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Wisycom wireless -any first-hand experiences here?

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    Wisycom wireless -any first-hand experiences here?

    As I mentioned in Alex's "What’s in your sound package?" topic, I'm starting to look for new wireless systems. For tax reasons (and new-product release hopes), probably won't buy until early 2022.

    I pretty much have my head around what Lectrosonics, Zaxcom, and Audio Ltd. currently have. Less sense of Shure Axient and Wisycom (though I follow jwsound) .. So I'd love to read about people's first hand experiences with Axient and Wisycom (and any competing) systems. Or second hand if say, you were the camop or audio-post person on a job recorded with those systems.

    NB: I'm really interested in how they work in a bag rather than on a cart.

    So what do you think? Anyone here worked with Wisycom?

    https://wisycomusa.com

    https://www.shure.com/en-US/products...axient_digital
    ----------
    Jim Feeley
    POV Media

    #2
    I've been looking at them as well. I put the MCR54 system in the Trew cart twice, but couldn't get myself to do it. From Wisycom users the comments I've seen are that while they really like them:

    - The manuals are less than stellar, missing information
    - Support is not strong
    - Users are disappointed at not seeing an app released even though the MCR54 receiver has bluetooth.

    I have not read any comments about repairs

    I get the impression Wisycom is ahead in the game technically over Lectrosonics. But Lectrosonics wins in the US because they are everywhere and have good support. If Wisycom upped their marketing and support, they could put a real dent into Lectrosonics. Having two full receivers for each channel seems to me to be a serious advantage, but what do I know about RF (nothing)?
    Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

    Comment


      #3
      Update - Wisycom has a beta of their app, which currently only controls the 54 receiver. But they said they will be coming out with bluetooth-equipped transmitters that can also be controlled via the app. So perhaps its time to wait and see.

      Here's a good discussion about Lectrosonics users moving to Wisycom:


      Long time Lectro guy, Wisy-curious.… I am strongly considering switching from Lectro to Wisycom MCR54 and MTP40S. That said I am VERY gun shy. A while back I switched from Lectro to Audio Limited A10’s and had a lot of range and signal stability issues (not user error). If I switch:

      -What are the range characteristics in relation to Lectro SM and SRc?
      -Signal stability?
      -What do RF hits/drops sound like on Wisy?
      -Actual battery life on the double battery Wisy tx’s?

      Thanks in advance!
      --------------------------------------------

      Range with the mcr54 is outstanding . I didn’t use lectros as much as I use wisycoms though. I typically use sharkfins .
      Battery life is very good too , I use eneloop pros you can expect 6+ hours on the mtp40s
      --------------------------------------
      You are going to love both the range and battery life, I don’t really think much comes close really, especially for the power output.
      -------------------------------------------------
      Wisycom beats lectros on range and battery life on many levels. Interface and learning curve is much higher. Sound quality is on par for an analog radio.
      ---------------------------------------------------
      Range and signal stability wayyyy better than SM/SRc. My only issue is transmitter size/shape. I was a long time Lectro user and the SM/411a was the best combo you could get. I really hated the SRa/b/c. Also, things today just need to be wide band if you travel. Since you have control of the squelch level and it’s not automatic like the Lectrosonics, they can drop out like Lectro would or sound like when you turn the pilot tone off.
      ------------------------------------------------------------------
      Same as above. Long time Lectro user. I made the switch this summer and it’s been great. Took about a weekend to get my head around the workflow and after that I’ll never look back. Bear in mind, you’ll need to understand manager and get an IR interface.
      ---------------------------------------------------
      I have a wisy MCR54 and Shure Axient Digital. Shure blows everything away, but the wisy is a close second. Hit me up if you’d like to try it out to compare!

      MCR54
      Range and sound quality is better than My limited experienced with lectro.

      Dropouts sound similar to lectro.

      Batteries last 6-12+ hours depending on power setting

      Signal is stable, but I’ve found the need to use different power settings, linear, and narrowband modes for certain situations.
      -------------------------------------------
      Lectro seems to be the most reliable in regards to range and bugs. Long time user of both and always have to switch back to my lectros on set.
      ---------------------------------------------
      Range is incredible, sound quality is flawless, and it’s virtually impossible to clip.
      -----------------------------------
      MCR42's, MCR52 and mix of tx. I switched to wisycom from lectro about 2 or so years ago. no comparison how much more reliable the wisycoms have been in rough RF environments. The tuning range is critical to getting reliable signals. Also not being able to dial down to 20mw on lectro I think is a big part of better reliability with wisy - 50 or 100 is too much at close range and overloads the RX and makes reflection signals hotter. best to start at 20mw or 20Lmw and go from there. longer battery life, more reliable RF. Lectro's big problem now is a really scattered and poorly thought out new digital line up. No slot in 2 ch RX, stereo modes go to 24K instead of 48k some tx are 32K, read the specs, they try to hide the real numbers. I might of tried shure but after filling out my wisycom stuff, not switching again, at least for a while.
      ----------------------------------------------------
      Lectro user and this year I’ve bought MCR54+MTP40’s and senns 5212.
      I’ve just finished my 1st film and I’m just start to know the system. Range and rf stability was very good. I’m amazed cause I work now at 20mw, or 50…
      Until today the limiters of Lectro seems better, but may be I need more time to test them. PHA+MTP40 worked for me. To read the displays wisy seems harder, leds on MCR54 are good and fast for batterie alert. Have worked good on bag with own antennas too







      Last edited by Paul F; 10-10-2021, 09:37 AM.
      Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

      Comment


        #4
        Thanks for aggregating all that discussion, Paul. Interesting stuff.

        The more I look at the options, the more it reaffirms that there’s no one system that has or does absolutely everything, but the competition is starting to get pretty serious.

        No matter which system is used, I cannot overstate the benefit of having a good RF distribution system with bowties (for a bag) or shark fins (for bag or cart) to increase range and stability. For all the hate I have heard for the SR-series receivers, I’ve never had issues with my SRc kits, but I’ve had the PSC RF-Multi and Betso Bowties. When I move to my cart, I repatch the RF Multi to a mast with PSC Skeletals. I get extremely good range performance. And just for comparison, I’ve patched SMA-modded Sennheiser G4 ew512 receivers through the RF Multi and have also gotten remarkably increased range and stability. We’re operating in an ever-increasingly crowded RF space, and we’re also packing more and more digital processing into our bags (tightly packed at that). Getting the antennae detached from the cluster and moving them outside the bag, even by just a few inches, can make all the difference in the world.

        I’m very interested in the Wisycom 4-channel kits, but I’ve spent a lot of money on my Lectro systems over the last year, so it’ll be a while before I can justify the expense. Maybe they’ll have a massive game-changer by then.
        Knoxville-based location sound mixer.

        Instagram @sonolocus

        Comment


          #5
          "No matter which system is used, I cannot overstate the benefit of having a good RF distribution". Indeed. I ran a test recently with SMA-modded, 30mw G3s, LPDA, 2:1 split, no active gain on the antenna. With some trees blocking the path, but not on a body, I went 500' without a dropout.

          Having not used any of the upper tier systems, I am getting to be a fanboy of Wisycom for no apparent reason other than anecdotal information. As you may have read elsewhere, I rented a Lectrosonics system to compare noise floor against the G3 and was disappointed and confused at the results. Lectro's noise floor was far worse than the G3. That was with the attenuated COS-11D. But per Lectrosonics documentation, it was the correct microphone to use with the system rented to me as the attenuated mic was developed specifically for Lectrosonics LMa. Another G3 user rented Lectrosonics and had the same results. Go figure. It makes no sense.

          It did sound better. But the results left me wary about spending $7,000 -12,000 (4x xmitter) on these upper tier systems.
          Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Paul F View Post
            I rented a Lectrosonics system to compare noise floor against the G3 and was disappointed and confused at the results. Lectro's noise floor was far worse than the G3.

            It did sound better. But the results left me wary about spending $7,000 -12,000 (4x xmitter) on these upper tier systems.
            That’s odd. I wonder what other circumstances may have been at play there. What were the exact components of the Lectro system you rented? You mentioned the LMa (admittedly one of their lower-tier transmitters). Which receiver? And did you go through your gain staging thoroughly?

            I have eight channels of Lectro in my bag. SMDWB transmitters, SRc receivers. I have zero issue with self-noise on those systems using both COS-11D and B3 lavs. The receivers have true line-level output, so there’s no pre-amp gain added in the mixer. I’ve still got a few G3 sets here (camera hops)... I’ll have to do a side-by-side. But while I did get extremely clean signal out of my G4 ew512s, the Lectro companding is even more transparent and, again, no noise floor.
            Last edited by Alex H.; 10-10-2021, 03:11 PM.
            Knoxville-based location sound mixer.

            Instagram @sonolocus

            Comment


              #7
              Here's the setup and secondary setup after getting comments from Larry (Lectro expert).

              Lectrosonics:
              COS-11D plugged into an LMa.
              LMa gain set to a level so that the Zoom F8 is reading -12db for the peaks
              411a plugged into Zoom F8
              411a gain set to 0
              Zoom F8 gain set to 28db

              Sennheiser:
              COS-11D plugged into SK100
              Sensitivity set to -18db so that the Zoom F8 is reading -12db for the peaks
              PK 100 plugged into Zoom F8
              PK 100 gain set to 0
              Zoom F8 gain set to 28db

              After re-adjusting the LMa gain per Larry's instructions and re-running the test, I changed the F8 gain to 10db for the LMa and 33db for the G3. Noise level results were the same.

              Another person responded: "I am experiencing almost this exact same issue. I have borrowed two sets of 411a/UM400a with COS11-D's for a shoot and have them going into a Zoom F8. I am positive I have the gain staging set properly. When I compare side by side with my Sennheiser G4 and MKE2 mic, the Sennheiser noise floor is MUCH quieter."
              Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

              Comment


                #8
                Something still seems suspect there. Just out of curiosity, those settings lead me to believe the 411a was set to mic-level output, since the G3 cannot output true line level. Is this correct? I wonder how the same test would fare with the 411a sending line-level out.

                I don’t have access to an LMa/411a combo, but the LMa is an older (and discontinued) transmitter from Lectro. I’m not sure, even if there’s something else at play here, that this is a fair enough comparison to impact a decision on buying current Lectro gear. I have no noise issues with my Lectro systems.
                Last edited by Alex H.; 10-10-2021, 09:32 PM.
                Knoxville-based location sound mixer.

                Instagram @sonolocus

                Comment


                  #9
                  No question; something is suspect, but I'm not interested in running the comparison again. If anything, I'd want to try a Wisycom MCR54/MTP40 pair. I asked the other person to contact me if they learned anything else, but I suspect that after the rental, they won't do anything further.
                  Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Let me rephrase that - I'm not interested in renting Lectrosonics again to run the test. If anybody is in the San Francisco bay area that would be willing to get together to run a comparison between the G3 and the Lectrosonics or Wisycom, I'd like to do that.
                    Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Paul F View Post
                      Let me rephrase that - I'm not interested in renting Lectrosonics again to run the test. If anybody is in the San Francisco bay area that would be willing to get together to run a comparison between the G3 and the Lectrosonics or Wisycom, I'd like to do that.
                      Wish I was closer, but I’m going to do a side-by-side-by-side this week with a G3 ew112, and G4 ew512, and a Lectro kit (SMDWB+SRc). I don’t have any COS-11Ds terminated for Sennheiser, only Lectro, so I’ll use Countryman B3 across the board.

                      The gain staging specs you posted are odd, and I’m really curious as to how much that impacted your results as that’s not at all the way one of those systems should be set up for real-world use. More than that, though, I truly wonder if it was the quality of the rental gear. Rental gear gets the crap beaten out of it, and the lav is the weakest point in the system. Lavs simply break down over time - they’re basically expendables - on their own, but if mistreated the way rental gear often is, the breakdown happens faster. One of the first signs is increased noise floor.

                      I recently sold off my entire G4 ew512 kit, but one of my friends here locally bought two of them, so I have access to them and know the condition they’re in. None of what I’ll be using is, or has ever been, rental gear.

                      I know we’ve gotten well off the original topic of the Wisycom systems, but I do want to take a closer look at this noise floor issue as I really cannot fathom, just from my own personal experience, that Lectro noise floor would be higher. That said, I’m also extremely interested in the Wisy systems. I’ve strongly considered buying one of the MCR54 bundles to toss in with my MixPre-6 II just to have an ultralight solution when needed... but I can’t quite justify that expense right now.
                      Last edited by Alex H.; 10-12-2021, 02:49 PM.
                      Knoxville-based location sound mixer.

                      Instagram @sonolocus

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Excellent. I'm looking forward to your results. Please make a recording.
                        Awarded Best Clear Com Chatter, 2001, PBS Television

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