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    Senior Member JAMedia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    The M1 is an ideal chip for use in servers, many posts ago I guessed the market would move in this direction. Its a server the code can be written to serve (see what I did there ).
    Many moons ago at an SAP research lab PR event, Intel turned up giving there sales pitch on how they could coax their hardware to run a few degrees hotter, the promise was that this small increment could reduce power and cooling costs for large server farms.
    Now along comes the M1, very powerful and frugal on power with minimal heat output.
    If Apple doesn't reenter the server market perhaps Dell etc and hammering on their door to buy.
    There were other CPU's that were more powerful than the x86 that did not need cooling. BTW there are a lot of server farms in Greenland. The air there is consistently very much cooler than other parts of the world and the heated air is used to heat all the buildings the towns beside the server farm(s) It makes a very energy efficient and less expensive system to run.


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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMedia View Post
    There were other CPU's that were more powerful than the x86 that did not need cooling. BTW there are a lot of server farms in Greenland. The air there is consistently very much cooler than other parts of the world and the heated air is used to heat all the buildings the towns beside the server farm(s) It makes a very energy efficient and less expensive system to run.
    Which processors are these and how much more efficient or cooler did they run?
    Heat dissipation is a major issue with Amazon etc building their farms near rivers using the river water to assist in cooling. Greenland sounds great yet not every server farm is located there.
    The M1 is a magnitude more efficient in reducing power consumption (electricity bill) and waste heat management.


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    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    Which processors are these and how much more efficient or cooler did they run?
    We used PPC, 603 cores a lot for servers and SDH (Sonet in the US). This is going back a while.


    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    Heat dissipation is a major issue with Amazon etc building their farms near rivers using the river water to assist in cooling. Greenland sounds great yet not every server farm is located there.
    Server Farms are the growing industry in Greenland. Other "cold" countries are seeing similar increases in server farms. Due to history of where companies started and their first computer sites there are a lot of server farms in warmer countries and now they are there it wil be difficult to move them.

    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    The M1 is a magnitude more efficient in reducing power consumption (electricity bill) and waste heat management.
    That is true. BTW it is not an ARM-Cortex cpu. Apple licensed the instruction set and designed the CPU themselves.


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    PPC 603 core, that's a RISC processor from the good old joint project from Motorola, IBM and was it Sony also? Not the x86 instruction set.

    I used to programme 6502 and Z80 (and a few others)in machine code later moving on to low-level assembly language for control systems.


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    Senior Member JAMedia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    PPC 603 core, that's a RISC processor from the good old joint project from Motorola, IBM and was it Sony also? Not the x86 instruction set.
    The Apple M1 isn't an x86 instruction set and has more in common with the 68K than the x86.


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    Quote Originally Posted by vultch2 View Post
    The M1 is an ideal chip for use in servers, many posts ago I guessed the market would move in this direction. Its a server the code can be written to serve (see what I did there ).
    Many moons ago at an SAP research lab PR event, Intel turned up giving there sales pitch on how they could coax their hardware to run a few degrees hotter, the promise was that this small increment could reduce power and cooling costs for large server farms.
    Now along comes the M1, very powerful and frugal on power with minimal heat output.
    If Apple doesn't reenter the server market perhaps Dell etc and hammering on their door to buy.
    Actually, it's not. It's built as a custom SOC that's optimized for client devices rather than servers. There's a reason that the server oriented ARM processors don't have the same feature set, like embedded system memory.

    I doubt that Apple would have any interest in that market. Breaking into that market is a long road, and it's not like Apple is lacking customers.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Tamerlin View Post
    Actually, it's not. It's built as a custom SOC that's optimized for client devices rather than servers. There's a reason that the server oriented ARM processors don't have the same feature set, like embedded system memory.

    I doubt that Apple would have any interest in that market. Breaking into that market is a long road, and it's not like Apple is lacking customers.
    Maybe not on the face of it but ARM's new owners might be looking at servers. Especially with the M2 CPU


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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMedia View Post
    Maybe not on the face of it but ARM's new owners might be looking at servers. Especially with the M2 CPU
    To my knowledge, ARM does not have new owners. There is a proposed future acquisition by nVidia which would take at least 18 months, assuming it is not blocked. There is significant opinion that it will be blocked by regulators: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/10/01/tech...e-blocked.html

    Even if it went forward, I don't think ARM (no matter who owns it) has any rights to Apple's microarchitectural design -- and that's where the real magic is. Apple has an architectural license which means the chip is totally designed by Apple and the only commonality is a subset of the ARM64 instruction set. From an internal microarchitectural standpoint, the Apple M1 is no more similar to a mass-manufactured ARM Cortex CPU than a 10th-generation Intel Sunny Cove CPU is to an AMD Athlon CPU, even though Intel licensed the instruction set from AMD.


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    Quote Originally Posted by JAMedia View Post
    Maybe not on the face of it but ARM's new owners might be looking at servers. Especially with the M2 CPU
    What makes you think that anyone outside of Apple would have access to Apple's IP?

    Apple has an ARM license, that doesn't mean that anyone else with an ARM license has access to Apple's architecture or implementation.

    In any case, nVidia is already a large and growing presence in datacenters, and ARM has several licensees that have been building servers for a long time. They've been working on breaking their ARM designs into the server market for several years. Apple's had no involvement in any of that, since Apple is primarily a consumer electronics vendor that sells computers also.

    * joema is correct, the nVidia acquisition isn't a done deal.
    Last edited by Tamerlin; 12-08-2020 at 08:48 AM. Reason: clarification


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    The Silicon Valley has a lot more sway in the incoming administration than in the outgoing one. IOW, this will be approved by the DOJ. $40B is peanuts by the global standards anyway and the chip market is very competitive as it is.


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