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    #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by puredrifting View Post
    So image quality = porn? ;- .
    Just to stay on topic.

    Raw-Talent-9780879756253.jpg


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    #82
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    The terms RAW & COOKED have used since the beginning of data processing, e.g. raw & cooked keyboard and mouse events (manual from the 80's Amiga computer): https://wiki.amigaos.net/wiki/Intuit...Output_Methods

    Red really does get credit for the marketing term RAW (all caps + pushing wavelets more than anyone else) even though it's an ancient term that was used long before Red existed (wavelets were already mature when Red started (JPEG2000, Cineform)).

    Regarding Canon vs. ARRI as to why one camera looks better than another: emotion. The Venice evokes emotion too, though it's different than ARRI. Canon can too, it's just not as strong (and Canon can be matched to ARRI fairly closely in post and vice versa; same is true for Venice (color charts are helpful)).


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    #83
    Senior Member Eric Coughlin's Avatar
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    I was talking to a friend who did lighting on Bad Boys III recently here in Atlanta; he said the DP liked the Sony Venice which was being used on it but everyone else hated it, such as the DIT who said it had issues with color.


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    #84
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    Let's see the color issues?

    Looks pretty good here:


    I dig this look more than anything I've seen on the C700 FF.


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    #85
    Senior Member Eric Coughlin's Avatar
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    Posting a single already graded sample video doesn't say much. From a DIT's perspective, being able to get good colors out of a camera is often not as much of a concern as how easy/difficult it is to get good colors out of a camera, particularly when dealing with a wide variety of challenging lighting situations, over exposure, underexposure, improper white balance or lighting colors on set, etc.

    I'm sure Bad Boys III will look good in the end, but at what cost.

    And to reiterate, I'm not exactly putting down the Sony Venice; I'm more so repeating something someone said. I've gathered that the functionality and ease of use from the camera was another issue people didn't like about it, but the guy I talked to didn't elaborate that much on other issues aside from saying everyone hated it except the DP, and the DIT's comments on the camera. I've personally liked the footage I've seen from it, while still preferring the Arri look. Let's keep in mind that the Sony F35 was often regarded as having the best 1080p image out there, but failed as a camera due to ergonomics and workflow.

    And yeah, any high end camera looks better than C700 FF cause the C700 is an over-sized and over-priced mid-range camera. ;P
    Last edited by Eric Coughlin; 08-28-2019 at 09:47 PM.


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    #86
    Senior Member Jaime Valles's Avatar
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    SO much hate for the C700FF around here! I haven't used it (way out of my budget) but the stuff I've seen from it looks great. I mean, I look at this clip and I don't see how it would look much better on a Monstro, Alexa or Venice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Auo65k6Jsb4
    Jaime Vallés
    AJV Media
    Video, Photography & Graphic Design: www.ajvmedia.com


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    #87
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    A Ferrari being better than a Porsche doesn't diminish the Porsche. The Ferrari costs more.

    C700FF is a full frame 6K => 4K ~C300 II (I shot and graded both). Both cameras look good. Venice & Alexa look better (and cost more).

    @Jaime- the linked YouTube video didn't seem like a good example of the C700FF (could be lenses, lighting, grading etc.).

    @Eric- I've seen bad ARRI footage though I haven't yet seen bad Venice footage (I'm sure it exists- any camera can have a bad day), do you have examples of bad Venice footage?

    According to Luc Besson's DP for Lucy, Hollywood didn't like the F65 because of its physical size/shape!
    Last edited by jcs; 08-28-2019 at 10:08 PM.


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    #88
    Senior Member Eric Coughlin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jcs View Post
    @Eric- I've seen bad ARRI footage though I haven't yet seen bad Venice footage (I'm sure it exists- any camera can have a bad day), do you have examples of bad Venice footage?
    Not sure what your point is. Obviously anyone could make bad footage with any camera. A lack of poor quality footage online is just an indication that unskilled shooters have yet to get their hands on a camera and upload footage of it.

    Again, I wasn't saying the Venice looks bad. I was just saying that some DIT on a big budget movie apparently said he wasn't happy with dealing with the colors he was getting from the camera, regardless of if he and the colorist eventually get it to look good before releasing it in theaters.

    I'm just the messenger here.

    Yeah, I thought Lucy and Oblivion looked great. Interestingly, though, I seem to recall Sony indicating something like the Venice, though newer, being considered a step below the F65, though the ergonomics of the Venice would be why it'd be more adopted to current productions.
    Last edited by Eric Coughlin; 08-28-2019 at 10:29 PM.


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    #89
    Senior Member James0b57's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris f View Post
    I did make it and feel free to use it (today was an edit day which meant that I was looking for any opportunity to not edit....)

    I'm curious as to why Canon is even bothering with the C500MKII, with the FS-7 getting long in the tooth it seems like they could knock it out of the park with a C300MKIII and try to take a big chunk of that market. I shoot all of my stuff on my C200s but most of the inquiries I get for camera crew are for shows that's shooting on a FS-7 or a C300MKII. It seems for the middle part of the curve popularity/common availability plays just as big of a role as specs (if not more) - especially for multi-cam stuff.
    Thanks!

    Yeah, and so true about popular models. Tough to know when to buy in sometimes. Fs7, C300I&II, F55 were all those cameras that just keep hauling.


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    #90
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    " syncable timecode (C200 plea) "
    I wonder if a firmware tweak/mode could funnel audio in LTC to be embedded.
    (The necessary Canon mindset achilles heel/product protection being only 1 audio track for mic reference)
    I also wonder about cam companies underestimating the user value of offering feature upgrade/expansion "modules" to users who have already accessorized (cages etc) within a given model.


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