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A7IV launch on Oct 21

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    #91
    I'm impressed with what they offered for $2500...maybe a step above the R6.

    But...crops are the Achilles heel as expected.

    Crop in 4K/60p and no 24p 4K crop option in S35.

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      #92
      Yeah, seeing the crop for 4k60 makes me feel vindicated in not waiting for this
      www.VideoAbe.com

      "In this world, Elwood, you must be oh so smart or oh so pleasant. Well, for years I was smart. I recommend pleasant." -Harvey

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        #93
        Pre-order now and you you'll get yours in 2023!

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          #94
          So my first impression from reading about it and watching reviews (I have not personally touched one, so my thoughts are only based on features, specs and other people's experiences) is that compared to the A7SIII, this camera does not have 4K 120p, it cannot do 4K 60p in full frame, it has some pretty bad rolling shutter which will be a problem especially with long lenses, it has a lesser quality viewfinder and LCD screen, it's missing the same quality top dials, it has only one CFexpress Type A card slot, and I did read that it is a little more prone to overheating.

          It's definitely a cheaper, more budget friendly camera than the A7SIII or A1, but it will still shoot video and photographs pretty well for people who need a hybrid camera, so long as you're careful when shooting with longer glass and you're able to work around overheating. Try to think of this as a great photo camera that happens to have some nice video features more than a great video camera that happens to shoot photos. If you have that thought process going in then you'll be happy with this new option from Sony.

          It reminds me a lot of the A7III which I bought to replace my aging A7SII a few years back and totally regretted as it just didn't have the look of the A7SII and it felt cheaper made, not to mention it constantly overheated on me, had terrible pixel binned HD and a weird motion cadence to it. This camera kinda reminds me of that experience when compared to the A7SIII and A1.

          That all being said, I may still grab one to use with my FX6, A1 and A7SIII when wanting to do four camera livestreams which is something I do for events. For that purpose it will be a nice addition to the other three that has similar color. Plus, it will pair nicely with the A1 when doing two camera photo shoots. But, I would not consider it a serious video tool outside of that as the potential overheating issues, the terrible rolling shutter, and the single CFexpress Type A card slot all would bother me too much.

          The best part of this camera to me is that it has Animal Eye AF in video now (not just photos), a focus breathing correction mode for video to combat focus breathing on some of Sony's native lenses, and the same Variable Shutter Anti-Flicker mode that's found in the A1, but not the A7SIII. The reason why these are so great to me is that if the A7IV has these modes, you can probably bet they will be added via firmware to the A7SIII and A1 which is great. Also, the A1 has an option where the shutter closes when the camera is off to help protect the sensor from dust when changing lenses and now the A7IV has this option too. The A7SIII doesn't, but I'm hoping since the A7IV does that the A7SIII will get this via firmware as well. These are all solid features that should trickle over to Sony's other cameras which is great.

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            #95
            Maybe I'm missing it as I quickly glance over the specs on B&H and numerous sites, but did this not get the RAW output from the HDMI port?
            http://instagram.com/teddy_dem/
            http://vimeo.com/luciddreamsfilms

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              #96
              Originally posted by Teddy_Dem View Post
              Maybe I'm missing it as I quickly glance over the specs on B&H and numerous sites, but did this not get the RAW output from the HDMI port?
              I have not seen a single mention of raw output for the A7IV, so I'm assuming that's not an available option. Although to be fair, everything I've seen so far from the raw out on the A7SIII, A1 and FX6 isn't all that much different from the internal 10-bit log since there really isn't a viable way to get the 16-bit raw out to work with a recorder yet.

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                #97
                FWIW, according to Gerald Overdone, the overheating problem is mitigated with a pulled out/flipped out screen and some space on the bottom (i.e., don't keep it on your pillow).

                Apparently, it is also a very good photo camera and even has a lens breathing correction for some Sony G-Master primes.

                Originally posted by NorBro View Post
                I'm impressed with what they offered for $2500...maybe a step above the R6....
                A better photo camera. Now, what will Canon do? EOS R is ancient.

                So, they'll probably release a new RP.

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                  #98
                  Originally posted by DLD View Post
                  FWIW, according to Gerald Overdone, the overheating problem is mitigated with a pulled out/flipped out screen and some space on the bottom (i.e., don't keep it on your pillow).
                  Where I think overheating will be a problem with this camera is for those of us who live in the South. It gets hot here and Gerald said he tested it in a controlled air-conditioned environment. I'm thinking anyone who lives in a hotter environment who wants to use this camera during the day to shoot something like an event, they could find themselves in some trouble. The A7III was the same way.

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                    #99
                    Originally posted by DLD View Post
                    A better photo camera. Now, what will Canon do? EOS R is ancient.

                    So, they'll probably release a new RP.
                    It's an important camera overall because it's the first affordable (or costs less than $3500 if you would like to view it like that) 4K/60p AF camera from Sony with, obviously, great AF but also higher quality codecs.

                    Only other options in a ~ price range are the R6 and S5. Of course a balancing act exists as the R6 drew the longer straw for full-frame 60p but the shorter straw for codecs and data rates. The S5 drew the longer straw for IBIS but the shorter straw for AF.

                    The puzzle pieces per usual are perfectly assembled.

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                      Originally posted by Joshua Milligan View Post

                      Where I think overheating will be a problem with this camera is for those of us who live in the South. It gets hot here and Gerald said he tested it in a controlled air-conditioned environment. I'm thinking anyone who lives in a hotter environment who wants to use this camera during the day to shoot something like an event, they could find themselves in some trouble. The A7III was the same way.
                      Back on October, 1, 1987, I was working at an electronics retail outfit in San Fernando valley. It was Saturday and management decided to make it a "parking lot" sales event. Great idea but it didn't help that the temps that day hit 114F. An Emerson shelf-top stereo system didn't take kindly to it and collapsed toward the middle, as its plastic case melted under the sun.

                      Another thing that didn't help the salespeople attitude that day was that we had a 5.9 magnitude earthquake (known in history as the Whittier Narrows Earthquake). Sometimes things don't go as planned.

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                        I remember when you almost sold me my first VCR in the late 80s.

                        I was 4 1/2 and came in there to talk specs, but you were on your lunch break so I just went for the Sylvania 6260VF.

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                          In the early-mid-1980's Jeffrey Kessler sued the Japanese TV manufacturers in an anti-trust action (price fixing, product dumping) on behalf of the US TVcompanies. The US courts ruled against him. The US TV manufacturers - GE/RCA, Sylvania, Zenith, Curtis Mathes, etc. - promptly quit the TV business, though some brand names were sold. The dominant brand names in the mid-late 80s to the end of the 1990's were all Japanese Sony, Mitsubishi, Hitachi, Pioneer, Panasonic/Technics, Toshiba, JVC, Subsequently, the Japanese were driven out by the Koreans, who were driven out of the mass merchandising market by the Chinese.

                          PS. I really liked the 1980's Sylvania TV ads.

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                            Originally posted by Teddy_Dem View Post
                            Maybe I'm missing it as I quickly glance over the specs on B&H and numerous sites, but did this not get the RAW output from the HDMI port?
                            The a7 IV will definitely get ProRes RAW through the Ninja V. It's not clear whether the breathing compensation feature will work with PRR - we'll just have to wait and see. As far as ProRes RAW goes, on the a7s III, it''s 4.2K (4264 x 2408) resolution, which amounts to 23.7% higher resolution which is visibly more detailed than the internal codec. It means there's still a tiny bit more leeway for cropping or stabilization than with the internal codec. De-noising ProRes RAW in post yields a much nicer, organic looking grain structure.

                            For HDR, internal XAVC-S I 4:2:2 should be avoided.

                            "The Y’CbCr encoding model is popular because it conceals subsampling artifacts vastly better than does RGB encoding. Sadly, while Y’CbCr works well in Rec 709, it doesn’t work very well for HDR. Because the Y’CbCr values are created from RGB values that have been gamma corrected, the luma and chroma values are not perfectly separate: subsampling causes minor shifts in both. This isn’t noticeable in Rec 709’s smaller color gamut, but it matters quite a lot in a large color gamut. Every process for scaling a wide color gamut image to fit into a smaller color gamut utilizes desaturation, and it’s not possible to desaturate Y’CbCr footage to that extent without seeing unwanted hue shifts.

                            My recommendation: always use RGB 4:4:4 codecs or capture raw when shooting for HDR, and avoid Y’CbCr 4:2:2 codecs. If a codec doesn’t specify that it is “4:4:4” then it uses Y’CbCr encoding, and should be avoided". -Art Adams

                            This paper by Dolby shows how 10-bit Y’CbCr is not only not great for displays but also that maximum color deviation of 10-bit Y’CbCr exceeds the acceptable threshold at every luminance level for theatrical presentation, making quantization distortions like banding and contouring visible. It damages the image at capture as well, affecting not only saturated blues and reds, but the all-important skin tones as well.

                            https://professional.dolby.com/sitea...paper_v071.pdf
                            Last edited by jonpais; 10-25-2021, 05:26 AM.

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                              Jared the Fro says that 10 fps stills shooting is only in JPEG or Compressed Raw and Sony doesn't say how compressed it is. Otherwise, in a non-compressed Raw, it's only 6 fps.

                              I, obviously, have not seen every second of every A7IV review out there but I had not seen this before.

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                                Deleted. Wrong info!

                                Chris Young

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