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    #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by puredrifting View Post
    External recorders. Ugh. Nice features and yes most of us need a monitor but it seems external recorders are beginning to fell a little retro.
    BMD RAW is cool, I've been shooting it with the UMP G2 and the PCC 6K this week but the money, weight, cables, battery consumption,
    I much prefer it in the camera. Maybe we'll get there is the Apple/RED dispute is resolved with the right answer.
    Maybe if companies would stop wasting their resources in litigation and focusing more on R&D we'd get more solutions like X-OCN and RawLite... though in the hybrids that may still a non-starter.

    I'm going to be sending the Nikon loaner back soon and writing up a review of that in a few days... and my conclusion is similar, though I still don't have any ProResRaw info other than what's already released, so I haven't been able to try that out.

    It's a good camera, but recording on the Shogun, even the diminutive Shogun V, is pretty klunky. And sadly also required in order to use N-Log and 10-bit recording.


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    #12
    Senior Member Thomas Smet's Avatar
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    Since Atomos doesn't make LCD panels it was only a matter of time before somebody else grabbed those HDR capable panels to use in monitors.

    Cool to have options but if one doesn't have a camera capable of pumping out Braw what advantage does this provide over the Atomos? I still prefer Atomos for their color calibration of their displays and their experience and history of making good monitors. BMD doesn't exactly have a good track record of color accurate displays.

    When it comes to external raw recording at least Atoms and ProRes raw exists on camera out there. I have not heard of a single camera not from BMD with plans to support external raw recording. That could change in the future but right now today if one wants external raw you use Atomos and ProRes raw. If you want Braw then why on earth would you use an external monitor for that when the camera is already perfectly capable of internal raw. Atomos has a much more affordable monitor that doesn't include the recording stuff if you just need a good HDR monitor for a BMD camera.


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    #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Smet View Post
    When it comes to external raw recording at least Atoms and ProRes raw exists on camera out there. I have not heard of a single camera not from BMD with plans to support external raw recording. That could change in the future but right now today if one wants external raw you use Atomos and ProRes raw. If you want Braw then why on earth would you use an external monitor for that when the camera is already perfectly capable of internal raw. Atomos has a much more affordable monitor that doesn't include the recording stuff if you just need a good HDR monitor for a BMD camera.
    "Video Assist supports Blackmagic RAW recording from popular cameras such as Panasonic EVA1 and Canon C300 MK II."

    From the product page.


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    #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Smet View Post
    Since Atomos doesn't make LCD panels it was only a matter of time before somebody else grabbed those HDR capable panels to use in monitors.

    Cool to have options but if one doesn't have a camera capable of pumping out Braw what advantage does this provide over the Atomos? I still prefer Atomos for their color calibration of their displays and their experience and history of making good monitors. BMD doesn't exactly have a good track record of color accurate displays.
    In terms of monitoring, the Video Assist HDR has a brighter screen at 2500 nits vs. 1500 nits for the Atomos 7" panels or 1000 nits for the Atomos 5" panels. The Video Assist HDR panels also have a wider color space DCI P3 rather than Rec. 709 on most of the Atomos screens. The Shogun 7 does have a P3 color space but is priced higher ($1495) than the Blackmagic monitors. The Shogun 7 is supposed to eventually have additional features like multi-camera HD switching and recording (up to 4 video sources) that might justify the higher price, but these haven't been enabled yet.

    It seems like the new Blackmagic monitors may have a better build quality with a metal housing as opposed to the plastic housing of the Atomos monitors, but still manage to only end up weighing a few ounces more. The form factor of the 7" Video Assist is actually about an inch smaller in width than the Atomos 7" models, but 5" models are about the same size.

    The Video Assist HDR 5" has 12G SDI inputs and outputs which none of the Atomos 5" displays have, although it does cost $100 more than the Ninja V.

    What I am interested in is how the power consumption and battery life compares between the monitor, as the Atomos monitor/recorders are not especially power efficient. Unfortunately Blackmagic hasn't published any power consumption specs, so we might have to wait for real world reports to find this out.


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    #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by davedv View Post
    In terms of monitoring, the Video Assist HDR has a brighter screen at 2500 nits vs. 1500 nits for the Atomos 7" panels or 1000 nits for the Atomos 5" panels.
    Of course as soon as I say that, Atomos announces a firmware update for the Shogun 7 that boosts the peak brightness to 3000 nits:
    https://s3.amazonaws.com/atomos-web-...SHOGUN%207.pdf

    How they are able to change the screen brightness with a firmware update, I am not entirely sure. I suppose maybe the screen was always capable of this brightness level, but was artificially limited by the firmware before. The Shogun 7 clearly has a different LCD panel from the earlier 7" models since it supports DCI P3 color space whereas the earlier models were limited to Rec. 709 coverage. The Shogun 7 still comes in at a higher price point $1495 than the Blackmagic Video Assist HDR at $995.

    Atomos also dropped the price of their 5" Shinobi HDMI monitor from $399 to $299, and the 5" Shinobi SDI from $499 to $429. These are monitors only, without any recording features:
    https://www.atomos.com/press-release...nobi-pricedrop


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    #16
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    FYI, I saw that on this new monitor they went to Sony batteries.


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    #17
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    The 5" Video Assist also has 2 L-Series batteries compared to the 1 battery of the Atomos Ninja V . Useful for long recording. Both have fans so will be interesting to see how the noise compares. I like the new 7" model as an addition to my Ninja V for the XLR inputs so both my cameras can record UHD 60P 10bit to ProRes. A 5" with XLR and no SDI would suit me just fine.


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    #18
    Senior Member Thomas Smet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by davedv View Post
    In terms of monitoring, the Video Assist HDR has a brighter screen at 2500 nits vs. 1500 nits for the Atomos 7" panels or 1000 nits for the Atomos 5" panels. The Video Assist HDR panels also have a wider color space DCI P3 rather than Rec. 709 on most of the Atomos screens. The Shogun 7 does have a P3 color space but is priced higher ($1495) than the Blackmagic monitors. The Shogun 7 is supposed to eventually have additional features like multi-camera HD switching and recording (up to 4 video sources) that might justify the higher price, but these haven't been enabled yet.

    It seems like the new Blackmagic monitors may have a better build quality with a metal housing as opposed to the plastic housing of the Atomos monitors, but still manage to only end up weighing a few ounces more. The form factor of the 7" Video Assist is actually about an inch smaller in width than the Atomos 7" models, but 5" models are about the same size.

    The Video Assist HDR 5" has 12G SDI inputs and outputs which none of the Atomos 5" displays have, although it does cost $100 more than the Ninja V.

    What I am interested in is how the power consumption and battery life compares between the monitor, as the Atomos monitor/recorders are not especially power efficient. Unfortunately Blackmagic hasn't published any power consumption specs, so we might have to wait for real world reports to find this out.
    Yes from a spec perspective I get the brightness difference but that tells us nothing about color reproduction which BMD has typically been pretty horrible at. I believe the BMD also still has no calibration options. If one wants a color accurate display on set where the picture better represents what is actually shot I think Atomos may still have the edge but we will have to wait to actually see for sure. There are specs and then there is actually comparing monitors side by side to see how accurate they actually are.

    The Atomos also houses the SSD right inside the unit vs an external SSD via USBc cable. Kind of nice for some users. I agree the dual battery is nice however. I see this as a much tougher choice now. Ninja V is HDMI only but I only use HDMI and I don't really shoot HDR or p3 color yet. The BMD means using velcro to attach the SSD somewhere or investing in some yet to be designed cage for the monitor to house the SSD. I don't really trust ProRes HQ 4k to SD cards and SD cards fast enough cost a fortune vs SSD. By the time I invest in SD cards safe enough to record 4k flawlessly I have spent hundreds more than the Atomos.


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    #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Smet View Post
    Yes from a spec perspective I get the brightness difference but that tells us nothing about color reproduction which BMD has typically been pretty horrible at. I believe the BMD also still has no calibration options. If one wants a color accurate display on set where the picture better represents what is actually shot I think Atomos may still have the edge but we will have to wait to actually see for sure. There are specs and then there is actually comparing monitors side by side to see how accurate they actually are.

    The Atomos also houses the SSD right inside the unit vs an external SSD via USBc cable. Kind of nice for some users. I agree the dual battery is nice however. I see this as a much tougher choice now. Ninja V is HDMI only but I only use HDMI and I don't really shoot HDR or p3 color yet. The BMD means using velcro to attach the SSD somewhere or investing in some yet to be designed cage for the monitor to house the SSD. I don't really trust ProRes HQ 4k to SD cards and SD cards fast enough cost a fortune vs SSD. By the time I invest in SD cards safe enough to record 4k flawlessly I have spent hundreds more than the Atomos.
    They're saying it offers 100% of P3. Which is a pretty serious spec. I wonder if it'll correlate to an accurate (as far as 2500 Nit screens can be) colour reproduction.

    Has anyone heard whether there's confirmation of SDI/HDMI cross-conversion on these? The inability of the Ninja to convert it's HDMI signal to the SDI ports on the SDI module, makes it only half useful to me. If this can do both, then I'll be picking a couple of them up.

    Also, can it display 17:9 images in full? The Ninja V's cropped display of DCI images is a nightmare.


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    #20
    Senior Member Thomas Smet's Avatar
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    The BMD apparently has a 135 degree viewing angle. Isn't that typically a TFT panel then? I also do not believe they have fine RGB tools for tweaking the look of the display. So what you get is what you get. If the color shifts over time you are SOL.

    I will definitely be waiting for some color accuracy critical reviewers to test this out before buying. I was super excited to get the original VA until I found out how inaccurate the color was. I'm not just investing in an external recorder here but as accurate of a display as I can afford. I also want to be able to adjust that display either via settings or with a Spyder type device to calibrate.


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