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    Quote Originally Posted by Donny 123 View Post
    But how is it for battery and hand held..EVF ? wireless monitor set up . I would never have play back ability as one of the main factors that I would judge a camera by personally .. sorry another Boomer
    Quite right.
    Sam and I could never agree on the best camera because our expectations and needs are so far apart. He regularly brings up playback, AF, and weight as being very important. Three things that are right at the bottom of my list of priorities. In 35+ years in this business I can count the number of times on one hand that a client wanted to see playback. It's just not done in any of the circles I have worked in. I wonder why frequent playback would be necessary? And why is setting up a one-touch last clip playback not fast enough? What is better than that on the BM cameras?


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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Jensen View Post
    In 35+ years in this business I can count the number of times on one hand that a client wanted to see playback. It's just not done in any of the circles I have worked in. I wonder why frequent playback would be necessary? And why is setting up a one-touch last clip playback not fast enough? What is better than that on the BM cameras?
    My first job, after tea-boy, on a film set was Playback Operator. It's not a feature you need in the ENG or doco world but commercial clients expect a good playback set-up. Of course, on larger sets, it's handled by Video Village via a wireless link. Also, on larger sets, you wouldn't be using a BM pocket, so I'm not really helping LOL.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug Jensen View Post
    Quite right.
    Sam and I could never agree on the best camera because our expectations and needs are so far apart. He regularly brings up playback, AF, and weight as being very important. Three things that are right at the bottom of my list of priorities. In 35+ years in this business I can count the number of times on one hand that a client wanted to see playback. It's just not done in any of the circles I have worked in. I wonder why frequent playback would be necessary? And why is setting up a one-touch last clip playback not fast enough? What is better than that on the BM cameras?
    Im shooting mostly corporate stuff now ,and small crew "commercials " with a very small C.. for company websites and screens in shops, and there back of airplane seats !.. being asked for playback is very seldom .. its usually just to check "actors" continuity, as we have forgotten where they where standing , or I want to show the director some great shot ,in my eyes anyway, to impress them..slo mo is good for easily impressing clients .. they have wirless monitors (what a great invention ) but playing back all day would be a total pain..and at some stage I would refuse ..


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    Quote Originally Posted by Donny 123 View Post
    Im shooting mostly corporate stuff now ,and small crew "commercials " with a very small C.. for company websites and screens in shops, and there back of airplane seats !.. being asked for playback is very seldom .. its usually just to check "actors" continuity, as we have forgotten where they where standing , or I want to show the director some great shot ,in my eyes anyway, to impress them..slo mo is good for easily impressing clients .. they have wirless monitors (what a great invention ) but playing back all day would be a total pain..and at some stage I would refuse ..
    Yes, all shoots are different... but I certainly wouldn't characterize corporate work as not needing playback. I haven't been asked for playback since... well I guess it was last week. And after doing two takes the CEO (and PR person) wanted to see not the last take but the first one - since they didn't like the second one and wanted to make sure the first was ok. (and like many CEO's, they were ready to be finished before they walked in the room...)

    But seriously... when a client says "can we look at an answer from the middle of this morning's interview?" do you really want to be the one rolling their eyes and saying it's a major pain and it's going to take forever to cue up? or do you want to be the one who can get to it quickly and efficiently? I know that I may not need to do playback on every shoot, but providing it quickly on demand is just good client service. (it's also one of the reasons I make sure there's excellent audio coming into the camera even if the sound person is recording the 'master audio' on his mixer/recorder - since listening to camera mic scratch tracks is not an acceptable option -- and that my client monitor has decent speakers.) Sure it's only needed on 10% - 20% of my shoots -- but I'd never downplay the need for convenient playback.


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    Quote Originally Posted by morgan_moore View Post
    Doug
    My sharp response was lead by your apparent dismissal of the BM without apparent logic or personal experience
    You're right, so I took a quick look at the manual for the Ursa. Please correct me if I have gotten anything wrong, which is entirely possible.
    Some random thoughts.

    ProRes for the codec? For acquisition in 2019?
    Only two channels of audio
    Only 1 SDI
    No method of customizing info shown the VF.
    No methods of setting up custom clip naming.
    No paint menus at all for WYSIWYG shooting.
    No Scene Files
    Not sure about All Files.
    No timecode in/out
    VF seems to me an extra accessory that must be purchased.
    Zebras may not offer necessary customization (not sure)
    Not sure if it has markers or if they would be customizable.
    No User Box
    No User Menu
    Shutter speed mode is available in angles only?
    Sensitivity mode is available in ISO only?
    I don't see any assignable buttons?
    No way to display the clip file name in the VF
    No White Balance Set button
    Can only choose a WB preset
    No WB memory switch
    No shockless WB
    No GPS
    No streaming or wireless capabilities
    No HDMI ??
    No menus for customizing AF performance
    No Variable ND
    No d-tap or other power output.
    Relay recording?
    No external WB or Gain toggle switches.
    Not sure about external audio controls, does it have any?
    Touch screen interface?? Yuck!

    That's just what I noticed in the first few minutes. I'm sure a deeper dive would reveal more missing functionality. And to make matters worse, I don't see anything the camera offers that I could say "hyy, I wish my Sony had that!".
    I may have gotten a few things wrong, but overall, this camera looks like a glorified DSLR and sems to be to be aimed at that type of shooter.
    This is not a competitor to Sony's pro cinema or ENG cameras.
    Just my opinion.
    Last edited by Doug Jensen; 11-28-2019 at 07:24 AM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by OnSet View Post
    I know that I may not need to do playback on every shoot, but providing it quickly on demand is just good client service. k.
    So, when playback is necessary, what is the problem with the Sony interface and what makes other cameras (which ones?) better at this task when it is needed? Sam was saying the Sony's are lacking in some way for playback, which is what brought this topic up. You can either use the assign button for one-touch playback of the last clip or dive into the thumbnails and select the one you want. What is the big deal? What specifically is the problem?


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    CVP just posted their FX9 review

    https://youtu.be/2-kYtjH3eEs


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    I've seen some absolutely amazing footage from the Ursa Mini Pros. They seem like a great value but the horror stories about build quality, reliability and service issues have kept me away.
    Also many of my clients have probably never heard of the brand so it would be a tough sell on many jobs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OnSet View Post
    "can we look at an answer from the middle of this morning's interview?"
    I always dual record in those sorts of situations with an Atomos recorder where I can very rapidly with the slider cue up to the necessary takes on the monitor. Very quickly done if you have a PA logging time code and notes on each take. The audio coming from the sound op is going into the camera so the Atomos has good quality audio playback on headphones. Or or if required the Atomos can feed a small set of clip together Sony speakers I have in the kit if a couple of people need to listen at the same time. Avoids all the faffing around trying to cue up cards in cameras. Hate cuing up cameras in the field for playback. Especially cameras like the FS7 that don't have external volume controls for playback or monitoring. Though I overcome that issue for monitoring by using an inline volume control between the camera headphone output and the headphone jack.

    Chris Young


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    Going through a shot on an Atomos or a BM camera is fantastic with finger scroll on the monitor. The FS7 far less so with its clunky L-R buttons. Having a monitor that art department can go back 15 shots and check continuity while you are changing set ups even better. Atomos and playback have been a huge boon for other departments to see stuff, even send shots and screenshots to end clients without involving touching the camera is super fantastic. Ive just aquired a 24in monitor and am experimenting with rigging with my old hyperdeck shuttle so that all of that can happen while my atomos may do other duties like recording my GH4 in 10 bit. Many of my shoots are about servicing the director, art department and a 'big cheese' offsite. I offer something that is getting close to 'the real deal'. I also have an animom wireless to feed all of this via a focus puller on my 502 monitor - the puller is using a remote focus.
    This line makes for some horrific camera setups in terms of power and wiring.
    Dont share.. many people had input on thishttps://vimeo.com/366309749/7aed962369
    This is not dougs world (no qualitive statement there - each world has value)

    My next shoot is car based, we have FS7 on Movi, BM pocket on vehicle hard mounts, and an unselected camera doing shoulder.
    We would be best with three 'FX6' sized cameras (or smaller), the shoulder version being beefed up with a VLock.

    Getting all three wireless to the director would cost a fortune!
    Last edited by morgan_moore; 11-28-2019 at 08:19 AM.


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