who need long zoom range and high resolving power, which is cool, but if it's not offset by a lower res/higher sensitivity "S" model, than it feels like a harder sell... and what would the "S" model have to offer beyond being a GH5s with IBIS for $2k in 2021/2022?

Whether it's via physical hardware or via an organic sensor, internal VND is my #1 wish to make the GHx the ultimate travel/docu/run-gun camera. I mean, what a dream it would be to have a high sensitivity "S" style sensor with IBIS, built in variable ND on the 10-25 f/1.7 lens with 4k120p 10-bit VFR internal. A big upgrade to the EVF and flip out display (a super bright, high res 4" flip out would be great).

Also curious what the new zoom would be. A 20-50 or 20-60 f/1.7 lens would be a killer pairing with the 10-25. That would be game changing for my travel work.

[filmguy123]

Literally no one wants a GH5 II. That's doubly true when rumor of a GH6 exists. The name of this very popular thread is "GH6" not "GH5 II".

Announcing both cameras would have to be right up there with dumbest corporate mind think seen in a long while. Other than blowing out leftover parts and for tax benefits, it's staggeringly goofy idea.

Eh, IMO, the move will be determined in light of what they say about the GH6.

If there's some interesting teasing of a GH6 in a semi-soon timeframe, the GH5m2 is a fine incremental update. It probably costs them less to streamline production with an update CPU and offer 4k60p 10-bit, and they can just replace the GH5 which is still selling with a better model for the interim. I don't think their market in such case is people with a GH5 waiting for a GH6. One possible strategy is release a GH6 in the fall, and the m2 price then drops to $1k. Thinking of it like this, what a compelling platform for content creators who could snag a GH6 as their main cam and a couple more GH5m2 as dirt cheap b-cams that are pretty competitive by offering modern codecs/bitrates/slow motion.

If nothing else, this is a sign of commitment to the platform and for all of us who appreciate the tools, it's pretty good news, pending details on the 25th.

[stoneinapond]

Literally no one wants a GH5 II.

Since we are all speculating based on leaked specs, by Panasonic or otherwise, and none who post in this thread know what the finished camera is, I think your doom and gloom prediction points to something other than displeasure at Panasonic marketing.

Who knows, I might want one when I finally see the 'finished' product.

[Mark Williams]

I have owned the GH2, 3, 4, and 5. I suspect the GH6 will have some features that interest me if Panasonic sticks to their game plan.

[DLD]

Another factor for Panasonic to consider is that, due to its rather unimpressive DFD auto focus system, it is competing against the independents like AMD and Z Cam, who also largely depend on someone willing to work in a manual mode. And then they're going against $1,300-$1,500 MFT cameras that can record ProRes internally and ProRes Raw externally. And all AMD pieces come with a free DaVinci Resolve. And Z Cam offer a very nice and inexpensive MFT-to-EF booster that also has ND filters built-in.

So, what would GH-6 have to have to sell enough units at, say, $1,800? Well, it's going to have to beat S1 on specs. And there's no reason for Panasonic to do that.

My take again is that GH-6 would have to come in for under $1,300, likely at around $1,000, and be the king of budget video cams a la the six year old G7. Otherwise, Pocket4K and Z Cam E2 M4 are better buys.

[stoneinapond]

So, what would GH-6 have to have to sell enough units at, say, $1,800? Well, it's going to have to beat S1 on specs. And there's no reason for Panasonic to do that.

Panasonic beat the S1 when they released the S5 (except for the EVF). Why did they do that?

Size.

And the comparative pricing argument only goes so far. There are other factors that can make the price sit higher and still sell. Loyalty, emotion, size, image.

[NorBro]

Another factor for Panasonic to consider is that, due to its rather unimpressive DFD auto focus system, it is competing against the independents like AMD and Z Cam, who also largely depend on someone willing to work in a manual mode. And then they're going against $1,300-$1,500 MFT cameras that can record ProRes internally and ProRes Raw externally. And all AMD pieces come with a free DaVinci Resolve. And Z Cam offer a very nice and inexpensive MFT-to-EF booster that also has ND filters built-in.

So, what would GH-6 have to have to sell enough units at, say, $1,800? Well, it's going to have to beat S1 on specs. And there's no reason for Panasonic to do that.

My take again is that GH-6 would have to come in for under $1,300, likely at around $1,000, and be the king of budget video cams a la the six year old G7. Otherwise, Pocket4K and Z Cam E2 M4 are better buys.

It can still have solid IBIS and better AF and a flip screen and better battery life and lower-quality recording formats.

Maybe it wouldn't be as cinematic, but who cares; it'd be a very useful tool with just those five features both cameras above could not match up with.

[filmguy123]

They can absolutely beat the S1H on features, because the S1H is full frame. They've stated that has been their strategy before, too - to offer features that beat the larger sensor cameras in a smaller sensor size.

And, as image quality and features starts to reach a sort of plateau for many use cases - and let's be realistic, it's already happening and as technology keeps churning, only more so - there is actually no reason a $2500 GHx M43 camera couldn't compete against a $2500 FF camera. Yeah, I said it.

Why? Because with further sensor advances, once we're cruising with great lowlight and over 14-15 stops of DR and high res, high framerate internal codecs and a ton of features... there are actually reasons why, once a certain level of IQ/feature parity is reached, a user would want m43 *over* full frame.

I would know, I'm one of them. I have an S1H and an EVA1 and a robust set of full frame glass and a bunch of accessories. Yet I would pay the price for a GH6 if it delivers what I am looking for what because there are use cases where m43 is hands down better. I'm a OMB and I travel. The weight and size really do matter. I will put up with shooting FF and the drawbacks of larger gear etc. because right now, the juice is worth the squeeze - the extra IQ and DR are worth it. But is the juice worth the squeeze if I can get 95% of the way to what I need?

The difference between 10 stops and 14 stops DR is night and day. If m43 in the future hits 14 stops though, and LF/FF in the future hit 18 stops... well, that same difference isn't night and day. I just don't need that much DR for what I am doing. It's nice, but not, lug around a ton of FF gear to Nepal as a OMB nice.

The real question is how far will the GH6 go in closing the IQ gap? I need a more organic look out of what comes next, more DR. I don't really need better lowlight than the GH5s, maybe a smidge more would be nice. And if the GH6 delivers and puts out a great image with great internal codes and the res/frame rates I am looking for, my S1H will actually sit on the shelf more because small and light cameras are a dream to work with.

[DLD]

Panasonic beat the S1 when they released the S5 (except for the EVF). Why did they do that?

Size...

S1 and S5 are from the same stable. There's no negative effect on Panasonic there.

It can still have solid IBIS and better AF and a flip screen and better battery life and lower-quality recording formats.

Maybe it wouldn't be as cinematic, but who cares; it'd be a very useful tool with just those five features both cameras above could not match up with.

It could have all that but will that set GH-6 that far apart from Pocket 4K and Z Cam E2M4 and M6?

Panasonic can go high MPX for stills but it doesn't look like they're gonna. It's just really hard to find a unique niche for them in a reasonable price bracket. But, if they decide to go as low as $1,000, they might sell a boatload of them. Just not to the pros.