View Poll Results: RED T1.9 Prime Lens Set

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  • Yes - make them now, I want, I want, I want

    121 87.68%
  • No - don't make them I'm going to use Still Lenses or other Cine Lenses

    17 12.32%
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    #21
    Senior Member zakaree's Avatar
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    unless ur working back to back on project to project as a dp or camera operator.. why spend that much money on a set of lenses? renting sounds alot more reasonable to me.. at least when it comes to a production that requires so many lenses.. im not saying dont have any lenses at all... but zeiss... cooke.. arri? used maybe (as long as they dont have any fungus or scratches) but seriously.. NIKON makes some nice glass for not so much money.


     

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    #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by zakaree
    unless ur working back to back on project to project as a dp or camera operator.. why spend that much money on a set of lenses? renting sounds alot more reasonable to me.. at least when it comes to a production that requires so many lenses.. im not saying dont have any lenses at all... but zeiss... cooke.. arri? used maybe (as long as they dont have any fungus or scratches) but seriously.. NIKON makes some nice glass for not so much money.
    The question to buy or rent is a challenging one. There are so many different categories of RED reservation holders. Some that can barely afford the CAMERA and will be using still lenses to those who are ready to throw down 50,000 for a complete red package.

    At 17,500, the RED is priced within a range that individuals would actually consider buying...hence the 1000+ current reservations. Compare this to the cinealta, Thompson, Dalsa...where renting is the usual choice since it costs so much. Likewise, with the Cooke and Zeiss Mater Primes, you are looking at spending 100,000 plus for a set. If RED could make comparable lenses and price them around 20-30,000 a set, it would seduce more individuals to consider purchasing rather than renting.
    Last edited by tonacidigital; 11-06-2006 at 05:34 PM.


     

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    #23
    Senior Member taubkin's Avatar
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    A lot of people would be interested. Super16 camera owners, looking for a new set of lenses... DPs that like to use their own lenses with rental cameras (it happens, from time to time), Red owners, etc... But of course the main market would still have to be red owners, since they would be the first to use those lenses and show to the world what they could do. Now, I still think the price has to be right, otherwise, I don't know how they can take profit from them... Producing 1000+ cameras is something I can understand as profitable, but 150-200 lens kits... well, not quite...


     

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    #24
    Senior Member zakaree's Avatar
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    yah.. ok so.. im 24 years old.. and i am in the bracket of buyers that will take out a small business loan.. and make payments.. i have nikon lenses. mattebox.followfocus and support rods... so whats wrong with nikon> will it not get the job done? (indi, commercials).. i guess i can sell my 07 lexus is250... should have gotten a used 98 ranger instead....


     

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    #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonacidigital
    At 17,500, the RED is priced within a range that individuals would actually consider buying...hence the 1000+ current reservations. Compare this to the cinealta, Thompson, Dalsa...where renting is the usual choice since it costs so much.
    also, besides the camera body, usual customers want you to have a choice of
    - tripods
    - adapters for those tripods
    - setmonitors (9, 14, 20, 24, crt, lcd, sd or hd or both)
    - vectorscope, waveform, gamutmeasurement.
    - french flag and a croziel or arri mattebox
    - followfocus / focusassist / remotefocus
    - etc for iris and zoom
    - a solid selection of primes and zooms
    - raincoats, carrybag, flightcases etc
    - power cells, charging units, v-mount and more exotic one
    - viewfinders, dioptren adapters for the shortsighted as me please
    - pick a choice of the most exotic gadget youīve never heard about.
    - *replacement for everything of this* if something fails

    so, and that is one important thing to remember: longstanding rental companies as mine usually have this and typically make a package offer with all of the above and often a good deal for filmout/DI etc. so donīt underestimate the big shop around the corner and be careful with your business plans, folks. its not only the camera. actually, the camerabody itself is usually 20-30% of the invest for one rental setup, that is, if you donīt have backup. then it is 10-15%.

    please, donīt get me wrong - i donīt want to tell anyone not to go into rental. i just want to share some of the lessons i have learned the hard way when i (as twen) started into that business and believe me, your employees might be happier if you take the advice


    Quote Originally Posted by tonacidigital
    Likewise, with the Cooke and Zeiss Mater Primes, you are looking at spending 100,000 for a set.
    rather more.

    Quote Originally Posted by tonacidigital
    If RED could make comparable lenses and price them around 20-30,000 a set, it would seduce more individuals to consider purchasing rather than buying.
    lol, funny one - purchasing instead of renting i suppose?
    yes, i completly agree if that is what you wanted to type.
    however a slight warning here.
    - a budget dops often want the best of best of the state of the art - simply because they can get it.

    While the red camera is excellent in any aspects, a T1.9 prime set is just really really good, especially if red would sell it at a red-pricepoint. electronics vs. mechanics - red canīt be as wildstyle as they can be with cameras if it comes to optics (i sincerly hope than mr. jannard proves me wrong )
    We here and there see DOP who -donīt- want our angenieux 25-250 but the newer and yes a slight little bit better optimo.

    now, one of the main advantes of the optimo is that it can be custom tailored to your prime set to have the same look. guess what, even if they just get a zoom and no primes... they still want the optimo. so be careful. quality and opinion are 2 things, logic & facts wonīt replace emotions and heresay for many people.


     

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    #26
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    As much as I want a set of RED primes, I'd want to wait until after NAB '07 to hear about it. They have their hands full enough with the camera... I can wait for lenses.
    "I've heard that this project is impossible... hehe" ~ Jim Jannard
    The Pursuit of Happyness


     

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    #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brook Willard
    As much as I want a set of RED primes, I'd want to wait until after NAB '07 to hear about it. They have their hands full enough with the camera... I can wait for lenses.
    100% agreed.

    red will have tons of biz-opourtunities later on.

    there is a russian saying i always liked:

    You should kill the grizzly before sharing it with the others...


     

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    #28
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    100,000 a set
    "rather more."

    Yeah, I typed it as a generalization.. i should have added a "+" to the figure.. since I myself don't know the exact cost of the total set..but I do know it is more than 100 grand.

    "seduce more people into buy than renting"

    Renting is what I meant hahaha...super typo.


     

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    #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brook Willard
    As much as I want a set of RED primes, I'd want to wait until after NAB '07 to hear about it. They have their hands full enough with the camera... I can wait for lenses.
    Yeah.. I'll be happy enough to see the camera shipping as planned and really could live without the lenses...but I still enjoy discussing the possibilities and I do feel a poll, even if premature, is still useful.


     

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    #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by tonacidigital
    100,000 a set
    "rather more."

    Yeah, I typed it as a generalization.. i should have added a "+" to the figure.. since I myself don't know the exact cost of the total set..but I do know it is more than 100 grand.
    130.000-140.000 euro typical without storage and accesoires...
    you can(could?) negotiate them down to ~90.000 (sorry bandpro if you are reading this) when you avoided their distributors. but right now, i have the impression, they are more than overbook. angenieux is overbooked as well (optimo delivery moving into 2008 oO), cooke i donīt know but i would guess not to different.

    Quote Originally Posted by tonacidigital
    100,000 a set
    "seduce more people into buy than renting"
    Renting is what I meant hahaha...super typo.
    indeed, supertypo out of hell with bells & whistles....

    anyhow, i suppose that my english (sry, its my 3hrd language) contains plentyful of "supersilly sentences"(tm) and "completly clumsy"(tm) claims.


     

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