Page 8 of 18 FirstFirst ... 456789101112 ... LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 174
  1. Collapse Details
    #71
    Senior Member ahalpert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    2,826
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by rob norton View Post
    This thread is all over the place! It needs to be divided into next 5 years, 5-10 years, 20+ years.
    True, but it's so hard to predict the time scales. Some changes have happened so fast. and yet, at the same time - Moore's Law governing the increase in processing speed seems to no longer apply as the miniaturization of processors possibly reaches a natural limit. Will the acceleration of computing speed continue apace? And personally, I've been surprised by how much cloud AI services are charging. Maybe those rates will come down but it suggests that AI magic is still costly


    Reply With Quote
     

  2. Collapse Details
    #72
    Senior Member Run&Gun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    4,938
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Feeley View Post
    Run&Gun quotes Ken Rockwell:



    There's more, but that's the crux. Rockwell's provocative, I guess, but also wrong. Or at least not universally correct. Remember Ansel Adams' instructional photography books? There were three of them and sure seems like Adams didn't think "shooting is the last thing we do."

    The Camera
    https://www.hachette.com.au/ansel-ad...eries-1-camera

    The Negative
    https://www.hachette.com.au/ansel-ad...raphy-series-2

    The Print
    "Shows how the making of a fine print is the culmination of the photographic process."
    https://www.hachette.com.au/ansel-ad...series-3-print


    But maybe Rockwell doesn't consider Adams a practitioner of "real photography." So closer, perhaps, to what Rockwell's thinking, photographers such as Salgado, Mary Ellen Mark, Winograd, and my photojournalist friends all spend/spent time working on their images after the shutter closed. I guess getting it all in camera can be a goal for certain types of photographers... But it's not for a bunch of others. So maybe I'm just missing something here.


    But back to smartphones: a friend recently used OpenReel on a high-profile project. He was the editor, not the producer, btw. Basically, OpenReel lets producers set up a video-conference call with talent/subject through a smartphone or webcam. But the producer/tech can remotely control the talent's device...setting exposure, audio, and some other stuff. That's interesting feature #1. #2 is that during the video call, the talent's device is recording a higher-quality video internally. Then after the end of the video call, the talent's device automatically transfers that file to the producer.... The talent doesn't need to futz with delivery. There's more and I need to dig in more.... And they don't publicize pricing (it's a "contact us" deal...so it's not cheap). But I'm thinking of finding out more about it; it could be genuinely useful... Especially if we ship out a good smartphone (ie- iPhone 12), small tripod, mic, and light. I'm just hoping the service doesn't cost like $500/hr... Though even then, as long as someone else is paying...
    https://www.openreel.com

    I have an iPhone 11...I'm impressed by the quality of the stills and video I get with it. I'll probably order the 12 this week...I'm not just GASing, btw... Before the 11, I was using an iPhone 4S...but I want 5G...esp if something like OpenReel can work with 5G, then perhaps we can get out of people's home offices... Well, you all can see what I'm thinking, and probably share the mix of interest and concern.
    You have to take him with a grain of salt and not take everything he says completely literally. I interpret what he says to mean to take more care when you shoot and not completely rely on or think you can “fix it” all in post. Generally speaking, in my opinion, post should be to eek out that last little bit that wasn’t possible during capture or make those little tweaks that refine it and make it that much better. Not to fix a 5-stop overexposure on a face and WB that’s not even remotely close to correct.

    And Ansel and those guys had a plan going in. KR is referring to people that just spray and pray and try to get something out of it after the fact.
    Last edited by Run&Gun; 10-14-2020 at 11:20 PM.


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Reply With Quote
     

  3. Collapse Details
    #73
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    8,774
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by Run&Gun View Post
    You have to take him with a grain of salt and not take everything he says completely literally. I interpret what he says to mean to take more care when you shoot and not completely rely on or think you can “fix it” all in post. Generally speaking, in my opinion, post should be to eek out that last little bit that wasn’t possible during capture or make those little tweaks that refine it and make it that much better. Not to fix a 5-stop overexposure on a face and WB that’s not even remotely close to correct.
    The thing is (and we're just chatting)...why do we have to use and/or continue to develop standards around inferior hardware in the first place?

    Our eyes don't need correction (DR).

    Why do we have to use these boxes that struggle in certain conditions and abide by their rules and these general video production tips and tricks for these little engines that could...?

    Get a few companies that are worth a couple of trillion dollars and create better technology.


    Reply With Quote
     

  4. Collapse Details
    #74
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    1,597
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by ahalpert View Post
    True, but it's so hard to predict the time scales. Some changes have happened so fast. and yet, at the same time - Moore's Law governing the increase in processing speed seems to no longer apply as the miniaturization of processors possibly reaches a natural limit. Will the acceleration of computing speed continue apace? And personally, I've been surprised by how much cloud AI services are charging. Maybe those rates will come down but it suggests that AI magic is still costly
    I'm not too worried for now...

    I feel like there are too many factors at play to know what will happen and think a new high end will still emerge.

    Also for a documentary it's not just about robots being capable of capturing a feature. The subjects still need to agree. I would never participate in a documentary with a bunch of robots following me. Some people of course wouldn't mind but my point is there can be unpredictable hurdles too.

    Society could ban all these robots flying around as well because of how annoying it is just to capture all of these terrible documentaries.


    Reply With Quote
     

  5. Collapse Details
    #75
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    8,774
    Default
    Robot Norton...I like the sound of that. lol


    1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
    Reply With Quote
     

  6. Collapse Details
    #76
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Northern California
    Posts
    998
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by ahalpert View Post
    Adams also said you shouldn't take the picture until you know exactly what you'll do during development.
    Developing the negative, and especially making a print, wasn't just automatic. There's another quote attributed to him that I remember going something like, "The negative is like a musical score, and a print is like a performance of that score." And like any musical performance, there are some variations in different prints Adams made from the same negative.

    Hell, even after Adams made and framed his prints, he wasn't done. Dig this: When I was a kid, a doctor taught a class at our high school. His practice bought six or so original prints from Adams. Adams brought the framed prints to the doctor's office in Palo Alto, carried them up a couple flights of stairs (because he didn't like elevators), and decided where they would be hung... Yes: part of the deal was that Adams would determine the right place for each picture. This was the late 1970s so Adams was also in his late 70s.
    ----------
    Jim Feeley
    POV Media


    Reply With Quote
     

  7. Collapse Details
    #77
    Senior Member Run&Gun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    4,938
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by NorBro View Post
    The thing is (and we're just chatting)...why do we have to use and/or continue to develop standards around inferior hardware in the first place?

    Our eyes don't need correction (DR).

    Why do we have to use these boxes that struggle in certain conditions and abide by their rules and these general video production tips and tricks for these little engines that could...?

    Get a few companies that are worth a couple of trillion dollars and create better technology.
    I may have mentioned this a few pages back, that’s what’s getting scary about the iPhone. It balancing some of these shots out that we can’t with cameras that cost 30x-100x as much. Of course, we don’t always want that...

    Like so many other things in life, these advancements are a double edged sword.


    Reply With Quote
     

  8. Collapse Details
    #78
    Senior Member ahalpert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    2,826
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by rob norton View Post
    I'm not too worried for now...

    I feel like there are too many factors at play to know what will happen and think a new high end will still emerge.

    Also for a documentary it's not just about robots being capable of capturing a feature. The subjects still need to agree. I would never participate in a documentary with a bunch of robots following me. Some people of course wouldn't mind but my point is there can be unpredictable hurdles too.

    Society could ban all these robots flying around as well because of how annoying it is just to capture all of these terrible documentaries.
    The other thing about documentary shooting is you need to be running around and getting in the right places at the right times, dancing with your subject matter. You need to pick your angles- high, low, through the mirror, the glass, profile, OTS. Theres a lot of stuff that cant be fixed in post and cant be done following a one-page cheat sheet from the company that sent you the iPhone kit.


    Reply With Quote
     

  9. Collapse Details
    #79
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Long Island
    Posts
    8,774
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by Run&Gun View Post
    I may have mentioned this a few pages back, that’s what’s getting scary about the iPhone. It balancing some of these shots out that we can’t with cameras that cost 30x-100x as much. Of course, we don’t always want that...

    Like so many other things in life, these advancements are a double edged sword.
    For sure...and as much as I can't wait to see what they do with anything and everything, the video shallow DOF still has to come out on the phones nicely otherwise I would never use one. So once they have that going inside the phone or I can use FCP X to adjust it, I'm in.


    Reply With Quote
     

  10. Collapse Details
    #80
    Senior Member ahalpert's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    2,826
    Default
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Feeley View Post
    Developing the negative, and especially making a print, wasn't just automatic. There's another quote attributed to him that I remember going something like, "The negative is like a musical score, and a print is like a performance of that score." And like any musical performance, there are some variations in different prints Adams made from the same negative.

    Hell, even after Adams made and framed his prints, he wasn't done. Dig this: When I was a kid, a doctor taught a class at our high school. His practice bought six or so original prints from Adams. Adams brought the framed prints to the doctor's office in Palo Alto, carried them up a couple flights of stairs (because he didn't like elevators), and decided where they would be hung... Yes: part of the deal was that Adams would determine the right place for each picture. This was the late 1970s so Adams was also in his late 70s.
    That ansel Adams story is awesome.

    I mean, part of this conversation hinges on whether the customer wants the video to look great or just adequate. and there are a lot of use cases where adequate is all that's required. But maybe they want it to look better than that.

    To look at it another way - not everyone will be Kubrick or Chivo or insert-idol-here because they have a superphone. They still need to think about where they're gonna point the thing, what they're trying to say, and the FEELING they're trying to evoke, as run&gun mentioned.

    I used to AC for a DP who went to AFI and he joked that his first year there was spent just talking about their feelings. I'm assuming he meant their feelings that were generated by imagery


    Reply With Quote
     

Page 8 of 18 FirstFirst ... 456789101112 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •